Israel in the Gaza Strip

[lucas]

I wonder if you will allow the Zionists (say Ben-Gurion or Netenaya) to express an opinion. Probably.

Fine with me. It will be about as balanced as Chomsky's views on American Presidents post 1945.

I don't think this is off topic. What I think is off topic is being forced to read screeds of emotional comment about the Daily News. Which I have already read.

 

[GumbyLearner]

Fine with me. It will be about as balanced as Chomsky's views on American Presidents post 1945.

I don't think this is off topic. What I think is off topic is being forced to read screeds of emotional comment about the Daily News. Which I have already read.

Agreed Lucas.

Chomsky, the battler's battler. Who learned how to communicate with the workers on the building sites, the wharves, the workshops..to give their linguisitical failings some voice in the form of admitting to RELATIVELY nothing!

What a champ for the poor and down-and-out.

 

[mayk]

Agreed Lucas.

Chomsky the battler's battler. Who learned how to communicate with the workers on the building sites, the wharves, the workshops..to give their linguisitical failings some voice in the form of admitting to RELATIVELY nothing!

What a champ for the poor and down-and-out.

We can have a separate thread on Noam Chomsky bashing .

 

[GumbyLearner]

We can have a separate thread on Noam Chomsky bashing .

Noam Chomsky is the one king of academic elitist ideas that I disagree with 100%. He is someone who will tell you there are no moral absolutes! Well, I would like to ask him if he is ABSOLUTELY sure?

 

[mayk]

Noam Chomsky is the king of academic elitist that I diagree with 100%. He is someone who will tell you there are no moral absolutes! Well, I would like to ask him if he is ABSOLUTELY sure?

On all aspects or just on morality?

 

[lucas]

I admit to having been churlish about your bringing Chomsky up. Sorry.

It's just he always turns up. And he's really quite way out there. As is Vidal.

Meanwhile it's bloody hot here in Sydney and I feel foul.

Do you think that we would all behave as they who inhabit those (literal) hot spots - simply because of relentless heat?

And what of that theory that these world trouble spots are geographically determined - some sort of psychic conglomeration of trouble. Anyone have a link to that? I'd like to read more about it. I think it was a scientific offering, not completely barmy.

 

[GumbyLearner]

On all aspects or just on morality?

Think about it!

 

[mayk]

Think about it!

, I get your point. He is quite controversial, and I don't agree with him 100%, but I don't 100% disagree with him either.

Lets move on to Gaza.

 

[Buddy]

Fine with me. It will be about as balanced as Chomsky's views on American Presidents post 1945.

I don't think this is off topic. What I think is off topic is being forced to read screeds of emotional comment about the Daily News. Which I have already read.

Well, for what's worth IMO you're :topic .
I thought this was an interesting thread reading views about "Israel in the Gaza" but no more. As far as I'm concerned reading about what you think of Chomsky is irrelevant. Who cares?

How about....is Israel being an expanionist colonialist by entering Gaza or are they simply defending themselves? And....Do the Palestinians have any right to property ownership in the land purchased by the Zionists (say from the late 1800's on) or taken (say post WW2) or has that right been legitimately expunged. And..... Why are not the Palestinians permitted to leave Gaza and settle in other Arab nations (say Jordan or Syria). And why doesn't Israel have a constitution, and if they did would it change the plight of the original Palestinians who used to live there (some maybe still alive but the children and grandchildren certainly are)? Eh?

These are more important issues than arguing about some aging lefty.

 

[trading_rookie]

Wow, this thread really has gone off topic. Now you're arguing about who is allowed to have a valid opinion or something to say on the matter. I wonder if you will allow the Zionists (say Ben-Gurion or Netenaya) to express an opinion. Probably.

Though it may appear that way, it’s not the case. My point was what makes him supposedly the scholars scholar on the Israeli/Palestinian conflict – the fact that he happens to be Jewish? If he were a Palestinian who was born and raised in Auburn, Sydney I’d ask a similar question.

I wonder if you will allow the Zionists (say Ben-Gurion or Netenaya) to express opinion. Probably.

You’re welcome to read my post on page 36 – doubt it’s pro-zionist or pro-arab…

Mate if you don't know Noam Chomsky views, why don't read them? His views are well respected all around the world. He is not much liked in conservative America for his views. But I find them quite interesting.

I’ll pass, too many scholars, too many ego’s ;-)

Do you think that we would all behave as they who inhabit those (literal) hot spots - simply because of relentless heat?

That’s racism !!!!!

 

[rowie]

The point is, he knows how religion can be used by people for political gains, and the young impressionable minds are most susceptible to such aggression.

Mate if you don't know Noam Chomsky views, why don't read them? His views are well respected all around the world. He is not much liked in conservative America for his views. But I find them quite interesting.

A good intellectual always propose solutions, which he has done many times and debated such solutions. An example of that I posted earlier.

I think this thread has gone off topic, so I will stop posting about Noam...

Mayk, no point trying to convince these numb nuts that Noam Chomskys opinions matter. He will be promptly written off as a leftie, commy etc even though he is one of the most respected people on earth when it comes to political analysis in particular US imperialism. Apparently you have to live in the middle east and not be an academic to have a valid opinion. Well and truly a bunch of numb nuts on this thread.

 

[GumbyLearner]

Well, for what's worth IMO you're :topic .
I thought this was an interesting thread reading views about "Israel in the Gaza" but no more. As far as I'm concerned reading about what you think of Chomsky is irrelevant. Who cares?

How about....is Israel being an expanionist colonialist by entering Gaza or are they simply defending themselves? And....Do the Palestinians have any right to property ownership in the land purchased by the Zionists (say from the late 1800's on) or taken (say post WW2) or has that right been legitimately expunged. And..... Why are not the Palestinians permitted to leave Gaza and settle in other Arab nations (say Jordan or Syria). And why doesn't Israel have a constitution, and if they did would it change the plight of the original Palestinians who used to live there (some maybe still alive but the children and grandchildren certainly are)? Eh?

These are more important issues than arguing about some aging lefty.

I agree Buddy, no more talk of Chomsky or his believe in relativism as a justification for anarchy.

 

[lucas]

Buddy, come on - I agree that what I have to say about the aging lefty is of no consequence but what he says resonates with many. And he has stacks to say about this very issue.

So IMO, it's on topic. But I think the thread has probably said as much as it can ever say and I'm going to move on...

Thanks. Bye.

(and rowie, please grow a brain at some time in the future...)

 

[rowie]

Though it may appear that way, it’s not the case. My point was what makes him supposedly the scholars scholar on the Israeli/Palestinian conflict – the fact that he happens to be Jewish? If he were a Palestinian who was born and raised in Auburn, Sydney I’d ask a similar question.


You’re welcome to read my post on page 36 – doubt it’s pro-zionist or pro-arab…



I’ll pass, too many scholars, too many ego’s ;-)


That’s racism !!!!!

Pass on Chomsky fine but then dont question his credentials. You should at the least know what he is on about before you pass sweeping generalisations and judgement based on him being an egotistical scholar.

 

[trading_rookie]

Apparently you have to live in the middle east and not be an academic to have a valid opinion. Well and truly a bunch of numb nuts on this thread.

...and I guess one has to be a numb nut to take the comments out of context.

 

[GumbyLearner]

You should at the least know what he is on about before you pass sweeping generalisations and judgement based on him being an egotistical scholar.

Just happy to return the favour.

 

[rowie]

Just happy to return the favour.

Thanks.

 

[disarray]

I disagree, the main issue is land. Religion is used as an excuse on both sides.

The problem is within the minority radical elements of both religions, rather than the religions themselves

What I find strange is that the Jews and Muslims have allot beliefs, that are all most the same, yet they can't live side by side.

This is an important point. Its easy to view the conflict as every Palestinian being a rampant, militant, rocket launching, Jew hating fanatic - but given peaceful conditions the majority of people are typically happy to live in peace

What makes anyone think that this has anything to do with religion!!!??? The reality is that almost all religions (including Islam and Judism) teach tolerance and compassion for other people. If people lived by their religion and practiced what their ancestors learned before them (killing, theft, greed etc lead to social breakdown), then this carnage we are seeing might be avoided.

i think you guys are unaware of the nature of islam and think its "just another religion" like buddhism or christianity or what have you where people just pray to god and thats it. it's not, islam is a complete social system which tells you what to believe, how to behave, and what extreme punishments are applicable for those who deviate from the path.

please take the time to read Islam 101 which explains a great deal about the history and nature of the religion. put simply, there may be moderate muslims but there is NO moderate islam. it is of the utmost importance for western civilisation to refuse to tolerate or accept this objectionable philosophy, which ranks right up there with nazism and other totalitarian social systems that deny and actively denounce the fundamental human freedoms we consider central to our society.

from the above link -

As we have seen, contrary to the widespread insistence that true Islam is pacific even if a handful of its adherents are violent, the Islamic sources make clear that engaging in violence against non-Muslims is a central and indispensable principle to Islam. Islam is less a personal faith than a political ideology that exists in a fundamental and permanent state of war with non-Islamic civilizations, cultures, and individuals. The Islamic holy texts outline a social, governmental, and economic system for all mankind. Those cultures and individuals who do not submit to Islamic governance exist in an ipso facto state of rebellion with Allah and must be forcibly brought into submission. The misbegotten term "Islamo-fascism" is wholly redundant: Islam itself is a kind of fascism that achieves its full and proper form only when it assumes the powers of the state.

The spectacular acts of Islamic terrorism in the late 20th and early 21st centuries are but the most recent manifestation of a global war of conquest that Islam has been waging since the days of the Prophet Muhammad in the 7th Century AD and that continues apace today. This is the simple, glaring truth that is staring the world today in the face -- and which has stared it in the face numerous times in the past -- but which it seems few today are willing to contemplate.

 

[mayk]

i think you guys are unaware of the nature of islam and think its "just another religion" like buddhism or christianity or what have you where people just pray to god and thats it. it's not, islam is a complete social system which tells you what to believe, how to behave, and what extreme punishments are applicable for those who deviate from the path.

I am really terrified . I was blinded by those lefties. ...

I think you missed religion 101. Please go and study that first.

 

[disarray]

so you didn't even read the essay which references the islamic sources, but instead you post some smartass comment that (presumably) all religions are good or something like that? like the aztecs? or the norse? because religious human sacrifice is a very pious and uplifting thing