Asylum immigrants - Green Light

[startrader]

Another two boats arrive - 12 boats so far this month. I'm sure all Australians must love our open border policy and the way we encourage these people to set sail for Australia. It's well worth it though as look what's waiting for them at the other end of the trip.

What an absolute pathetic excuse for a government this lot is. It's beyond unbelievable - what a joke!

 

[sails]

Thread is just a political rant fest once again, xenophobic hysteria always sways votes one way or another. ....

You think it is just a political rant? How insulting do you have to be? Some of us actually care about this country and don't like the fact that we are being invaded by people who have little in the way of security checks.

You are clearly not in sync with the majority of voters in this country.

This is not political, it is about being concerned at the lack of border control. Just because Gillard and Rudd decided to abolish the Pacific Solution that actually worked and made it political all by themselves is something you should take up with them and not with the rest of us who would have preferred they gave bi-partisan support for something that clearly worked so well.

But NO. They decided they knew better - and what a disaster that has been.

This is one who made it political:

 

[sails]

Another two boats arrive - 12 boats so far this month. I'm sure all Australians must love our open border policy and the way we encourage these people to set sail for Australia. It's well worth it though as look what's waiting for them at the other end of the trip.

What an absolute pathetic excuse for a government this lot is. It's beyond unbelievable - what a joke!

And Gillard has made it political. She promised to stop the boats just before the last election. Another broken commitment. And she sits back and does nothing about these boats pouring in.

Abbott has offered bi-partisan support for humane offshore processing. We are being taken to the cleaners while Gillard seems uninterested.

 

[StumpyPhantom]

And Gillard has made it political. She promised to stop the boats just before the last election. Another broken commitment. And she sits back and does nothing about these boats pouring in.

Abbott has offered bi-partisan support for humane offshore processing. We are being taken to the cleaners while Gillard seems uninterested.

+1 Yep - spot on.

Gillard and Labor would rather re-write history. I watched your little 20 second shot on Gillard in Parliament whilst in oppostion, Sails.

Having said something like that, how far do you have to sell your soul to the Devil to have come up with the Malaysia Solution?

Let's not insult our collective intelligence anymore by calling this Malaysia Solution "compassionate". It is not! Take one step into Kuala Lumpur and you will know that.

What a disgrace.

 

[Julia]

You think it is just a political rant? How insulting do you have to be? Some of us actually care about this country and don't like the fact that we are being invaded by people who have little in the way of security checks.

You are clearly not in sync with the majority of voters in this country.

This is not political, it is about being concerned at the lack of border control. Just because Gillard and Rudd decided to abolish the Pacific Solution that actually worked and made it political all by themselves is something you should take up with them and not with the rest of us who would have preferred they gave bi-partisan support for something that clearly worked so well.

But NO. They decided they knew better - and what a disaster that has been.

+1.

+1 Yep - spot on.

Having said something like that, how far do you have to sell your soul to the Devil to have come up with the Malaysia Solution?

If she had any soul she sold it long ago when she ousted Rudd. She has, since then, continued to demonstrate that she is entirely about her personal political survival. No concern for anything or anyone else.

What a disgrace.

Indeed.

 

[JTLP]

Just love the xenophobic talk on this thread!

How is it xenophobic when we want our borders protected for security purposes but all's fair to block LEGAL 457 VISA WORKERS from entering our country to WORK?

 

[Calliope]

Just love the xenophobic talk on this thread!

How is it xenophobic when we want our borders protected for security purposes but all's fair to block LEGAL 457 VISA WORKERS from entering our country to WORK?

I agree JTLP. I think you have pinpointed the xenophobic poster. But I have a feeling that he is trying to pull his head in after the loss of his mentor.

 

[basilio]

Malcolm Fraser has written a line by line demolition of Tony Abbotts asylum plan. Just clear facts. It's worth reading the entire article to see how he justifies his criticism. Be interesting to see the broad reaction to his very factual paper.

(I think Malcolm would probably pick apart the Labour party policy as well but perhaps not as strongly)

The Coalition's latest asylum seeker plan is inhumane and lacks integrity.

TONY Abbott and Scott Morrison recently stood in front of Australia and proudly presented the Coalition's plan to ''ensure integrity and restore confidence in refugee assessment''. There is not much to be proud about in this policy. The announcement was based on misinformed and misleading information that plays straight into the unfounded public fear of asylum seekers.

How can you ''restore integrity'' to the policy affecting asylum seekers when the proposals embraced are based on falsehoods, misinformation and a blatant playing of politics with the lives of vulnerable people? This is the opposite of integrity. It is inhumane and demeans Australia. Is this the basis on which Abbott will operate if he, as he believes he will, becomes prime minister?

Australia has a robust and effective legal system to assess whether or not someone is a refugee. Declaring that a tougher and more rigorous process is required ignores the fact that we do not have an asylum seeker problem and we have not lost control of our borders.

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/politics/abbotts-evil-policy-work-20120617-20hzs.html#ixzz1y5naqHwC

 

[Calliope]

Malcolm Fraser - The Age - basilio - Hmmm? No bias there? :shake:

 

[basilio]

Malcolm Fraser - The Age - basilio - Hmmm? No bias there? :shake:

Why not read the article and dispute the facts Calliope ?

 

[noco]

If the Labor Party want their Malaysian legislation passed, why are they not applying some pressure on their socailist left wing Greens coaltition partner instead of blaming Abbott.

The Labor Party won't even place their legislation before parliament.

The Greens seem to be able to persuade the Labor to do what they want like the Carbon tax but the Labor Party go all soft when they seek the Greens support on the Malayasisn deal.

Who is running this country, the Greens or Labor?

 

[noco]

Why not read the article and dispute the facts Calliope ?

I did read that artilcle by Malcolm Fraser and can only disagree with his statement on the grounds that these illegal boat people firstly do have to have a passport to gain entry into Indonesia so why distroy them before landing on Australia soil? There appears to be some anomosity going between Fraser and Abbott, and Fraser, not for the first time has tried to discredt Abbott. From my observation Fraser tends to lean towards Turnbull. Furthermore, Fraser has, for some time now, been a good buddy of Whitlam. So I would not place too much credence on Fraser's statements!!!!!!!!!!

The illegal boat people seem to have plenty of money to fly to Indonesia and then pay $10,000 plus to the people smugglers. So why then do they not fly into Australia with the proper documents on a tourist visa and over stay as others do? The difference of course is those who fly in and overstay are not entitled to social security hand outs like the illegal boat people.

The Pacific solution under Howard was proved to be successful, however this Current Government under Gillard just refuse to swallow their pride by admitting Howard was correct. I don't see it as reclyling an old policy. What I do see is the burden placed on the Australian tax payer to provde welfare, and according to reports, some 85% of illegal boat will be on it for the rest of their lives.

I also believe that 90% of these illegal boat people are Muslim and there is a world wide plot to infiltrate the Western World to ultimately have a Muslim dominated world. One only has to observe what is now happening in Europe particularly in Holland, Denmark and France. It is starting to happen in Australia with Muslims seeking Sharia law and building their own schools to teach kids the Karan five times a day.

So I say STOP THE BOATS and reopen the successful Pacific solution.

 

[Calliope]

Why not read the article and dispute the facts Calliope ?

Frazer - Age- basilio - Facts Same old drivel.

And Noco, Frazer is in cahoots with Labor and the Greens. He hates the Coalition. Why else would basilio love his propaganda?

 

[Julia]

The illegal boat people seem to have plenty of money to fly to Indonesia and then pay $10,000 plus to the people smugglers. So why then do they not fly into Australia with the proper documents on a tourist visa and over stay as others do? The difference of course is those who fly in and overstay are not entitled to social security hand outs like the illegal boat people.

This seems an entirely valid question to me. Would appreciate your comment here, basilio.

Mr Fraser is well known for his antipathy toward the party he once led.
He has, for some years, been an excellent support to Labor and The Greens.

 

[basilio]

Lets see what Malcolm Fraser was saying about the current situation.

Another major part of the policy is to draw an unfavourable inference about an applicant's identity if they arrive without documents. The reference to ''90 per cent of arrivals having no documents whatsoever'' is a blatant attempt to mislead the public. A footnote refers to a budget estimates hearing relating to asylum seekers arriving without a passport. But arriving without a passport is not the same as arriving with no documents ''whatsoever''. While people may arrive without a passport, it does not mean they do not have other identity documents.

There are numerous reasons people arrive without a passport: they may not have one, they have had to hand it over to people smugglers, or they have panicked and destroyed it because it is their identity that has caused persecution, torture and imprisonment in the past. Further to this, to prove an asylum seeker is a refugee, identity documents must be provided - therefore there is no way to be found to be a refugee without any documents. This is not indicative of a system ''wide open to abuse'' or one in which assessors are forced to make a ''best guess''.

The reason nine out of 10 people who arrive by boat receive visas is that they have proved they are refugees. They have provided identifying documents and have proved that owing to a ''well-founded fear of being persecuted for reasons of race, religion, nationality, membership of a particular social group or political opinion'' they are unable to return to their home country. Fear that has forced them to flee and seek protection in Australia. Protection that, as signatories to the Refugee Convention, we are obliged to offer and should be proud to offer.

Asylum seekers are not granted refugee status because they do not have documents or are cheating a vulnerable system. The presumption that people who arrive in Australia seeking our protection are trying to cheat our system is offensive.

As a final indication of the value of this policy, it refers to section 49A of the Migration Act. There is no section 49A.

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/politics/abbotts-evil-policy-work-20120617-20hzs.html#ixzz1y6fBbrqz

If a person has a ''well-founded fear of being persecuted for reasons of race, religion, nationality, membership of a particular social group or political opinion'' they arn't going to be able to waltz up to local authorities and get travel documents etc to get of the country. They are far more likely to get a bullet in the head.

The world adopted a universal policy on asylum seekers in the 1950's because it recognized the reality of brutal regimes and the need to offer support and protection of people who tried escape these situations. Think German Jews and escapees from China and USSR.

As has been repeatedly pointed out 90% of the boat arrivals have had their refugee status accepted when investigated.

 

[noco]

As Andrew Bolt says, Fraser skips over the most likely.

Fraser should go count his sheep and stay out of politics.


http://blogs.news.com.au/couriermai...l/comments/fraser_skips_over_the_most_likely/

 

[Calliope]

As has been repeatedly pointed out 90% of the boat arrivals have had their refugee status accepted when investigated.

Yes they do. And it has been repeatedly asked, but not answered;

Why do people who arrive illegally without papers get preference over those who arrive legally with papers? Don't give me your bullsh*t that sneaking in the back door without a passport or visa is legal entry.

Oh, I see, if you arrive by boat (via other countries) you must be a refugee.

 

[basilio]

Yes they do. And it has been repeatedly asked, but not answered;

Why do people who arrive illegally without papers get preference over those who arrive legally with papers? Don't give me your bullsh*t that sneaking in the back door without a passport or visa is legal entry.

Oh, I see, if you arrive by boat (via other countries) you must be a refugee.

You have it dead right calliope. When you are being persecuted and can't emigrate because you will get killed in the process you escape whatever way you can. Thats what a refugee is.

Would you prefer it if we simply relabelled all boat people as Muslim terrorists and sent them to sleep with the fishes as summary justice ?

 

[Calliope]

You have it dead right calliope. When you are being persecuted and can't emigrate because you will get killed in the process you escape whatever way you can. Thats what a refugee is.

You seem very obtuse today Bas. Allow me to to put you on the right track:

. No one knows whether they were persecuted or not.

. Most freely few out of their own countries with documentation to an intermediate country where they were safe. They obviously weren't killed in the process.

. They destroyed their papers.

Would you prefer it if we simply relabelled all boat people as Muslim terrorists and sent them to sleep with the fishes as summary justice ?

You certainly are confused and are getting erratic.

. No. I would deny them access to the Australian court system until they produced their papers. Then they might start to bring them with them.

. Most the illegals reaching the Cocos are Tamils (not Muslims) and are departing from India where they also had safe haven.

 

[Julia]

If a person has a ''well-founded fear of being persecuted for reasons of race, religion, nationality, membership of a particular social group or political opinion'' they arn't going to be able to waltz up to local authorities and get travel documents etc to get of the country.

So how did they get to fly from Iraq or wherever all the way through to Indonesia, Malaysia etc?
They had documentation to do that.