Asylum immigrants - Green Light

[luutzu]

Both orr and luutzu live in a dream land: either they are young: we all have been with the naive view of the world we all have then,
are trolls : in that case who care
Or are from some ethnic background and see themselves attacked in each negative view on islam migrants:
Well I am not from anglosaxon roots either and am a migrant;
The difference is that I lived in a contry subject to a muslim invation, as i was poor, young I lived among the estates,
and what a shock for the idealistic left leaning kid: that is the key reason I sent immigration forms to this country;
No it is not a matter of numbers,or racism as many of the north african muslims are whiter than your average italian or greek:
I was happy living in richmond among the vietnamese community when in richmond (Melb) 20y ago;
But muslims (in general: obviously I am sure you will find exception, but not along keen followers) are here to change you and if failing, to anihilate you:
there are many areas in France at least (here I know what I am talking about) were you will not go and escape physically unharmed due to your colour/background, nor do cops/firemen/social security or any form of declared authority.
And I do not wish this to happen here, just hope it is not too late..;
As for migration overall whether white, christian or not; from both an economic and an ecological point of view it is not in my view welcome in Australia today.Yes we could have more unhabitants but not with the country managed as it is, and I do not see it changing soon...
All I have to say is said here, not much more I can add, orr and luzztzu can unleash....

Let me get on my high horse. ahem... ahem...

...'ight, fight and some of you may die; run and you will live. Then years from now, lying on your death bed... would you be willing to trade this day and all the days after that for just one chance, one chance to be back here and tell our enemies that they can take our lives... but they can... never... take... our FREEEE DDDOOOOOOMMMM..



While we're at it....

As I came in here, I heard those words... creator of Man, cradle of leadership... well be careful what kind of leaders you're making here. I don't know if Charlie's silence here is right or wrong, but I know he won't sell any body out to buy his future! Now that my friend is call integrity, that's courage, that's the stuff leaders are supposed to be made of.

Now I have come to the crossroads many time in my life... and without exception I knew what the right road was but I never took it. Why? Because it is too damn hard.


----
In the end, we have to decide whether we become the person the world tries to make of us; or become the person we want to be.

While youthful ignorance and idealism often comes hand in hand; cynicism and nastiness does not have to be the result of wisdom.


OK, getting myself a scotch.

 

[DB008]

Yep, just what they need.....

Saudi Arabia offers Germany 200 mosques - one for every 100 refugees who arrived last weekend

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...fugees-who-arrived-last-weekend-10495082.html

If that ain't a massive red flag to anyone, l don't know what is.

Saudi Arabia - lets help the refugees with food, water, a roof over their heads, medical supplies, etc, etc......na, let's build a mosque (s) and spread Islam.

I think Germany still has a massive chip on their shoulders from WW2 and feels obliged to help in the way they currently are.

They say history repeats itself. I have a feeling that this is going to end in tears...

 

[qldfrog]

----
In the end, we have to decide whether we become the person the world tries to make of us; or become the person we want to be.

While youthful ignorance and idealism often comes hand in hand; cynicism and nastiness does not have to be the result of wisdom.


OK, getting myself a scotch.

Hope you enjoyed your scotch, something else you will not be able to do in many of the blessed countries
but please be sure that ignorance does not stick to you with old age; knowlege of truth can be so inconvenient
but yes i can agree with you: I too wished the world was sweet dreams and lollipops, and that my youghtful desillusion could have been true: the world would be a happier place.

But however convenient and confortable the flat earth theory can be, there is no point pretending it is real;If you do, your ship will end up llost on the high sea at the end of the travel...

 

[noco]

The father of the little girl that was drowned, no sorry that was Bill Shortens gaff, it was actually a little 3 year old boy, was the people smuggler who was employed in Turkey for 3 years and he and his family were safe from persecution....So why did he leave Turkey?



http://www.theaustralian.com.au/in-...523338355?sv=5b4a6377bbe3617094aa9e0253e3bbbf

A woman on the same boat as Alan Kurdi says the boy’s father is a people smuggler who begged her not to dob him in.

Zainab Abbas said Abdullah Kurdi had lied to the world after the image of his dead three-year-old son on a Turkish beach sparked a global outpouring of support for Syrian refugees.

“Yes, it was Abdullah Kurdi driving the boat,” Ms Abbas told Network Ten through her cousin Lara Tahseen today.

More: Boatpeople barred from intake
More: All compassion, no responsibility

A paramilitary police officer carries the lifeless body of Aylan Kurdi, three, on a beach in Turkey.

Ms Abbas also lost two children when the boat capsized shortly after leaving Bodrum for the Greek islands.

After the tragedy, Mr Kurdi told the media he took over steering the boat after the captain panicked and jumped ship.

But Ms Abbas said Mr Kurdi was the driver of the boat, and the man she paid to book her passage told her it would be safe because the driver was taking his wife and two children.

“When I lost my kids, I lost my life, how can he lie to the media?” her cousin Ms Tahseen said, translating for Ms Abbas.

“He said, ‘Please don’t dob me in.’ That was in the water.”

Ms Abbas said Mr Kurdi was speeding in the overcrowded boat, which did not have enough life jackets.

She said her husband told him to be careful just before the boat capsized, reportedly killing at least 12 people.

Ms Abbas is now in Iraq and her family has called on the federal government to include them in the 12,000 refugees Australia has pledged to take in.

Liberal senator Cory Bernardi came under fire this week, particularly from the Greens, for suggesting the Kurdi family had not fled Syria recently.

Senator Bernardi accused some “opportunistic” Syrians of seeking asylum in the West when they are “very safely ensconced” in the Middle East.

 

[noco]

There is a new movement in Germany known as PEGIDA and are very anti refugee and Muslim.....The possibility of a Nazis uprising could well occur and if it does happen those refugees could well be in for a hard time.

It could well happen in Australia if things get out of hand.....I may not see it in my life time but there will be trouble ahead.....Clashes are already starting to occur and may gather intensity in the near future.


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...523429166?sv=6fe359f5cf19e060527c4b781c1ec8cf

“The megalomaniacal master race man is back,” 51-year-old former business executive Tatjana Festerling exhorts to an enthralled crowd of more than 12,000 banner-waving PEGIDA supporters in the eastern German city of Dresden this week.

The mother of two may look sweetly mild-mannered, but she previously had implored this weekly crowd of concerned Germans to think about new book burning and the totalitarian opinion of the Left and green supporters. Now she expands on the Nazi narrative when opposing the new local €37 million ($59m) centre for 700 refugees: “The new master race also builds again the concentration camps — here in Dresden!”

In this deepest recess of the former East Germany everyone fears the unthinkable: a return to the extremes that spawned their evil Third Reich. The simmering tensions that lie very close to the surface have risen sharply in the wake of the migrant crisis, particularly in the past three months and escalating in the past three weeks.

Even those who have strongly opposed the far-right message believe the enormous influx of unchecked migrants, most with divergent religious beliefs, will fuel even more extreme views and promote violence. German vice-chancellor Sigmar Gabriel said yesterday Germany had registered 37,000 new asylum-seekers in the first eight days of this month, on top of 105,000 last month.

More: Syria: the new endgame
More: Great divide between our instincts
More: Dynamic changes global strategy

Germany will receive 800,000 refugees from the Middle East this year but the quota in this part of deeply conservative Germany is much less than the industrial north, yet the serene scenery along the River Elbe belies a fierceness of fear. Those with left-leaning views are frightened about the *vehemence of the Right, but the Right is similarly scared of the Left.

PEGIDA, which stands for Patriotic Europeans Against Western Islamisation, sprang from a gathering of far-right hooligans in Cologne less than 12 months ago but has cemented its roots in Dresden with a weekly march in the town on Monday evenings. The protests have struck a chord with many more moderate Germans who resent the large intake of migrants and their vastly different cultural backgrounds, and are indignant that they receive taxpayer benefits at the cost of developing local amenities.

Claudia Lauser, a local hotelier south of Dresden, says the movement is dangerous and all-pervasive in this area of “brown mist” — a frequently used reference here to the uprising of extremist sentiment that has connotations to the Nazi paramilitary stormtroopers, the Brownshirts. “Those at the PEGIDA marches wave red, white and black flags, which are the old colours of Germany in the Third Reich, which aren’t banned, but I always associate those colours with that period,” she says.

“Another flag they carry is the Wirmer flag, which has a weird association as Joseph Wirmer supported the circles of General (Claus von) Stauffenberg, who tried to assassinate Adolf Hitler.” PEGIDA says its flag is showing democracy.

Festerling is the outspoken face of PEGIDA, the far-right, grassroots movement that is not yet a political party but has ambitions, and increasing connections to Marine Le Pen’s National Front in France, and has arisen to counter the Bundestag’s benevolence to the migrants.

Festerling was drawn to the PEGIDA movement after writing an inflammatory appraisal of some marches in Cologne last year that was shared more than 250,000 times. Four days after the article appeared online, she says, she was sacked from her job working with train company Veolia. Feeling persecuted, she moved to Dresden to become more involved with PEGIDA.

Read more.

 

[DB008]

Islamists in Germany trying to recruit young refugees​

Berlin (AFP) - Muslim radicals in Germany are trying to recruit some of the growing numbers of asylum seekers reaching the country, according to intelligence services quoted by the German news agency DPA.

The Islamic extremists "are trying to approach the young unaccompanied refugees, who arrive in our country without their families and are particularly looking for contacts and support," a spokesman for the intelligence service in the southern state of Bavaria told DPA.

He said many of the youths are approached around reception centres but also at Munich railway station where many of the asylum seekers have arrived from Hungary and Austria in recent days.

The Islamic extremists "want to take advantage of the insecurity and distress of the refugees," he said.

On Tuesday, the intelligence services in North Rhine-Westphalia reported similar contacts in their region, noting that Islamic radicals were approaching asylum seekers through fake charities.

http://news.yahoo.com/islamists-germany-trying-recruit-young-refugees-093024733.html;_ylt=AwrC1C4SyvJVfhMAoLvQtDMD;_ylu=X3oDMTByZnU4cmNpBGNvbG8DYmYxBHBvcwM5BHZ0aWQDBHNlYwNzcg--​

 

[luutzu]

Hope you enjoyed your scotch, something else you will not be able to do in many of the blessed countries
but please be sure that ignorance does not stick to you with old age; knowlege of truth can be so inconvenient
but yes i can agree with you: I too wished the world was sweet dreams and lollipops, and that my youghtful desillusion could have been true: the world would be a happier place.

But however convenient and confortable the flat earth theory can be, there is no point pretending it is real;If you do, your ship will end up llost on the high sea at the end of the travel...

I think I have some realistic understanding of how the world works. That's why I'm into investing Well, that and because I wasn't smart enough to be a philosopher and it turns out that having money isn't such a bad thing either.

On a serious note though, I know people who might be like yourself and were idealistic, who helped a lot of people with time and money and in the end got nothing but trouble and headache for it. I have way too much case studies, of things that happen to people I know, and things that happen to me personally, that I'm pretty sure give a good and sickening picture of humanity.

But in the end, who do we want to be. A liar and a cheat like most of them; a smooth talker and brown-noser; ones who spend and keeps all the monies they make so they are well heeled, live in a nice house in a good postcode while their parents or siblings can fend for themselves.

Anyway, that's the ideal... something nice to aim for.

 

[qldfrog]

But in the end, who do we want to be. A liar and a cheat like most of them; a smooth talker and brown-noser; ones who spend and keeps all the monies they make so they are well heeled, live in a nice house in a good postcode while their parents or siblings can fend for themselves.
Anyway, that's the ideal... something nice to aim for.

I agree on that part and this should be applied here with the aboriginals terrible situation, or the young couple sleeping outside in blankets I saw this week before my commuting ride at 5AM while it was feeling quite cold.
But you have not to forget the muslim jihad in your position: we are to be destroyed for far too many of these "migrants".It is a hard fact to actually believe, but the sub human from the nazi time is how we, non muslims, are seen, as are all women.

The immigrant issue should not be separated from the muslim jihad, this is where the real issue is, all the rest is PC hiding.
Without this factor, immigration would be a balancing economic and ecological act;
and what should be done now and should have been for decades and decades is population control
6 billions can come here (in the west/wealthy countries) and we will just be all evenly poor and starving, with even richer few selected ones..

 

[SirRumpole]

Without this factor, immigration would be a balancing economic and ecological act;
and what should be done now and should have been for decades and decades is population control
6 billions can come here (in the west/wealthy countries) and we will just be all evenly poor and starving, with even richer few selected ones..

Yes indeed, we should have a population policy.

How many people, by what time , and then what ?

Thinking we can grow our population indefinitely without ending up like Calcutta or Tokyo is foolish.

Of course, people in Tokyo get by with a high population density and have a high standard of living, but how long will it last ?

 

[DB008]

I think someone asked about costs earlier on in this thread.

Finland to raise taxes on the wealthy to cover refugee costs​

* Finland expects 10-fold increase of asylum seekers

* Eurosceptic coalition partner against EU migrant quotas

* Finnish economy shrinking for fourth year, jobless rising (Adds quote, background)

Finland's government on Thursday proposed increasing capital gains tax and income tax on high earners to help pay for a 10-fold increase in refugees expected to arrive this year, its finance minister said.

The EU migrant crisis proposes a political as well as a financial challenge for the coalition, whose foreign minister, Timo Soini, heads the Eurosceptic party, The Finns, which campaigned for tighter controls on immigration.

Finance Minister Alexander Stubb said the highest bracket of capital gains tax would be raised by 1 percentage point while people earning more than 72,300 euros ($81,000) would be required to pay a so-called solidarity tax for two years, lowering the threshold from 90,000 euros.

"These will help to cover higher immigration costs which we estimate to be about 114 million euros this year," Stubb told a news conference.

The centre-right coalition, which took office in May, is struggling to cut government spending quickly in a shrinking economy where unemployment is on the rise.

Finland last week doubled its estimate for the number of asylum seekers expected this year to up to 30,000, compared with just 3,600 last year.

http://www.trust.org/item/20150910140946-mlxl6/​

 

[noco]

I think someone asked about costs earlier on in this thread.

Finland to raise taxes on the wealthy to cover refugee costs



http://www.trust.org/item/20150910140946-mlxl6/​

This is a world Islamic plot with these so called "REFUGEES" to infiltrate the west or is it an invasion?...I note the radicals in Germany are already recruiting young single Muslims into becoming Jihadists.

It is a world plot to wreck the economies of the western World and Islam and Communism are working hand in hand with that Greenie UN Secretary General Ban-Ki- Moon as their leader....It is all about world government.

Australia beware if the LUG party get back in.......They are also keen to subtly convert to socialism........The Fabian indoctrinated ABC are working and plotting 24/7 to promote their propaganda at every opportunity.

Australians should wake up before it is too late.

 

[SirRumpole]

This is a world Islamic plot with these so called "REFUGEES" to infiltrate the west or is it an invasion?...I note the radicals in Germany are already recruiting young single Muslims into becoming Jihadists.

It is a world plot to wreck the economies of the western World and Islam and Communism are working hand in hand with that Greenie UN Secretary General Ban-Ki- Moon as their leader....It is all about world government.

Australia beware if the LUG party get back in.......They are also keen to subtly convert to socialism........The Fabian indoctrinated ABC are working and plotting 24/7 to promote their propaganda at every opportunity.

Australians should wake up before it is too late.

 

[noco]

View attachment 64284

Gawd Rumpy, you are becoming desperate aren't you.......More character assassination...Is that the best you can do?
What will be your next circus clown act?

 

[noco]

Riots in Germany today.....Australia tomorrow.....Trouble ...Trouble ...spelt with a capital "T".


http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/...ny_now_home_to_riots_between_kurds_and_turks/

 

[drsmith]

The father of the little girl that was drowned, no sorry that was Bill Shortens gaff, it was actually a little 3 year old boy, was the people smuggler who was employed in Turkey for 3 years and he and his family were safe from persecution....So why did he leave Turkey?



http://www.theaustralian.com.au/in-...523338355?sv=5b4a6377bbe3617094aa9e0253e3bbbf

A woman on the same boat as Alan Kurdi says the boy’s father is a people smuggler who begged her not to dob him in.

Zainab Abbas said Abdullah Kurdi had lied to the world after the image of his dead three-year-old son on a Turkish beach sparked a global outpouring of support for Syrian refugees.

“Yes, it was Abdullah Kurdi driving the boat,” Ms Abbas told Network Ten through her cousin Lara Tahseen today.

More: Boatpeople barred from intake
More: All compassion, no responsibility

A paramilitary police officer carries the lifeless body of Aylan Kurdi, three, on a beach in Turkey.

Ms Abbas also lost two children when the boat capsized shortly after leaving Bodrum for the Greek islands.

After the tragedy, Mr Kurdi told the media he took over steering the boat after the captain panicked and jumped ship.

But Ms Abbas said Mr Kurdi was the driver of the boat, and the man she paid to book her passage told her it would be safe because the driver was taking his wife and two children.

“When I lost my kids, I lost my life, how can he lie to the media?” her cousin Ms Tahseen said, translating for Ms Abbas.

“He said, ‘Please don’t dob me in.’ That was in the water.”

Ms Abbas said Mr Kurdi was speeding in the overcrowded boat, which did not have enough life jackets.

She said her husband told him to be careful just before the boat capsized, reportedly killing at least 12 people.

Ms Abbas is now in Iraq and her family has called on the federal government to include them in the 12,000 refugees Australia has pledged to take in.

Liberal senator Cory Bernardi came under fire this week, particularly from the Greens, for suggesting the Kurdi family had not fled Syria recently.

Senator Bernardi accused some “opportunistic” Syrians of seeking asylum in the West when they are “very safely ensconced” in the Middle East.

If that's true, it just serves as a further illustration as to why illegal people smuggling shouldn't be seen as a means of achieving social objectives.

 

[luutzu]

I agree on that part and this should be applied here with the aboriginals terrible situation, or the young couple sleeping outside in blankets I saw this week before my commuting ride at 5AM while it was feeling quite cold.
But you have not to forget the muslim jihad in your position: we are to be destroyed for far too many of these "migrants".It is a hard fact to actually believe, but the sub human from the nazi time is how we, non muslims, are seen, as are all women.

The immigrant issue should not be separated from the muslim jihad, this is where the real issue is, all the rest is PC hiding.
Without this factor, immigration would be a balancing economic and ecological act;
and what should be done now and should have been for decades and decades is population control
6 billions can come here (in the west/wealthy countries) and we will just be all evenly poor and starving, with even richer few selected ones..

The subhumans you're worried about are back home working for ISIS or the dictators.

One thing you could trust the Abbott gov't on is that it would never let anyone with a hint of terrorism or jihadism in them into Australia.

And seriously, if a jihadi is as determined to get us as we're suggesting - being a trojan horse, playing the refugees, hope to survive the boat journal, go to whatever country takes you in... then years later have your cell activated... They're terrorists man, not idiots.

One, it takes a lot of training, I imagine, to get an agent that could blend in and passes all that security and vetting. Two, you wouldn't want to risk having that agent being sent wherever as a refugee. Three, you'd need a team of agents, not a couple here and there everywhere. etc. etc.

So if they are planning to attack us on our soil, they'd do it by getting a work visa or student or even a tourist visa... get to exactly where they want, when they want, and carry out their plans. That's how these kind of things are done right?


But if you're implying that they're Muslims and all Muslims are jihadists and want to convert all infidels (and Christians) or else! Well... first you'd need a big army for that kind of conversion. A few crazies with a few shotguns wouldn't be any match for the militarised police force we got going on here... and that's just the police, have they seen our armed forces?

Second, history have shown that Islam, and Muslim rulers, are more practical than that. Namely, when Islam ruled over territories with Jewish or Christian or infidel population - Spain, other part of the former Roman Empire etc... they did not force conversion nor did they execute non-Muslims. Have you seen what the Chin emperor did to the other non-Chin Chinese?


Regarding refugees... your point is only correct if you assume that all refugees will live off of welfare. Depends on their family situation, they will likely rely on welfare for first five to ten years... after that they would have known English well enough to have been working in factories or the trades, open up businesses... and soon their kids would have gone through schools and start contributing.

You might have heard of Tiger Mums right? Mothers who drove their kids to all these extra-cirrular activities and shame or whatever the poor child into overachieving... well these refugee parents could do much better and with little more than a desk lamp and a library card.

---

Regarding over-population. Discussed elsewhere where some scientists have shown that overpopulation is not the problem that's causing death and famine. And if it's a problem, it's due to the West for living too long. Most families in poor countries that earned $5 a day only have 2 children.

In terms of the refugees or the poor will make the West poorer too... well that's not true either.

It's often the rich that makes a country poor. Strange as that sounds.

Firstly, it's the poor migrants/refugees that will work the long hours on dirty jobs for low wages.. doing things most would not want to do. So economically that's a positive.

Second, they've literally escaped death. They've found new opportunities and often make the most of it.

Third, they will send money back to the old country to help their parents, siblings... Western dollars goes a long way back there.


What does the rich do to help the country anyway? Nothing.
They're often the lucky sperm who grew up with silver spoons, goes fancy schools and come out with high figure jobs handed to them. Then spend most of their time on holidays or at the tax consultant's office on how to pay no tax.

Those that does work and does use their money even do more harm. they buy politicians, get public assets privatized and with those monopolies they just collect the cash, raise prices, cut back on maintenance, fire a bunch of people and call it efficiency... then it collapses and the gov't will need to bail them out else the state won't function.

I mean, if somebody in gov't give me the "rights" to a large swathes of land to "explore" and mine, and if I found anything I pay my fair share 8 for me and 2 for you... I reckon I'd be rich and look real useful too.

 

[Ijustnewit]

This is a world Islamic plot with these so called "REFUGEES" to infiltrate the west or is it an invasion?...I note the radicals in Germany are already recruiting young single Muslims into becoming Jihadists.

It is a world plot to wreck the economies of the western World and Islam and Communism are working hand in hand with that Greenie UN Secretary General Ban-Ki- Moon as their leader....It is all about world government.

Australia beware if the LUG party get back in.......They are also keen to subtly convert to socialism........The Fabian indoctrinated ABC are working and plotting 24/7 to promote their propaganda at every opportunity.

Australians should wake up before it is too late.

Great post Noco , you probably have looked into the UN's Agenda 21 as well. As usual you are on the money , as we saw with Labor and the Greens it's social engineering to bring every individual down or up to one level.
Control their welfare and you control the population. These do gooders are either in on the act or they have know idea what the real agenda is. Australia won't wake and the people with concerns are too afraid to air their concerns fearing the racist card being played. Oh well at least you and I can say , " see told you so ".:1zhelp:
Also this Climate Change scam is another Greenie UN way to bring people into submission . Scare the hell out of them and then bleed them to death with Carbon Charges , all to save the World.

 

[drsmith]

The scam with climate change in my view is not global warming itself but rather the abuse of it to achieve broader social objectives.

The same goes for refugee resettlement. There's a role for nations to play in resettling displaced peoples fleeing persecution but the process presently is too easily corrupted by those seeking to abuse it to advance broader social objectives. That in turn opens the door for large scale illegal people smuggling operations. We've all seen the outcomes of that and continue to see the outcomes of that.

 

[drsmith]

Boom time for people smuggling into Europe,

In the past two weeks alone, an estimated 30,000 people have arrived on these beaches in Greece.

In one afternoon recently, the ABC witnessed six boats arriving in just one hour.

"I'm from Syria," declares a teenage boy as he jumps off a boat, wiping tears from his eyes.

The Turkish navy tried to make us drown. Thank God the Greeks came to help us.

"Thank you, thank you."

A mother standing next to her two young sons weeps, so relieved to have made it out of Syria.

"I'm planning on going to Germany," she says, crying.

Each of the 50 or so people climbing out of the overcrowded inflatable boat paid a smuggler in Turkey about $1,200 for their seat.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-09-...s-island-beaches-covered-life-jackets/6771478

 

[Tisme]

Riots in Germany today.....Australia tomorrow.....Trouble ...Trouble ...spelt with a capital "T".

The govt doing anything about that tomorrow to make sure we're safe or is that Bill Shorten's fault for not being a good Prime Minister ?