so we should abuse the ones that do come to deter others from getting on boats?
Asylum immigrants - Green Light
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so we should abuse the ones that do come to deter others from getting on boats?
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How much responsibility do you think the people that got on those leaky boats in the first place should take ?
Who said the kids had been abused......How have they been abused?.......Who have they been abused by?....Were they sexually abused?.....Were they beaten by out authorities? ......do you consider being held in detention is abuse.
Did it come out of the child senator SHY's mouth......don't take too much notice of that Green Fabian.....she loves to stir and exaggerate and make the situation worse than it is......Every time she goes into detention center, there is a doubling of incidents.......Perhaps they should have let her into Curtain detention center and not let her out.......Note SHY remarks about India......India sure gave her a wrap over the knuckles for her lies.
I don't believe detention is abuse.......After all they come with their parents, who in most cases throw their ID's over board and in doing so it takes time to establish who they and if they are genuine refugees or economic refugees.....What are we supposed to do?....Let them in today, sign them up with pseudo names and direct them to the nearest hotel.?
How about some details of your abuse statement
Yes of course.....They knew the risks and the consequences that goes with those risks.
Do try and keep up (there's been an ongoing inquiry by human rights commission for months):
Immigration Minister Scott Morrison's claim that children in detention received daily care was not true and he needed to be "better advised", the Australian Human Rights Commission president says.
Professor Gillian Triggs also said there was evidence detained children had tried to poison themselves, despite Mr Morrison's statement the assertions were "sensational".
The third hearing of the commission's inquiry into children in detention on Thursday was told the Immigration Department had advised the independent health provider on Christmas Island not to publish a report that showed alarming rates of mental health issues among child detainees.
Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...n-detention-20140731-zz7bc.html#ixzz395lWbTpi
Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...n-detention-20140731-zz7bc.html#ixzz395lMBcKD
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Maybe a revenge Royal Commission coming up from the next Labor government ?
Julia
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What do the critics here imagine are the health and social conditions being experienced by people already determined to be genuine refugees who have been patiently waiting in camps throughout the world for their chance to come here?
The government is attempting to walk the pretty fine line between providing an absolute deterrent to these well off people who can afford to pay people smugglers to get them here, and a reasonable level of care in detention centres. They are, however, detention centres, not five star spiritual retreats.
A comment I read recently following an article about the conditions our troops experienced when they were fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan made an excellent point. The writer contrasted the way our soldiers were sleeping on the rocky ground, not even a mat beneath them. The detainees in some of our detention facilities consider they are being abused if the air conditioning is not to their liking.
Goodness, if some characters like Sarah Hanson Young et al came to visit me in a detention centre, full of loving sympathy and worry, I wouldn't find it too hard to bang my head against the wall, threaten to jump off a roof, etc etc., if i thought it might get me the passage to assisted accommodation and taxpayer funded existence in Australia.
The government is attempting to walk the pretty fine line between providing an absolute deterrent to these well off people who can afford to pay people smugglers to get them here, and a reasonable level of care in detention centres. They are, however, detention centres, not five star spiritual retreats.
A comment I read recently following an article about the conditions our troops experienced when they were fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan made an excellent point. The writer contrasted the way our soldiers were sleeping on the rocky ground, not even a mat beneath them. The detainees in some of our detention facilities consider they are being abused if the air conditioning is not to their liking.
Goodness, if some characters like Sarah Hanson Young et al came to visit me in a detention centre, full of loving sympathy and worry, I wouldn't find it too hard to bang my head against the wall, threaten to jump off a roof, etc etc., if i thought it might get me the passage to assisted accommodation and taxpayer funded existence in Australia.
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In general I agree with your sentiment, apart from the children in the detention centres who should be doing what kids do; ie having fun and going to school. Keeping young children in detention is inhumane imo , and before anyone says "oh but Labor did it as well", they also deserve condemnation for those actions.
Julia
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I'm sure we'd all agree that children shouldn't be pawns in the whole sorry business. But, as long as their parents put them unaccompanied on boats, risking their lives, in the hope that - just because they're children - they will be admitted to community life in Australia, with the ultimate objective of bringing their whole extended families out to join them, they will probably be destined to stay where they are. Yes, to us it seems awful for the children, but their parents should perhaps have thought about that before sending them.
It's up to us where we put them. It's not like we have no agency in this.
Banco, I did read the contents of that report of isolated cases of self harm but not abuse as you describe it.
Now lets analyze a few things that may have caused those kids to self harm apart from the fact the Green/Labor coalition allowed them in the first place.....Had the Green/Labor Party not opened the flood gates in 2008, those kids would not be detention and suffering any purported trauma.....when these incidents occur we are quick to point the finger at the Government and blame them for holding them so long......but they are being held there with their parents until such times as our authorities can prove who they, where they have come from and if one or both parents have a criminal record or perhaps been associated with terrorist organisations.
SELF HARM.
My grand son is now 15 years old, doing well at school, a placid boy who gets on well with his mates.......When he was 3 years old his mother fed him lots of red cordial and flavored milks full of a chemical that affected his brain....He would sink the boot into the cat and constantly harm his 1 year old sister....He would be chastised and punished for his aggression.....his next act would to go to his bedroom and bank his head on the wall......It was yours truly who suggested to his mother that chemicals in those drinks may be the cause.....After her own research, she ceased giving him those drinks...within days that boy became a normal well mannered boy.
So my point is, could this happening in detention centers whereby kids are being fed similar drinks.
The report stated kids (plural) were drinking detergent but the report did not say how many kids, how old they were and whether it may have been a isolated case whereby a kid mistook it for green cordial.
I went to my local super market last week to buy some super glue and could not find it on the selves......I asked one of the attendants whether they still stocked that product and I was told they are now stored behind the checkout girls because young kids were sniffing it in the store....so these things do happen with kids in our own community......I have been told since then, these particular kids came from broken families.
I did not see any reports of bullying by other kids in the detention centers.....you know the type of happenings in our schools......It is a well known fact that bullying in some of our schools can cause kids, particularly girls to self harm by cutting their wrists and in a few isolate cases, resulting in death.
I am not trying to defend Scott Morrison or the Government......I am merely pointing out the scenarios that may or may not have taken place.
The other point which I raise is we have some 30,000 illegals in detention and it would be impossible to process them all at once in light of the fact that none of them have any ID....I understand that number is slowing being whittled away, with some opting to return to their homeland in lieu of being settled in PNG
So what do we do with kids in the meantime?....Do we take them away from their parents and place them in foster homes in Australia or PNG?....or are they better left with their own parents and how well do some of those parents care about their kids in detention?.....do they all get the love and affection that all kids crave for or do some of them become neglected?
Just a little food for thought before we do anymore finger pointing.
Julia
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Noco, bear in mind that some of these children are not with their parents. They were sent on a boat by themselves, presumably with the aim of their parents that the Australian government will not put them into a detention centre, will instead admit them to the community, whereupon it will be a relatively short step for their parents and large extended family to be brought here to join them.
See above comment to noco. Your political affiliation will determine what you consider should happen.
Tough luck for you that your side isn't running the show at present.
Well we sure showed their parents. At least you didn't pretend that the main reason for deterring boatpeople by being as cruel to them as we can get away with was to stop the drownings. Rather it's that we don't want them here.
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I'm not sure that we can assume that any application for family reunion will automatically be approved.
There is a limit to the number of these places like there is for any of the other migration schemes, so if the government wants to discourage refugees from using this system then all it has to do is knock back their applications or make the family reunion scheme unavailable to them.
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Absolutely correct. We don't want them here.
Why don't they choose to go some where else? Why don't they try to illegally enter Singapore or Malaysia or Indonesia instead?
Julia
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+1 bintang.
Well done, banco. You got it eventually. All of the government's measures are to make it crystal clear to intending uninvited people that - if they want to live in Australia - then they can join the thousands already waiting in refugee camps, bereft of funds to pay people smugglers.
Australia has one of the best humanitarian refugee resettlement programs in the world. It was, however, under Labor brought to almost a complete halt because of the influx of boat people the then government welcomed.
Most fair minded people want to see our support extended to the people who really need it rather than those who just think it might be a nicer place to live than where they perhaps cannot have everything to which they aspire.
Sounds simple, doesn't it. But it probably isn't, and once a child has been taken into the community it would be my bet that the pressure to allow the family to follow will be difficult to withstand.
Hence the government's determination to deter people from coming in the first place.
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Surely not for a government as tough as the current one purports to be...
Julia
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The 157 have now been moved to Nauru, a consequence of their decision to refuse to speak with Indian government officials.
Some statistics on detention centers....but nothing on unaccompanied children.....they do exists but just how many is unknown.......If they have arrived without parents, who paid for their way here and who looked after them in Indonesia while awaiting transit to a people smuggler?
http://www.immi.gov.au/managing-aus.../immigration-detention-statistics-may2014.pdf
http://www.immi.gov.au/managing-aus.../immigration-detention-statistics-may2014.pdf
So_Cynical
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There was a piece on ABC 24 today about a rohingya boat arrival of a couple of years ago, he has been assessed as a refugee and granted asylum etc but has had his family visa application put at the back of the pile because the procedure has changed due to Noalition policy.
All Boat arrival family visa sponsors get low priority as explained to him in a letter from the Dept.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jan/08/refugees-family-reunion-hopes-dashed
All Boat arrival family visa sponsors get low priority as explained to him in a letter from the Dept.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jan/08/refugees-family-reunion-hopes-dashed
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