Wellington Capital PIF/Octaviar (MFS) PIF

breaker1 · 18 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Javier said:
WC is NOT the RE..a solicitor did some searches on our behalf and it seems that Octaviar Investment Management Limited is still the RE, but has just undergone a name change to Wellington Capital Investment Management..the RE licence is still Octaviar. She has merely purchased the management rights, this is just a way to try and keep WC as her being "accepted" by OCV means that the little clause in the PDS about a change in RE absolves OCV of the $50m Callable Facility, if we replace her then it's gone with another RE. All very smart BUT if she can't deliver on the $50m..or at least a good chunk of it..she is no different to any other RE that may present itself to us. JH better do a good deal for PIF and not a deal for OCV and Chris Scott. The solicitor also advises that there have been a zillion constitutional changes, which are only allowed without the consent of investors ONLY on the proviso these changes do not adversely affect investors. With all these losses, if there has been a constutional change that has adversely affected us, then there is cause for ASIC to investigate. Gee you know I wonder if JH really knows how much of a headache this is going to be for her AND to her rep?

She also advise us to request a list of all investors and a copy of the fund's constitution. I am hopefully meeting with her soon to advise me of other requirements and costs to move forward..will advise.

Well done Javiar!
Your part of the proof this AG actually works.

Very smart - if only Jenny and Chris can put those smarts to the benefit of investors and not OCV.

I understand, last I brought it up, that to gain access to the investor list (if we are allowed), it will cost us approx. $14,000 (correct me if I got that wrong).

seamisty · 18 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

breaker1 said:
Well done Javiar!
Your part of the proof this AG actually works.

Very smart - if only Jenny and Chris can put those smarts to the benefit of investors and not OCV.

I understand, last I brought it up, that to gain access to the investor list (if we are allowed), it will cost us approx. $14,000 (correct me if I got that wrong).

Breaker I asked someone about this when it was first mentioned and was told that they could only charge for expenses incurred in supplying the list ie. photocopying so it would pay to make further enquiries. Interesting to see the Australian Shareholders Assoc. keeping a close watch on what is happening with the PIF re the listing on the NSX and that JH and her Husbands connection. The plot thickens!! Also Javier has just backed up Tuarts info concerning the RE and the Support Facility. We are becoming a very well informed group! regards, Seamisty

Javier · 18 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

I was told that there is only negligible costs that the RE can ask for. Now do we ask WC or OCV? I will send an email to JH now and ask her for the copy of the constitution. Let's hope she answers me as I still have not received an answer back about my LLA concerns and points raised by Tuart.

marcom · 18 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Hello Javiar

Yes, we need legal advice now. It's no good AG members researching in an uncoordinated way without a knowledge of the law. I propose that AG members pay $100 each into your Solicitors Trust Fund to pay for ongoing legal work. This is not big law, simply legal research and advice on relevant legislation - we are not going to court where the costs are beyond us all. But well armed with the FACTS and knowing our legal position we can achieve a lot through negotiation.

100 members X $ 100 + $10,000 - that will buy a lot of advice.

If your solicitor needs us to incorporate so that she has a valid client entity that's fine. Otherwise I am only too happy to put the money directly into your solicitors Trust Fund - just send me the BSB and A/C details. I know some AG members are in financial difficulties but be assured this is a very necessary investment in our future.

iamspeed · 18 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Javier said:
WC is NOT the RE..a solicitor did some searches on our behalf and it seems that Octaviar Investment Management Limited is still the RE, but has just undergone a name change to Wellington Capital Investment Management..the RE licence is still Octaviar.

That is mentioned in the 2nd paragraph of the attached.

Javier · 18 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

I was told by someone very high up in MFS when the whole RBOS thing was unravelling that they were NEVER going to get the liquidators in as it would be very bad publicity to put the sword thru a fund where the majority of the investors were retirees and mum & dad punters. Let's not forget that RBOS owns Bankwest here in Oz. Someone from Bankwest told me that RBOS was one of the richest banks in the world (I think 3rd largest in Europe) and that they could buy all the big 4 banks here in Aust and still have plenty of cash left over. So I don't think they were ever worried about not getting their money, especially with all the loans that were being paid back within an avg of 6.9 months.

The loan was in fact for $200mil to PIF not $184m, they took our $16m that was in cash held in deposits in one foul swoop..that's a lot of Scotch Finger Biscuits and Glenfiddich!

iamspeed · 18 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Exactly my point Javier.

Then we get JH saying she saved the day and it would have all fallen in a hole without her. She's done nothing (yet) and we owe her nothing. I still have a feeling Chris Scott is somewhere behind this and will try to cash in at some stage down the track? He must be fuming after dropping a few hundred million in MFS shares.

Rocky1 · 18 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

I support the $100 x 100 for legal advice.

Also can anyone advise if we (the investors or AG) have the power to stop the PIF being listed on the NSX. I spoke to a national manager within OCV/PIF yesterday and he suggested we would

Very interesting to read that we would only have to pay minimal costs to get a copy of the list of investors. When I approached a PIF representative about this they mentioned a figure of $14,000.

selciper · 18 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Marcom is spot on. $100 contribution by each of us is necessary now. We should view the $100 as an investment. Solicitors digging deep into all this may eventually save us thousands of dollars. If it turns out that all's well as it stands, we at least would have that legal reassurance. We need it to confidently plan future moves. My thanks to Javier for his efforts and, of course, Breaker!.

Janiss · 18 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

I agree - $100 is a very small price to pay for necessary legal advice, considering the amount we may stand to lose if we make an uninformed decision.
Having an incorporated legal entity set up with proper legal backing will give the Action Group far more credibility and power, while protecting the individual members. Possibly the $100 per member can go into a general fighting fund account as there will also be costs associated with Action Group meetings which can be paid from this fund (e.g. advertising, printing, venue hire).

Juan Mortyme · 18 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

iamspeed said:
Not sure if it has been mentioned on this (ever growing) thread before? Trojan (buyer of PIFs holding in GEO) chairman is Andrew Kemp and he was on the board of S8 (Chris Scott's business taken over by MFS). JH was also on the board of S8 or at the minimum an adviser to Chris. I saw a report saying that Chris used to be a part owner of WC?? .

On WC's website ("In the Press" link) there is an interview with JH from the 21st April 2007 GC Weekend Bulletin Paradise Magazine where she says the following about CS in the 4th column of page 3: " 'He really encouraged me with Wellington Capital - in fact he owns half the business - so he backed me to do it and it was that push that I needed' ".
http://www.wellcap.com.au/articles/21-04-2007 - Changing focus - GC Bulletin.pdf

Cheers,
Juan

Javier · 18 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

It's not just legal advice we need to think about but also Power of Attorney. OK so we get 100 signatures, fine..but we must then get 100 signatures every time we have to deal with something. My legal advisor tells me that it's crazy and logistically impossible. We have to provide someone with that power of attorney. It can be revoked at any time if you all feel uncomfortable. Let's face it. noone here has even met one another, BUT hey we have never met JH either and she is wheeling and dealing with our money as we speak. I am seeing the lawyer in Sydney (CBD) very soon..who wants the power of attorney? Maybe she can even have it to deal with on our behalf, I am not ego driven plus as I said do not want my name in the papers, but someone has to be the man or woman (maybe 2 people) but it must be done this way or else we will get too bogged down. Does someone have any suggestions? She will also advise costs, and I will get account / trust details. Tuart is trying to get a meeting happening with a Sydney newspaper journo for me so that we may have an AG meeting in there . They have mics etc. and we will get a write up as the action group has not had any real exposure in the Sydney papers where supposedly (in NSW) is where most of investors are. Folks we really need to think about the whole Power of Attorney..very important in an incorporated committee scenario.

breaker1 · 19 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Juan Mortyme said:
On WC's website ("In the Press" link) there is an interview with JH from the 21st April 2007 GC Weekend Bulletin Paradise Magazine where she says the following about CS in the 4th column of page 3: " 'He really encouraged me with Wellington Capital - in fact he owns half the business - so he backed me to do it and it was that push that I needed' ".
http://www.wellcap.com.au/articles/21-04-2007 - Changing focus - GC Bulletin.pdf

Cheers,
Juan

"...in fact he owns half the business..so he backed me"

Chris Scott backed WC, with money no doubt, to own half. Amazing! So, if this still is the case (story only 2 months old) and the real RE is still OCVIM, Chris Scott must very well, still be in the picture with our PIF operations. Chris Scott should appear at the forum meetings, he has to be pulling some major strings with the PIF!

Chris Scott may be the real decision maker in dealings with us!

Cookie1 · 19 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Breaker1,

The interview with JH is from April 2007 (not '08) but that doesn't mean that CS is not still a major player. There are questions to be asked!

Cookie1

wally3218 · 19 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

So with Chris Scott owning half of WC it was probably his idea for JH to get WC to take over the management rights.
He definately should turn up to the forum meetings and explain all this paper shuffling they are doing. I hope it's in our best interests and their not just looking after their own interests.
We do need someone independant checking up on these deals their making with our money. Legal advice seems very necessary since asic does'nt seem to do anything untill it's to late.

DoraNBoots · 19 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Duped said:
... If anyone has any IT skills, perhaps we can set up a website and keep this info in one place and up to date.

.

Hi Everyone,

I would like to suggest we use Yahoo Groups for our discussions. It can be used in the same way we are using this forum (i.e. lurkers are welcome to read discussion threads) but has heaps of other features for those willing to ‘join’ the group.

Joining the group means creating a yahoo account (just as you had to create an Aussie Stock Forum account if you wanted to post to this forum). The extra features include:
•A group calendar
•A central location for attachments (currently it is too hard to go back and find attachments on this 16 page thread)
•It enables multiple threads to be created for each topic of discussion
•We can create polls and get an idea of how people feel about certain topics.
•We can create databases and other more advanced features if needed.

I think the group is going to grow quickly (especially after the WC updates in July) and so need a better way to organise our information and keep everyone up to date.

I have created an example Yahoo Group at this link http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/PIFActionGroup. If you want to see the full features of the group you will need to ‘join the group’. Please note this is just an example and it will be deleted (so not to cause confusion) if it’s decided not to use Yahoo.

Regards,
Dora.

marcom · 19 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Just read the Wellington PIF investor update posted as an attachment on iamspeed post No 367 re commencement of distributions:

" When will distributions recommence?

The new board is currently proposing to make capital payments to investors after the debt facility has been repaid or
arrangements have been made to refinance the debt".

That means we will only be getting what ever is left of our CAPITAL investment repaid over a period of time WITHOUT INTEREST is this correct???

I have not received the WC PIF Investor Update by email or mail and it is not on the WC website - has anyone else received it? Another appalling public relations blunder by WC

The Update refers to a registration form for attendance at the WC forums that has to be completed and returned before 30 June (11 days away) - Where's the form Jenny????????????

sak · 19 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

As I understand it a pdf was emailed to your investment advisor late last week
sorry should have said all investment advisors

Rocky1 · 19 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Apparently letters with registration forms where sent late last week/early this week.

As not all of us invested through advisor's what was the bloody use in sending it to them first - we have invested the money not advisor's.

The more I hear about the way WC is handling this the more I become annoyed.

Capital repayments may EVENTUALLY see us get SOME of our capital back but we joined this fund to receive DISTRIBUTIONS.

Enough is enough!!!!!!!!

DeliaMC · 19 June 2008

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

marcom said:
Just read the Wellington PIF investor update posted as an attachment on iamspeed post No 367 re commencement of distributions:

" When will distributions recommence?

The new board is currently proposing to make capital payments to investors after the debt facility has been repaid or
arrangements have been made to refinance the debt".

That means we will only be getting what ever is left of our CAPITAL investment repaid over a period of time WITHOUT INTEREST is this correct???

I have not received the WC PIF Investor Update by email or mail and it is not on the WC website - has anyone else received it? Another appalling public relations blunder by WC

The Update refers to a registration form for attendance at the WC forums that has to be completed and returned before 30 June (11 days away) - Where's the form Jenny????????????

Marcom, if you go to www.newpif.com.au you can download the Registration Form from Wellington's website.

Wellington Capital PIF/Octaviar (MFS) PIF

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