Islam: Is it inherently Evil?

[SirRumpole]

Muslims have been here for generations. I went to schools with some of them... and suddenly they're all terrorists. Suddenly their religion will make them criminal and violent. Come on.

No one is saying they are ALL terrorists, but they ALL follow an ideology that is causing terrorism around the world.

It's not rocket science to realise that the more Muslims there are , the more likely it is that the destructive ideology will spread.

 

[Value Collector]

.

If Muslims are causing problems, .

Are they though?

if there was a few christians causing trouble would you tar all christians with the same brush?

Thats one of the problems, people are happy to concede the views and actions of some christians don't represent all christians, but when it comes to muslims, they all get put in the same basket.

 

[SirRumpole]

Are they though?

Of course some of them are.

http://www.news.com.au/national/cri...d/news-story/86fc734df0963e21fe038c0eecce7d80

I believe in being nice to and networking with with moderate Muslims to prevent attacks, but the simple fact is that the more Muslims there are in this country the more attacks there are likely to be and the harder prevention becomes.

 

[noco]

Of course some of them are.

http://www.news.com.au/national/cri...d/news-story/86fc734df0963e21fe038c0eecce7d80

I believe in being nice to and networking with with moderate Muslims to prevent attacks, but the simple fact is that the more Muslims there are in this country the more attacks there are likely to be and the harder prevention becomes.

Rumpy, haven't been saying for years........The more Muslims we have the bigger muscles they get.

 

[Value Collector]

Of course some of them are.

.

What percentage of muslims are likely to commit acts of violence in this country?

 

[SirRumpole]

What percentage of muslims are likely to commit acts of violence in this country?

Who knows ?

The stronger their numbers are the more likely they will commit terrorist acts.

You have read about Belgium ?

 

[Value Collector]

Who knows ?

Well considering the large number of muslims here, and the very very very small number of terror attacks, wouldn't you say the number is very very very small.

Maybe even less than 0.001%?

So that means that 99.999% of muslims will never commit a terror attack, don't you think bringing in unfair rules against those 99.999% is likely to cause a bunch of them to feel we are being aggressive to them, I think there is much more danger in oppressing the 99.999% for the sake of the 0.0001%, I mean if banning the burqa and treating them like foreigners turns the 0.001% into a 0.005% thats a huge increase caused by us.

 

[Value Collector]

Rumpy, haven't been saying for years........The more Muslims we have the bigger muscles they get.

In the last 10 years, what has killed more Australians?

Islamic Terrorism or Alcohol fuelled violence and drink driving?
Considering muslims don't drink, maybe increasing the number of muslims in the population makes us safer.

 

[luutzu]

Rumpy, haven't been saying for years........The more Muslims we have the bigger muscles they get.

In the real world, terrorism doesn't work that way.

First, if "their numbers" get out of control, they'll vote and the Australian gov't will listen and obey. Just like how all democracies around the world do and implement whatever policies the majority of its people wanted. Right?

So when the gov't do the Muslim's bidding, that kind of terrorism is no longer "terrorism", but are Freedom something or other.

That and terrorists tend not to have Mosques and Town Hall meetings discussing Allah and death to infidels. They tend to either be professional terrorist working in cells like that of 9/11. Or they are just some lone and crazed loonies with criminal records, no hope, hitting the dead end and thought to take it upon themselves to go out for some "cause".

The more we, or our politician, or Trump, talk rubbish and do some blanket ban on all Muslims... i.e. all Muslims from those 7 countries are potential terrorists and there's no way we can tell who's what... that drive fear into the people, turn them against innocent people; alienate them and further inflame those idiots who want to commit crime and mass murder.

Try and understand this from our own war planners' perspective... That we being a Democracy where too much civil liberties and rights have been won; where the populous can protest peacefully, can vote and have their say... How do you get around that and go on foreign adventures at their expense?

Easy. You drive the fear of Arabs, Allah into them; you whistles Christian value, our value against their barbarity etc. etc. And if there's blowback? That's just more proof of the need to wage some 7 wars on "them"; proof that privacy, legal principle of innocent until proven guilty... those too must be sacrificed for freedom and liberty.

Every country and regime and gov't does these kind of thing. We aren't the exception.

 

[luutzu]

In the last 10 years, what has killed more Australians?

Islamic Terrorism or Alcohol fuelled violence and drink driving?
Considering muslims don't drink, maybe increasing the number of muslims in the population makes us safer.

If we rank the causes of death in Australia and put anywhere near the amount of funding and effort into preventing them, we'd save tens of thousands of lives a year.

Heard that in the US, there's some 20,000+ suicides a year. A fraction of the money they spent on anti-terrorism to provide counselling or community outreach or just informing family and friends of the issue so they can be aware if their family member need help... I bet a lot of those death could be prevented.

 

[Value Collector]

If we rank the causes of death in Australia and put anywhere near the amount of funding and effort into preventing them, we'd save tens of thousands of lives a year.

Heard that in the US, there's some 20,000+ suicides a year. A fraction of the money they spent on anti-terrorism to provide counselling or community outreach or just informing family and friends of the issue so they can be aware if their family member need help... I bet a lot of those death could be prevented.

2996 Innocent people died in the world trade centre terrorist attack.

That same year in the USA, 2932 innocent people died due to drunk drivers.

People call to Ban Muslim immigrants, due to "terrorism risk", but I have never heard of anyone calling to ban Australian, British, Irish or German immigrants due to "Drinking culture" associated with those countries and the added risk of drinking related deaths they would bring with them.

 

[SirRumpole]

2996 Innocent people died in the world trade centre terrorist attack.

That same year in the USA, 2932 innocent people died due to drunk drivers.

Both terrorism and drink driving can be reduced. You can take licenses away from drink drivers and lock them up and you can keep out people who swear allegiance to a violent ideology.

 

[Value Collector]

Both terrorism and drink driving can be reduced. You can take licenses away from drink drivers and lock them up and you can keep out people who swear allegiance to a violent ideology.

Big difference.

By "taking licenses away from drink drivers and locking them up", you are targeting the people that are committing the crimes, I totally agree with that.

By "Targeting muslims in general" you are not targeting the criminals, you are targeting an entire group, so its more like targeting drinkers in general or people from drinking cultures, rather than the actual drink drivers.

You must be able to see the difference, you are choosing to allow drinkers to have all their rights until they breach the law, where as you are happy to reduce the rights of the muslims before they have broken the law.

it would be like banning people of British decent from driving or going out on weekends because they are from a drinking culture, that inspires violence or risky behaviour.

Most muslims don't "swear allegiance to a violent ideology",

 

[noco]

In the last 10 years, what has killed more Australians?

Islamic Terrorism or Alcohol fuelled violence and drink driving?
Considering muslims don't drink, maybe increasing the number of muslims in the population makes us safer.

Even one terror attack is one too many......86 Australians killed in Bali.....86 good living people who should still be alive and enjoying life today.

Increasing the number of Muslims, you must be joking.......Right wing organizations cannot have a meeting without the demonstrations and disruption by Muslim groups.......Violence often eventuates and police and civilians get hurt and if they live in Victoria these hoods are protected by the that dumb a$$ Daniel Andrews......There was a recent case in Melbourne where this guy was attacked by a group of Muslims.....Somebody rang the police 15 times and non turned up.

 

[SirRumpole]

You must be able to see the difference, you are choosing to allow drinkers to have all their rights until they breach the law, where as you are happy to reduce the rights of the muslims before they have broken the law.

Actually the pub lockout laws have dramatically reduced the number of alcohol related assaults in the area where they operate.

http://www.bocsar.nsw.gov.au/Pages/bocsar_pages/Alcohol_Related_Violence.aspx

Is this a reduction of drinkers rights ?

2/3 of the public want the laws to stay.

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/lockouts-...idents-want-laws-to-stay-20160220-gmz5ra.html

 

[Value Collector]

Even one terror attack is one too many......86 Australians killed in Bali.....86 good living people who should still be alive and enjoying life today.

Even one alcohol fuelled violent act or one drink driving incident leading to the death of an innocent is to many.

Alcohol is the 8th biggest killer of under 25's, over 5500 alcohol related deaths happen each year in Australia.

Trust me, our drinking culture is a bigger threat to your friends and family than Islam.

Allowing more Brits, Irish,Belgians and Germans into the country increases this drinking culture, they should be banned, innocents are dying.

See how silly that is? thats basically what you are saying about islam, except islam is a smaller threat.

 

[Value Collector]

Actually the pub lockout laws have dramatically reduced the number of alcohol related assaults in the area where they operate.

Is this a reduction of drinkers rights ?

2/3 of the public want the laws to stay.

Thats a direct action to a known problem, it's very different, if Islamic terror attacks were as common as alcohol violence, I might agree with more stricter rules, but they aren't.

Notice no one is calling for drinkers in general to be banned, If you are happy for a drinker to migrate here when you know there is a chance he could take someones life via drink driving or alcohol violence, but you don't want a muslim to come here because you are worried about terrorist attacks, thats an irrational fear.

 

[SirRumpole]

Thats a direct action to a known problem, it's very different, if Islamic terror attacks were as common as alcohol violence, I might agree with more stricter rules, but they aren't.

Notice no one is calling for drinkers in general to be banned, If you are happy for a drinker to migrate here when you know there is a chance he could take someones life via drink driving or alcohol violence, but you don't want a muslim to come here because you are worried about terrorist attacks, thats an irrational fear.

6% of the Belgian population is Muslim, now they are a breeding ground for international terrorism.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...came-breeding-ground-international-terrorists

Don't let it happen here.

 

[luutzu]

2996 Innocent people died in the world trade centre terrorist attack.

That same year in the USA, 2932 innocent people died due to drunk drivers.

People call to Ban Muslim immigrants, due to "terrorism risk", but I have never heard of anyone calling to ban Australian, British, Irish or German immigrants due to "Drinking culture" associated with those countries and the added risk of drinking related deaths they would bring with them.

Looking back on it, the thing about the response to that attack by Bush and co was just horrifying. It's not just the wars that it led to, but the domestic security ramp-up.

I was clued to the TV then and remember that it seem like the US didn't have any intelligence agencies or security checks at all. That anyone can just walk in and attack it.

So what follow, beside the wars, was billions and trillions of dollars going towards security, surveillance like the country never had any before.

Maybe that's fair enough if it's for actual security, to actually protect and save lives right?

But then you see their responds to those First Responders to 9/11. How they got sick, got cancer and the politicians just cast them aside like they're pestering their important work. Asking volunteers to prove their cancer weren't pre-existing conditions; that they're not a terrorist. It's just shocking.

Then look at the city of Flint poisoned water crisis. Thousands of kids are lead poisoned; their healthy parents got sick... and what did the City do? They could spend some $50M to $200M to replace the rusted and fungal invested pipes.. .instead all they did was give each family a water filter, a carton of water a week, and only deduct what they estimate to be the amount of water drank from the water bill.

Who does that? To their own people.

Then there's a recent report of some 3000+ cities across the US with higher level of lead. So far haven't heard anything is being done about it.

It's hard to convince people their safety is the gov't number one priority when they see these kind of things happening to them.

No wonder half the country don't vote.

 

[noco]

Big difference.

By "taking licenses away from drink drivers and locking them up", you are targeting the people that are committing the crimes, I totally agree with that.

By "Targeting muslims in general" you are not targeting the criminals, you are targeting an entire group, so its more like targeting drinkers in general or people from drinking cultures, rather than the actual drink drivers.

You must be able to see the difference, you are choosing to allow drinkers to have all their rights until they breach the law, where as you are happy to reduce the rights of the muslims before they have broken the law.

it would be like banning people of British decent from driving or going out on weekends because they are from a drinking culture, that inspires violence or risky behaviour.

Most muslims don't "swear allegiance to a violent ideology",

And they would never swear allegiance to the Queen or country.

The majority of deaths relating to alcohol are self inflicted and if they drink and drive they are breaking the law and invariably get caught and pay the price.

But almost every day Muslims break the law with unlawful demonstrations and rioting and very little is done until it is too late....They get away with far too much in my opinion.

We accept them into our country, give them the world and they just simply abuse that privilage.

"tis a great way of saying thanks to us Aussies.