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Coronavirus (COVID-19/SARS-CoV-2) outbreak discussion

Will the "Corona Virus" turn into a worldwide epidemic or fizzle out?

  • Yes

    Votes: 37 49.3%

  • No

    Votes: 9 12.0%

  • Bigger than SARS, but not worldwide epidemic (Black Death/bubonic plague)

    Votes: 25 33.3%

  • Undecided

    Votes: 4 5.3%
  • Total voters
    75
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satanoperca said:
But you are stating the obvious, some people, % of the population, not just Victorians have always done this, flouted the law.

So why does this situation make it any different?

Redrob, apart from NZ what countries have managed to get this under control?
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The very first person to contract the virus never knew they had it.
Many people spreading the virus right now do not know they have it.
That's very different from interacting with people (sexually) who are most likely to have it, despite it being their job to protect the community from it.
That's obvious, I would have thought.
 
So what is your solution?
You are good at stating the facts, but what is your solution?
Yes Redrob, I am frustrated, spent my whole life dealing with people who are good at suggesting ideas, but less than 5% can implement them.
So again, what is your solution to this issue, how would you implement it, what are the expected outcomes?
 
satanoperca said:
So what is your solution?
You are good at stating the facts, but what is your solution?
Yes Redrob, I am frustrated, spent my whole life dealing with people who are good at suggesting ideas, but less than 5% can implement them.
So again, what is your solution to this issue, how would you implement it, what are the expected outcomes?
Click to expand...

Heaps of countries have this under control but they don't speak English. We had it under control but there are other forces at work now who don't want us to succeed. International forces.

We have entered the world of the anti maskers.
Some men/women are simply devoid of reason.
In this realm of belief and disbelief, social media amplifies their grotesquery of logic.
It is impossible to know how much of this faux individual freedom outrage is seepage from the conspiracy swamp in America.

In the end, they believe their freedom of expression is worth more than your life! Wear a mask.
 
Knobby22 said:
Heaps of countries have this under control but they don't speak English. We had it under control but there are other forces at work now who don't want us to succeed. International forces.
In the end, they believe their freedom of expression is worth more than your life! Wear a mask.
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Edited your post.
What are the heaps of countries that have this under control?
As for masks, they are are like condoms, wear one if you do not want the consequences of having to look after a living being or don't wear one, your choice. Same with masks.

Again, provide a solution, wearing a mask is just one component of providing a solution.
 
satanoperca said:
Agreed, but that is also asking people to have some level of empathy and understanding.
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That is true and I think that is why some of this has to be laid at Daniel Andrews feet.
From what I have read, since he has come to office, he has projected the image of who gives a $hit, it is my way or the highway and I don't give a crap what anyone else thinks.
Well IMO that has empowered a lot in Victoria to think the same way, so in reality you get what you sow.
On the same theme telling kids they can be feral and there is nothing that can be done about it, will end up with those that way inclined, enjoying that freedom and pushing the boundaries.
 
satanoperca said:
As for masks, they are are like condoms, wear one if you do not want the consequences of having to look after a living being or don't wear one, your choice. Same with masks.
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Condoms do not make the wearer pregnant!
Health officers in Australia have not understood that masks protect the wearer every bit as much as the people around them. If you cannot put your fingers onto your mouth or to your nose, that's 2 of the 3 avenues of the virus into your body that are literally covered.
I have already posted a video where Fauci explains the measures that concurrently allows a functional economy with mitigation.
 
rederob said:
Condoms do not make the wearer pregnant!
Health officers in Australia have not understood that masks protect the wearer every bit as much as the people around them. If you cannot put your fingers onto your mouth or to your nose, that's 2 of the 3 avenues of the virus into your body that are literally covered.
I have already posted a video where Fauci explains the measures that concurrently allows a functional economy with mitigation.
Click to expand...

I ask again, what is your solution to the issue, except from wearing masks, which I agree with?
 
Be like Sweden?

Can some one tell me how when Sweden is about personal responsibility and following directives with a support network state that will look after you if you cannot get to work.

Can some one tell me how this works for the 1.5 million casuals that are not covered here in Australia?
That's just for starters

Spread of the virus = people + movement + contact

Can anyone tell me how Sweden isn't doing the above ?


Below gives an idea of some of the problems of "just be like Sweden".


"Before we get too hung up on blaming the state govt, or the federal govt, or China for our covid situation let’s review some facts :
1. We had to bring in mandatory quarantining in hotels, because we couldn’t trust people to stay home after returning from overseas.
2. We then had to bring in security, because we couldn’t trust people to stay in those hotels.
3. We then had to bring in ADF, because we couldn’t trust the security guards not to have sex with those in quarantine in the hotels.
4. We had to get police to door knock and check up on people, because we couldn't trust those who were meant to be self-isolating to actually stay at home.
5. We also have to have police and ADF reinforce the metropolitan Melbourne zone and state borders, because we can’t trust people to follow the restrictions.
6. We are now being asked to use masks, because we cannot trust people to social distance when they are in public.
7. Through it all, our supermarkets have had to introduce shopping restrictions because we couldn’t trust people to not to take more than what they needed.
So we can get as mad as we want at politicians or health officials for imposing restrictions, or the country where the virus originated, but essentially it’s our own fault that we find ourselves here.
Selfishness and lack of empathy seems to be as much of a disease as covid itself.
The quicker people start following directions, the quicker this situation will improve."
 
Knobby22 said:
Heaps of countries have this under control but they don't speak English. We had it under control but there are other forces at work now who don't want us to succeed. International forces.

We have entered the world of the anti maskers.
Some men/women are simply devoid of reason.
In this realm of belief and disbelief, social media amplifies their grotesquery of logic.
It is impossible to know how much of this faux individual freedom outrage is seepage from the conspiracy swamp in America.

In the end, they believe their freedom of expression is worth more than your life! Wear a mask.
Click to expand...
Its not why it spread though. People just bent the rules.
 
As we said early in the outbreak, after reading the post that @qldfrog found analysing the virus, this will be difficult if not impossible to get a vaccine for.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-08...e-covid-19-silver-bullet-coronavirus/12521004
From the article:
WHO director-general Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus and WHO emergencies head Mike Ryan have strongly encouraged all nations to rigorously enforce health measures such as mask-wearing, social distancing, handwashing and testing.
He said face masks should become a symbol of solidarity around the world.
"A number of vaccines are now in phase three clinical trials and we all hope to have a number of effective vaccines that can help prevent people from infection," he said.

"However, there's no silver bullet at the moment — and there might never be.
"There are many vaccines under trial, a couple in the final stage of clinical trials — and there is hope," Dr Tedros said.

"It does not mean that we will have the vaccine, but at least the speed with which we reached the level we reached now is unprecedented.

"There are concerns that we may not have a vaccine that may work, or its protection could be for just a few months, not more. But until we finish the clinical trials, we will not know."
 
satanoperca said:
IFocus, I wonder if you can compare Australia with Sweden.

So I found this, thought it was interesting as it goes to the heart of your post. If Australians are more or less compliant to govnuts directives.

https://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/compare/Australia/Sweden/Crime
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That was a good find Satanoperca thanks, interesting that the murder by guns is inline with gun ownership.

I didn't really get a feel for compliance as the numbers cross over a bit through the categories , would think possibly Aust stats skewed by indigenous issues as well.

Still the Swedes appear to have a formula that works for them (that came at a heavy cost) for now and its important to remember they like everyone are still only a small step away from run away infections that we are seeing in Victoria.
People keep saying they have heard immunity which isn't the case (81,000 infections / population of 10 million)
 
Ifocus, yes the Swedish model is interesting, only time will tell whether it was the most appropriate approach.

While there deaths rates per capita are high, I believe we will see a significant increase in suicides, domestic violence, depression etc and whether people want to accept it, it is the future generations that will have to pay off the debt, that is also a human cost.

As I am located in Vic, what I am seeing on the ground is terrible, so many business will close the doors, so many people will loose their jobs and the VERY VERY BIG GENIE, is

drum roll ...............................................................................

PROPERTY PRICES TO GET SMASHED, resulting in a prolonged downturn that will cause a negative feedback loop far greater than this VIRUS.
 
We cannot survive too many lockdowns. At some point we will go broke. Sooner or later you have to expect riots as people lose everything. Its a gamble with the wait and hope method for a vaccine. Waiting for a higher % survival treatment might be the option. Then hope we can keep the death rate down.

I'm not big on just letting people die either. At some point we will either have to let people risk dying or risk financially/mentally destroying a much higher % of people.
 
Victorian coronavirus rulebreakers warned as Melbourne woman charged with attacking police officer over mask

A growing group of anti-maskers have been "baiting" and antagonising Victorian police, and in one instance smashed the head of a female officer into concrete until she was concussed, authorities say.

Key points:
  • Police say there's a trend of people calling themselves "sovereign citizens" who refuse to comply with rules
  • The Chief Commissioner said on at least four occasions in the past week, police had to smash car windows to get people's details
  • Premier Daniel Andrews said the alleged assault on the 26-year-old police officer was "fundamentally disgusting"
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-08...sovereign-citizens-amid-mask-assault/12522332
 
basilio said:
Victorian coronavirus rulebreakers warned as Melbourne woman charged with attacking police officer over mask

A growing group of anti-maskers have been "baiting" and antagonising Victorian police, and in one instance smashed the head of a female officer into concrete until she was concussed, authorities say.

Key points:
  • Police say there's a trend of people calling themselves "sovereign citizens" who refuse to comply with rules
  • The Chief Commissioner said on at least four occasions in the past week, police had to smash car windows to get people's details
  • Premier Daniel Andrews said the alleged assault on the 26-year-old police officer was "fundamentally disgusting"
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-08...sovereign-citizens-amid-mask-assault/12522332
Click to expand...
Yes I read about that today, some woman knocked a female police officer to the ground, then repeatedly smacked her head on the concrete.
It's a shame people can't get all wound up about that sort of thing, I guess it isn't emotive enough for the usual 'rent a crowd' protesters. Much better to protest against authority, rather than for it, I guess.
It would be interesting to see if we could get a crowd together, to protest for mandatory 10 year jail terms for anyone who assaults a police officer, that may actually reduce the level of force police have to use to restrain felons and solve two problems at once.
But it wouldn't get much media coverage, is my guess.
 
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