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Asylum immigrants - Green Light

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Julia said:
So how did they get to fly from Iraq or wherever all the way through to Indonesia, Malaysia etc?
They had documentation to do that.
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Good question.... I think it presumes they did fly from their home country to Indonesia. Perhaps some did and some didn't.

I simply don't know enough about the individual stories of refugees to make a sensible comment. I'd leave that to immigration officials to work out. If it's is the case that 90% of boat refugees have a genuine case to show they are refugees after close investigation I'd accept that judgment.

And why would we not ?
 
basilio said:
You have it dead right calliope. When you are being persecuted and can't emigrate because you will get killed in the process you escape whatever way you can. Thats what a refugee is.

Would you prefer it if we simply relabelled all boat people as Muslim terrorists and sent them to sleep with the fishes as summary justice ? :confused:
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If one in a thousand was a terrorist that is one too many.

The AFP have dicovered terrorist cells in Australia, so basilio, how did they enter Australiain in the first place?

Look, I won't be around to see it happen, but I can assure you the muslims kids who are being taught the Koran will be brainwashed into believing you and I are infidels, and inifdels and Christians should be eliminated. When push comes to shove those kids, when turning into adutlhood, will be reminded what they have been taught. Yes, I know basilio, you will say the ones now in Australia are the moderate ones. At present they are sleeping dogs.

Be afraid my friend, be very afraid!!!!!!!!!!
 
basilio said:
Good question.... I think it presumes they did fly from their home country to Indonesia. Perhaps some did and some didn't.
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So how else do you suggest they got to Indonesia? Hitch hiked? Of course they went by air and to do this, as you absolutely well know, they would have had to have passports etc.

And let's remember that people can actually be assessed as refugees yet still represent a security risk, according to ASIO. Not every person landing in a boat here is necessarily the persecuted innocent little snowflake such as you seem to idealistically believe.

I simply don't know enough about the individual stories of refugees to make a sensible comment.
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Yet you persistently champion their cause on the apparent assumption that their arrival here should always be treated with total sympathy and support.
 
In point of fact I have seen and spoken to a number of refugees. Their stories were incredibly painful (and made me feel very fortunate to be in Australia.)

When I made the comment about being unable to relate to individual stories I thought I was stating the obvious - that immigration officials are far better qualified to suss out the background and history of boat people than anyone simply reading the newspaper.

It's for that reason I keep going back to the primary undisputed facts. That is that after close inquiry the immigration department decided that 90% of asylum seekers were genuine and should be granted protection.

Obviously we need to check people out. But I suggest the collective demonising of boat people is just a political beat up to give us permission to treat fellow human beings badly. In an extreme case we only need one possible suspicion to allow a collective punishment. (See Nocos comments above)

We are better than that.
 
basilio said:
Good question.... I think it presumes they did fly from their home country to Indonesia. Perhaps some did and some didn't.

I simply don't know enough about the individual stories of refugees to make a sensible comment. I'd leave that to immigration officials to work out. If it's is the case that 90% of boat refugees have a genuine case to show they are refugees after close investigation I'd accept that judgment.
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Yes that just about sums up the argument, blind faith in the immigration officials, that are playing catch up with 4 corners. Unbelievable, just unbelievable.
Bring on the election.
 
basilio said:
In point of fact I have seen and spoken to a number of refugees. Their stories were incredibly painful (and made me feel very fortunate to be in Australia.)

When I made the comment about being unable to relate to individual stories I thought I was stating the obvious - that immigration officials are far better qualified to suss out the background and history of boat people than anyone simply reading the newspaper.

It's for that reason I keep going back to the primary undisputed facts. That is that after close inquiry the immigration department decided that 90% of asylum seekers were genuine and should be granted protection.

Obviously we need to check people out. But I suggest the collective demonising of boat people is just a political beat up to give us permission to treat fellow human beings badly. In an extreme case we only need one possible suspicion to allow a collective punishment. (See Nocos comments above)

We are better than that.
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Well maybe you could better support the cause, by moving to Indonesia and telling the boat people to hang onto their documentation.
No that would be too easy, much better to throw the documentation overboard and say you are being demonised. Give me a break, what a load of BS.
Basilio your full of it, if they threw away their documentation before arriving in Indonesia, you would never see them again. They throw it away coming to Aust to gain advantage and they should be flown back to point of origin, if they don't have paperwork.
You try going overseas without paperwork, what a load of crap.
 
sptrawler said:
Yes that just about sums up the argument, blind faith in the immigration officials, that are playing catch up with 4 corners. Unbelievable, just unbelievable.
Bring on the election.
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And exactly what are your reasons for calling the immigration officials incompetent or liars? A gut feeling perhaps? Maybe Andrew Bolt told you so ? Or is it just convenient to dismiss the work of a whole department to justify pushing a few hundred people back into the water ? Perhaps you'd like to legislate the results of immigration officers for them so they can fit into your preordained set of results.

What a load of absolute ****e :mad::mad::mad::mad:
 
basilio said:
And exactly what are your reasons for calling the immigration officials incompetent or liars? A gut feeling perhaps? Maybe Andrew Bolt told you so ? Or is it just convenient to dismiss the work of a whole department to justify pushing a few hundred people back into the water ? Perhaps you'd like to legislate the results of immigration officers for them so they can fit into your preordained set of results.

What a load of absolute ****e :mad::mad::mad::mad:
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No my assumptions are made on the fact the immigration dept is probably underwater with the amount of illegals they are processing.
They were never expected to process the amount of people that are coming through, how the hell do you man up for an escalation of 10 people to 10,000 people in 5 years. Get real :eek:
Love your compassion, I presume you have put your name forward for the government initiative to house them.
 
basilio said:
How about taking a few minutes to check out some of the people we have rescued and what they were escaping from.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3gisYBoEwQ&feature=relmfu
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpCJZ4pIbg8&feature=relmfu
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bspE2rsAHOA&feature=relmfu
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sju7dKVthf4&feature=relmfu
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I don't give a rats where they were escaping from, the last thing I would throw away would be my proof of identity, if I was running away from anyware.
I want to know who the hell I am letting in, maybe you don't care and that's your perogative, but most people want to know.
I am sure if you were running away from Australia, you wouldn't throw away your passport, unless you were a criminal.
 
basilio said:
And exactly what are your reasons for calling the immigration officials incompetent or liars? A gut feeling perhaps? Maybe Andrew Bolt told you so ? Or is it just convenient to dismiss the work of a whole department to justify pushing a few hundred people back into the water ? Perhaps you'd like to legislate the results of immigration officers for them so they can fit into your preordained set of results.

What a load of absolute ****e :mad::mad::mad::mad:
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The Department is overrun with so many people. They cannot be expected to be as diligent in their assessment as they would without this influx.

I note you choose to express outrage over being challenged on this, despite the embarrassing evidence of an actual people smuggler being assessed as a refugee, given government housing, along with the same for other members of his family, who then turns his clever hand to running a people smuggling operation from Australia.
The fiasco depicted on Four Corners informed the Department about this. Who knows how many more such similar scams are running successfully?

This is fine with you?

You continue to fail to address the fact that these people destroy their documentation after reaching Indonesia.
Why not explain this if they are all such good genuine people, basilio?

And then how about the people who have made their way to the hundreds of UNHCR refugee camps, with their documentation, actually applied to come here via official channels, and who are being displaced in such an attempt by these document-destroying people who may or may not have a reason to come here other than the attraction of free medical and dental services, free housing, etc etc.

And while you're addressing this, how about also telling us how you feel about Australians who - through no fault of their own and many of whom have paid taxes in this country - are homeless, and otherwise disadvantaged?
We don't seem to be going out of our way to provide them with public housing.

I have no idea why you seem unable to see the injustice in this.
Let's have some actual responses from you to the above, basilio.
 
I thought you might like this link to a new Department of Immigratiion site for illegal boat people, otherwise known as "Irregular maritime arrivals". Maybe you can pass it on to any boat people you know as it sets out everything they need to know about getting started here, their rights, what appeals they can have, how they can access our legal system and letting them know that they will be released into the community with work rights.

http://www.immi.gov.au/ima/
 
startrader said:
I thought you might like this link to a new Department of Immigratiion site for illegal boat people, otherwise known as "Irregular maritime arrivals". Maybe you can pass it on to any boat people you know as it sets out everything they need to know about getting started here, their rights, what appeals they can have, how they can access our legal system and letting them know that they will be released into the community with work rights.

http://www.immi.gov.au/ima/
Click to expand...

I reckon the people smugglers would be handing this out to their customers in Brochure form.
 
sptrawler said:
No my assumptions are made on the fact the immigration dept is probably underwater with the amount of illegals they are processing.
They were never expected to process the amount of people that are coming through, how the hell do you man up for an escalation of 10 people to 10,000 people in 5 years. Get real :eek:
Love your compassion, I presume you have put your name forward for the government initiative to house them.
Click to expand...

Very close to the truth, sptrawler, very close indeed!!

basilio said:
And exactly what are your reasons for calling the immigration officials incompetent or liars? A gut feeling perhaps? Maybe Andrew Bolt told you so ? Or is it just convenient to dismiss the work of a whole department to justify pushing a few hundred people back into the water ? Perhaps you'd like to legislate the results of immigration officers for them so they can fit into your preordained set of results.

What a load of absolute ****e :mad::mad::mad::mad:
Click to expand...

This is just too easy, too hard and fast. Reality is quite different, and a deal more complex.

I have to be cryptic here and refer only to publicly available information. Compare the refusal rates from the time before the High Court decided asylum seekers could seek judicial review of their refusal decisions to the approval rates after they could be challenged in Court.

Compare the refusal rates for the same country of origin asylum seekers who came in via the airport (and so have their documentation) to those coming by boat. Again a big difference.
 

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