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The Abbott Government

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Logique said:
Savva wouldn't be far wrong Doc.

Here's the thing for Malcolm Turnbull, he has an inner city 'latte' sort of electorate. If he doesn't do something, he is at grave risk of being swept away with the party at the next election, which in the wake of the Greece/Vic/QLD elections, looks to be odds on now in Australia.

That Tasmanian Indep (now) Senator was right about one thing on Q&A the other night, a government can't bottle it on fair taxation of the big end of town, then turn around and nail poor folks with an extra $7 to see the doctor. Aussies won't wear that.
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I think the plan was to get the co-payment through between elections and put broader tax reform to the next election. No marks for trust there but that's been our political landscape for a long time.

The co-payment could have been much better handled. Firstly, for pensioners IIRC it was only to apply to the first 10 visits. A solution there would have been to increase the annual pension by $70. That creates a price signal and avoids disadvantage. Reducing the rebate for short visits out of the blue as plan B was itself a political shocker. That apparently was a recommendation of the ERC.

I note the Nationals leader Warren Truss has weighed in to the Liberal leadership debate. At face value he's supporting TA but underneath it might be more of a case of warning any new Liberal leader about their expectations as part of the Coalition. If Malcolm does become PM, he'll quickly discover any lefty love affair with him is more about the downfall of a Coalition PM than it is about himself.
 
We are at a huge crossroads at the political level of Governments in Australia.

Due to very pressing personal problems of holding families together, maintaining mortgage payments etc., the hurt is transforming people to radical thinking.

In South Australia last year we saw a senior Liberal switch allegiance and swap his position to sit on the ALP benches.

If the Rabbit demise is not soon resolved with his carcass to hang on the fence then back benchers fromthe Libs could well cross the floor, and not onlychange Government to the ALP but go to the Governor General saying stalemate we have to have an election.

This thought occurred to me whilst watching Bill Shorten address the media this morning. Have not given much hede to him due to discussions I have had over the years with persons in Unions over which he has presided. Tends to be a bit much to the right in my view, not that I am a leftie. (consider myself a moderate which tries to be inclusive of all)

So in all a total washout spill could be the go. Oh and, shorten offers real substance and alternatives in a way I have not seen for along time. Take note when next you see him speaking.

Just me little :2twocents
 
IFocus said:
Abbott is terminal just a matter of how and when.

No matter who takes over its pretty much a poison chalice with the Coalition destroying its political capital over pithy idealogical pay backs and budget measures that actually are unfair and don't address the rising debt that the Coalition have by increasing spending on their pet projects.

Throw in to that a slowing economy, rising unemployment and falling business sentiment still a good chance of a one term government as the punters thrash around looking for a government that actual governs like adults.

If Turnbul then at least there will be some intellect put into policy but whether Turnbul can manage the politics is another matter.

For the record I don't think Shorten is the answer but Labor over all would be fairer and likely to spend far less than the current mob.
To qualify that still waiting for Hockey and Abbott to cut Labors wasteful spending......any news on that front anyone?
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+1 re Turnbull being able to put some intellect into the leadership.

The problem is, there is too little intellect to be found among the rest of them, and too much stubborn and one-eyed ideology. The leader can be as intelligent and broad-minded as you like; his cabinet colleagues persist with flawed concepts, neglect basic science, and smash globally accepted remedies just because Labor suggested them first.

The term "Noalition" sums it up quite succinctly: Abbott & Co got elected because they said No to anything and everything that Labor suggested; their only goal was to block Labor and get back into government themselves. They had no other plan of their own, which became clear in the lead-up to the 2013 elections. To the last day, all people heard was vague motherhood statements, a number of broad promises - "no cuts to Medicare/ Pensions/ Education funding/ ABC funding ..." - and scare mongering. Apart from the dyed-in-the-wool Lib-Nat voters, it only took a small group of disgruntled (or gullible) swingers to tip the balance 90:55 in the Coalition's favour.

But quantity does not guarantee quality. As long as he relies on blockheads, any leader will be destined to fail.
 
explod said:
Oh and, shorten offers real substance and alternatives in a way I have not seen for along time. Take note when next you see him speaking.

Just me little :2twocents
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Yeah I don't think so. Shorten is terrible but has managed to keep his head down and not be noticed. He will crumble once in the spotlight with his history
I don't know what labor party you lot are looking at. They couldn't bang two brain cells together if they all stood in a circle and simultaneous headbutted each other.
 
SirRumpole said:
Same goes for relying on broken promises and half baked policies like the co contribution.
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of course.
... and don't forget the mothers-to-be, who were counting on the promised PPL payment.

Maybe our Federal Pollies should take a look at West-German history, specifically from December 1966 to 1969.
Google "Grand Coalition Germany 1966" or start here http://pnz.sagepub.com/content/22/1/52.extract

Between the two parties, they just might muster a sufficient number of reasonably intelligent and capable parliamentarians capable of setting in motion some plans that last longer than to the next election. (but I don't hold my breath... :1zhelp: )
 
moXJO said:
Yeah I don't think so. Shorten is terrible but has managed to keep his head down and not be noticed. He will crumble once in the spotlight with his history
I don't know what labor party you lot are looking at. They couldn't bang two brain cells together if they all stood in a circle and simultaneous headbutted each other.
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He would not be where he is if he were terrible. I certainly pointed out my concerns with him in the post but was focused on how he seems to be developing of late. . I must admit it is not hard to look better than the Government front bench at the moment though.

Instead of our tendency to skim read to collect what we desire, re-read my post and start looking for usefull content that desceibes how the aims will be achieved . Abbott and most of his front bench have no idea of such concepts.
 
explod said:
We are at a huge crossroads at the political level of Governments in Australia.
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I remember your little :2twocents worth on how Labor was going to win the 2013 election with 55% 2PP.

If only I had a dollar for every time you said it.

And what's this nonsense about Bill Shorten being too far too the right ?

For a start he won't turn back the boats because Tanya won't let him, let alone the Greens.
 
drsmith said:
For a start he won't turn back the boats because Tanya won't let him, let alone the Greens.
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If Federal Labor have the turnaround that Qld Labor did, the Greens wont matter. As for the boats it would be very difficult for Labor to reverse a successful policy that is obviously politically popular so I think they will keep doing the same. I think (and hope) that they are not foolish enough to add any heat back into the asylum seeker debate after Morrison successfully hosed it down.
 
SirRumpole said:
If Federal Labor have the turnaround that Qld Labor did, the Greens wont matter. As for the boats it would be very difficult for Labor to reverse a successful policy that is obviously politically popular so I think they will keep doing the same. I think (and hope) that they are not foolish enough to add any heat back into the asylum seeker debate after Morrison successfully hosed it down.
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They reversed the Howard Government's successful policies after the 2007 election and unwilling to learn from that failure, Bill Shorten doesn't support turnbacks.

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...or-support-for-turnbacks-20141028-11cwt6.html

A Labor government would crawl back into bed with the Greens for a senate majority. Lets not forget the Gillard government did just that in the reps as a result of the hung parliament in 2010.
 
drsmith said:
I remember your little :2twocents worth on how Labor was going to win the 2013 election with 55% 2PP.

If only I had a dollar for every time you said it.

And what's this nonsense about Bill Shorten being too far too the right ?

For a start he won't turn back the boats because Tanya won't let him, let alone the Greens.
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And so we should not. We are all leople of the world and need to share. In considerable detail I explained how we could handle the boat people within our own shores to our advantage. But no one wants to take on visionary thoughts or good long term plans to help people to help themselves and in turn they then help all of us.

And a number of posters had the LNP in the recent election in QLD., to bolt it in and they too were wrong. And what does that have to do with our subject for discussion anyway.
 
explod said:
And so we should not. We are all leople of the world and need to share. In considerable detail I explained how we could handle the boat people within our own shores to our advantage. But no one wants to take on visionary thoughts or good long term plans to help people to help themselves and in turn they then help all of us.
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I can't remember. You're free to remind us.

It might even be a pass on someone else's prevention index.

explod said:
And a number of posters had the LNP in the recent election in QLD., to bolt it in and they too were wrong. And what does that have to do with our subject for discussion anyway.
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The betting markets certainly did. Did you put some $$ on Labor ?

You could have made a killing.

I don't recall anyone repeatedly suggesting 55% 2PP to the LNP in the Queensland election despite the fact it was obviously going to be a closer contest than the 2013 federal election.
 
Doc, you keep banging on about the boats but the political salience of no boats in 2016 will be negligible. It would be like trying to run on the fear of ebola.
 
banco said:
Doc, you keep banging on about the boats but the political salience of no boats in 2016 will be negligible. It would be like trying to run on the fear of ebola.
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I think Labor and the Greens would prefer it be less successful than that.
 
drsmith said:
I don't recall anyone repeatedly suggesting 55% 2PP to the LNP in the Queensland election despite the fact it was obviously going to be a closer contest than the 2013 federal election.
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Yes, got a few of you stired up well.

If you sometimes look beyond your own thoughts and emotions it will be recognized that pebbles are sometimes tossed into the pool. Good for ballancing one sided gloating.

Again this has nothing to do with the conversation at hand and is in fact typical of Abbott and particularly Pine of not answering questions asked but stating something irrelevant to it. And of course with no content or substance on which people can garner any confidence in them or the Government.
 
drsmith said:
The betting markets certainly did. Did you put some $$ on Labor ?

You could have made a killing.

.
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I did, but still waiting for my payout ... small wager for fun.

One of the things I'm rather interested in is the anger from the 30+ish yearolds on my facebook who didn't want Labor and the bogey of red tape, continuous change and helicoptering that Labor is apt to provide. Many of these friends have boutique businesses that need continuous attention, but compliance changes make that difficult.
 
explod said:
Yes, got a few of you stired up well.

If you sometimes look beyond your own thoughts and emotions it will be recognized that pebbles are sometimes tossed into the pool. Good for ballancing one sided gloating.

Again this has nothing to do with the conversation at hand and is in fact typical of Abbott and particularly Pine of not answering questions asked but stating something irrelevant to it. And of course with no content or substance on which people can garner any confidence in them or the Government.
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You're the one who referred to the Queensland election result in defence of your own way off federal election forecasts.

My bolds.

Tisme said:
One of the things I'm rather interested in is the anger from the 30+ish yearolds on my facebook who didn't want Labor and the bogey of red tape, continuous change and helicoptering that Labor is apt to provide. Many of these friends have boutique businesses that need continuous attention, but compliance changes make that difficult.
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I did say something about partying and hangovers in the Queensland election thread,

drsmith said:
Did Labor expect a result where they could claim office ?

The electorate didn't. Queenslanders clearly like to party but now we wait to see the extent of the hangover.
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https://www.aussiestockforums.com/f...t=29385&page=7&p=859109&viewfull=1#post859109
 
Simpkin moved a spill motion.
to be discussed on Tuesday in the Party Room.

that didn't take long :rolleyes:
 
drsmith said:
You're the one who referred to the Queensland election result in defence of your own way off federal election forecasts.

My bolds.


I did say something about partying and hangovers in the Queensland election thread,



https://www.aussiestockforums.com/f...t=29385&page=7&p=859109&viewfull=1#post859109
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I have not tried to defend my way off prediction of the Federal Election at all. In regard to that I was very wrong.

However my point is, we can all be wrong and are at times. I certainly did not expect or know(being an interstater) what result to expect.

But because I did make a point on how dumb some of the current leaders are, and have been I might add, just like them you took me to task on an irrelevancy that you could detract from the issue under discussion.

And they are trained for it. In my past employ I was put through a media awareness course and we were trained on answering a question with what you wanted to get across and not necessarily what was sought by the question.

But the public are fed up with this evasiveness.
 
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