David Hicks protests

[Knobby22]

Wasn't all that long ago that Christian marriage vows for women stated "love, honour and OBEY". Now, to me that says that women must do everything that the husband wants, including sex on demand if that is what he wanted. And how the man decided to enforce that marriage vow was entirely up to him. And if maybe he went too far, well, a good dose of confession in the confession box and some hail mary's would see him right in the eyes of god.

And maybe we need to do some research on how women in Roman Catholic communities are treated, particularly in Ireland not all that long ago. And those methods were encouraged by the Catholic Church and enforced by the Pope.

Islam is not on its own when it comes to institutional maltreatment of women.

The Catholic Church example is always used to defend Islam.
It is not perfect of course but it revered Mary and women, Men are told to "cherish" women, it had nunnerys where women could escape to. It did not stone women and it does not require 4 men to witness that a rape had occurred and the women could not be put to death as occurs in Islam. Tolerance was preached if not enforced, and religous police did not enforce laws mainly against women. It has also changed with the times.

 

[new girl]

Wasn't all that long ago that Christian marriage vows for women stated "love, honour and OBEY". Now, to me that says that women must do everything that the husband wants, including sex on demand if that is what he wanted. And how the man decided to enforce that marriage vow was entirely up to him. And if maybe he went too far, well, a good dose of confession in the confession box and some hail mary's would see him right in the eyes of god.

And maybe we need to do some research on how women in Roman Catholic communities are treated, particularly in Ireland not all that long ago. And those methods were encouraged by the Catholic Church and enforced by the Pope.

Islam is not on its own when it comes to institutional maltreatment of women.

prospector

There is a big difference, again the bible says to husbands to love their wives and give their lives to their service the way jesus gave his life for the church. Also the bible says that a man's body doesn't belong to him but rather to his wife, read the bible before you comment!!!

Now you can choose to believe that or call it Bullsh!!t as well. The difference between christianting and islam is that no one will STONE YOU if you do. The Cathloic church and the Pope is not GOD, even if he likes to think so, half of what he says in not from the bible!!

You havn't been reading the posts properly, I said it matters when GOD says it, if the church chooses to invent its own rules and the pope likes to think he is GOD on earth that's his business.. please read the bible and the posts properly and then comment!

 

[Prospector]

prospector

There is a big difference again, the bible says to husbands to love their wives and give their lives to their service the way jesus died for the church. Also the bible says that a man body doesn't belong to him but rather to his wife, read the bible before you comment!!!

Now you can choose to believe that or call it Bullsh!!t as well. The difference between christianting and islam is that no one will STONE YOU if you do. The Cathloic church and the Pope is not GOD, even if he likes to think so, half of what he says in not from the bible!!

You havn't been reading the posts properly, I said it matters when GOD says it, if the church chooses to invent its own rules and the pope likes to think he is GOD on earth that's his business.. please the posts properly and then comment !

Nice to see good Christian values reflected in your comments to others too! Are you saying that the marriage vows are not in the Bible then but have been invented by Ministers?
You do not know me, so please do not comment on what I have or have not done!

 

[Knobby22]

prospector

There is a big difference, again the bible says to husbands to love their wives and give their lives to their service the way jesus gave his life for the church. Also the bible says that a man's body doesn't belong to him but rather to his wife, read the bible before you comment!!!

Now you can choose to believe that or call it Bullsh!!t as well. The difference between christianting and islam is that no one will STONE YOU if you do. The Cathloic church and the Pope is not GOD, even if he likes to think so, half of what he says in not from the bible!!

You havn't been reading the posts properly, I said it matters when GOD says it, if the church chooses to invent its own rules and the pope likes to think he is GOD on earth that's his business.. please read the bible and the posts properly and then comment!

I also take offence to that post.

 

[Bobby]

Without the meglomaniacal mullahs, there would be no jihad. Muslims are following their authority, not God's.

Same as Christians.

It is the clerics who manipulate the texts.

Well said Wayne,

Parasites of power = clerics

Cheers
Bob.

 

[new girl]

It did not stone women and it does not require 4 men to witness that a rape had occurred and the women could not be put to death as occurs in Islam. Tolerance was preached if not enforced, and religous police did not enforce laws mainly against women. It has also changed with the times.

Thank you Knobby. Its good to hear facts for a change.

Apologies for any offence caused.

 

[Happy]

From ABC, December 12, 2006

DETAINEES IN BAXTER PROTEST


More than 30 detainees are reported to be staging a protest at the Baxter detention centre near Port Augusta in South Australia.
A caller to the ABC who says he is a detainee at Baxter says a group of detainees has blocked the front gate of the detention centre, and others are on a hunger strike.
He says the protest follows reports of several detainees harming themselves to draw attention to their frustrations.
"It's just a process of long-term immigration detention, it's unnecessary, it's unreasonable," he said.
"Any other country in the world - and Australia is a wonderful country - but any other country in the world, they detain you for 30 days, they identify you, then they release you.
"There is no purpose for us being here.
"We have been vilified by the Government in order to justify our detention. This is unfair."
The Immigration Department says there have been five incidents in the past four days.
The Department says this morning a detainee was taken to hospital after an incident that is still being investigated.
It says two detainees jumped from the roof on Friday, a detainee climbed a tree on Saturday and was treated for heat exhaustion when he came down, and on Sunday another man climbed onto a roof before coming down again.

I wonder if this quote’s got anything to do with thread title, as last few don’t.

 

[greggy]

I also take offence to that post.

I too took offence at that post and saw it as a cheap dig at the Pope... We're also getting somewhat off the track. This forum is supposed to be about the David Hicks Protests.

 

[2020hindsight]

Ive got a fence full of posts
Plenty of articles if you google "david hicks":-

old news now but Chief Minister of ACT come out in support last weekend:-
http://ibnnews.org/local/stanhope_hicks_111206.html
Stanhope condemns Hicks detention anniversary
The fifth anniversary of the detention without trial of Australian terrorism suspect David Hicks was a shameful day for Australia, ACT chief minister Jon Stanhope said on Saturday.

Stanhope said December 9 was not an anniversary to celebrate.
“December 9 marks five years since Mr Hicks was captured by the United States,” he said.
“It marks five years of abandonment by his own country, five years of being denied some of the most basic of human rights: the right to a fair and swift trial, conducted according to the rule of law.

"Perhaps most disgraceful of all has been the attitude of Mr Hicks’ own national government. Just this week the prime minister John Howard was echoing sentiments uttered earlier by other federal ministers, to the effect that some portion of that five-year incarceration without trial was Mr Hicks’ own fault, for having had the temerity to challenge the legality of the military tribunals that were established to try him."

“Let’s not forget that the US Supreme Court eventually ruled that those tribunals were indeed inadequate and illegal, and that the processes to which Mr Hicks and others were being subjected breached the Geneva Conventions," said Mr Stanhope.

“What Mr Howard and his Ministers seem to be saying is that if only Mr Hicks had been willing to surrender his right to a fair trial, he could have had a swift one. Under what possible twisted reading of the law would that constitute justice?"

“And let’s not even start to list all the things that have been written and said by international human-rights experts about the treatment of inmates of Guantanamo Bay itself. Perhaps that treatment too is Mr Hicks’ fault," said the chief minister.

Stanhope said the federal government should have moved "quickly and unequivocally" to have Mr Hicks brought home.

“The day marks five long years of shameful neglect," he said

http://melbourne.indymedia.org/news/2006/12/133807.php
Date: 13 December 2006
To: Prime Minister John Howard - every member of the Australian Parliament
Subject: David Hicks torture details
From: Australians for David Hicks to come Home

Source:
Australian son David Hicks 912 Campaign
http://www.geocities.com/notinmynamesayschris/bring_david_hicks_home.html

START QUOTE:
David Hicks torture details

Email received Wednesday 13.12.2006

"Dear Chris: Yesterday, at our state's commemoration of UN Human Rights day, I gave a lecture at the Wisconsin State Capitol, under the grandly soaring rotunda, which contains a discussion of the HIcks case. Best of luck with your efforts, Very best, Al McCoy"

Chris email reply to Al, "Thank you for helping to save the life of Australian David Hicks."

UN Human Rights Day: A Beacon for All Americans Troubled by Torture
"4.) Then, US soldiers tortured David by kicking, beatings with rifle butts, gunpoint death threats, and anal penetration.

5.) After being flown to Guantanamo in January 2002, David was subjected to regular sleep deprivation, handcuffed tightly for up to 15 hours, and offered enticements to cooperate.

6.) After the “American Taliban” John Walker Lindh capitulated in July 2002, the Pentagon picked David to be the very first detainee tried before the Military Commissions.

7.) To soften this model case for trial, David was isolated inside a closet-sized, windowless cell and denied all sunlight or human contact for an unbroken, unimaginable 244 days.

8.) After he became the first detainee to face Guantanamo’s new Military Commissions in August 2004, the official Australian legal observer concluded, “a fair trial for David Hicks is virtually impossible.”

9.) As legal and legislative battles slowed his trial, in March of this year David was returned to solitary confinement where he remains, six months later, isolated 22 hours a day inside a cement room with a solid steel door.

10.) Under the new Military Commissions law, David faces another 2 to 5 years of such soul-destroying solitary confinement.

11.) In full view of the entire world, the United States has

--subjected a detainee to endless imprisonment lasting 7, 8, or 9 years on mere suspicion,

--denied him habeas corpus rights,

--tortured him with sophisticated psychological methods to bend before this presidential court and accept its pre-determined verdict,

--allowed use of evidence extracted under torture in a US court,

--and dragged him before a drum-head tribunal that, according to the US Supreme Court, mocks the civilized standards of Justice."

“UN Human Rights Day:
A Beacon for All Americans
Troubled by Torture”

Alfred W. McCoy,
University of Wisconsin-Madison
State Capitol, Madison, Wisconsin
UN Human Rights Day,
11 December 2006"

 

[new girl]

Ive got a fence full of posts
Plenty of articles if you google "david hicks":-

thanks 2020

ps yeh I'm sure the dog enjoys sniffing them. don't forget to take her for a walk tonight

 

[2020hindsight]

Not often this happens
yes vote :-
http://members.iinet.net.au/~chrisjohn316/davidhicks/yes.html

no vote (more accurately "default no votes") :-
http://members.iinet.net.au/~chrisjohn316/davidhicks/no.html

http://www.geocities.com/notinmynamesayschris/bring_david_hicks_home.html
"29 October 2006 to 8 December 2006
226 politicians made their decision

60 yes votes
Yes Bring David Hicks home NOW !
Includes "David Hicks Australian Parliament Thank you Poem"

7 no votes and 159 default no votes
No, leave David Hicks to the Americans !
Are you are being represented accurately ? ! "

 

[new girl]

Not often this happens
yes vote :-
http://members.iinet.net.au/~chrisjohn316/davidhicks/yes.html

no vote :-
http://members.iinet.net.au/~chrisjohn316/davidhicks/no.html

Unbelievable, how do you come up with this stuff? I mean you need to be really clever, you must be some sort of an engineer.

I promised to respond to one of your posts, but I've been busy preparing for my trip to Tazmania on Friday, have you ever been? I havn't.

ps I'm going to miss this place, 8 days seems very long without a computer, I am addicted, any suggestions?

 

[tech/a]

have you ever been?

Zehan and Straun would suit you perfectly---you'll probably never return.

 

[new girl]

Zehan and Straun would suit you perfectly---you'll probably never return.

Tech/a

thanks for the tip just finished googling it. I know I own shares with mining companies, but going to a mining town will not tempt to stay! Unless that was some sort of wishful thinking on your behalf? I hope you weren't offended like some people around here?

 

[tech/a]

Tech/a

I hope you weren't offended like some people around here?

Water off a ducks back---wasnt directed at me.

Religon,Politics,Money and Women,great topics when you want to get in an arguement

 

[new girl]

Water off a ducks back---wasnt directed at me.

Religon,Politics,Money and Women,great topics when you want to get in an arguement

NOW I know why I like arguing so much

 

[2020hindsight]

Launceston is gr8, nice walk thru park with esk river, Great Northern Hotel in town is reasonable.

Trip to Low Head lighthouse ? – up to you. – out of the way. , There’s a hill where some bushranger kept eye on the travelling Cobb & Co traffic

Hobart is also gr8, 4 seasons in one day, Sandy Bay casino, My Wellington.

between them? I’d go via Devenport, Straun, and Queenstown (i.e. via west coast). Especially since there are fires on east side.

Devonport – motel near bridge. nearby restaurant serves possum

Cradle Mtn ? – never been there. Nor the other lakes down south (but those up on the plateau are just for locals with weekender fishing huts – dusty roads – don’t go there – amazingly dry.)

(PS tip:- make sure you see Tassie before you go see South Island NZ, not the other way round.)

 

[Julia]

prospector

There is a big difference, again the bible says to husbands to love their wives and give their lives to their service the way jesus gave his life for the church. Also the bible says that a man's body doesn't belong to him but rather to his wife, read the bible before you comment!!!

Now you can choose to believe that or call it Bullsh!!t as well. The difference between christianting and islam is that no one will STONE YOU if you do. The Cathloic church and the Pope is not GOD, even if he likes to think so, half of what he says in not from the bible!!

You havn't been reading the posts properly, I said it matters when GOD says it, if the church chooses to invent its own rules and the pope likes to think he is GOD on earth that's his business.. please read the bible and the posts properly and then comment!

New Girl

Perhaps it's time for a sleep or a visit to the gym to work off some of your antagonism.

Prospector's post made a good point.

I find your response unnecessarily offensive.

A forum is about anyone who is interested contributing their thoughts.
You are entitled to yours, but you are not entitled to attempt to belittle the contributions of others.

A couple of times, I've begun to contribute my own thoughts to this thread, but have decided it's descended into a rather hysterical squabble.
It would be good to return to the actual title of the thread.

Julia

 

[new girl]

A couple of times, I've begun to contribute my own thoughts to this thread, but have decided it's descended into a rather hysterical squabble.

Julia

I'm glad you decided to contribute to the hysterical squabble..

Sweet dreams to you too

New Girl

 

[anon]

New Girl,

I must say that I do enjoy your posts. A clear strong thinker who doesn't constantly call up this or that link for support.

Have I buttered you up enough to ask you a silly question? About sex? I think.

It had been frequently reported in the media that the suicide bombers, or "martyrs" as the radical muslims regard them, are rewarded with 72 (seventy two) virgins up there in heaven. My mind boggles that some rational people would think that any male could service so many virgins without doing some physical damage to himself. To me this would be a punishment and not a reward. Kill them by kindness, but kill them all the same. Some would say - what a way to go. My own view is to stay alive and enjoy sex for a lot onger.

What I want to know is whether this 72 virgins reward promise is a fact or is fiction of the western media.

Any comments???

anon