Israel - Palestine

[wayneL]

50 On the plains of Moab by the Jordan across from Jericho the Lord said to Moses, 51 “Speak to the Israelites and say to them: ‘When you cross the Jordan into Canaan, 52 drive out all the inhabitants of the land before you. Destroy all their carved images and their cast idols, and demolish all their high places. 53 Take possession of the land and settle in it, for I have given you the land to possess. 54 Distribute the land by lot, according to your clans. To a larger group give a larger inheritance, and to a smaller group a smaller one. Whatever falls to them by lot will be theirs. Distribute it according to your ancestral tribes.

55 “‘But if you do not drive out the inhabitants of the land, those you allow to remain will become barbs in your eyes and thorns in your sides. They will give you trouble in the land where you will live. 56 And then I will do to you what I plan to do to them.’”

The Bible Numbers 33:50-56




This quote from the bible starts Chapter 12 of Robert Fisks 'The Great War for Civilisation'
The preceeding chapter 'Fifty Thousand Miles from Palestine' gives an exceptionally detailed potted history of the formation of modern Israel. The first ten pages of chapter 11 on Grand Mufti Al Haj Mohamed Amin al-Husseini.
It would be for people wanting to gain an understanding of the subject, far beyond a few vapid minutes of youtube so riddled with omission as to be less than worthless.

It is not for no reason Fisk's work I referanced in the "100 books to read' thread.

Perhaps, considering the theme of your post, you may want to consider your own ommissions.

 

[moXJO]

View attachment 171944

So this is a fair question

This is a client of mine, a beautiful middle-aged traditional Jewish woman, single, not at all interested in politics etc.

Since Oct 7 aftermath, her and her extended family (who I also know) have been frequently subjected to abuse. This message is regarding what is going on in Perth as I type this post and her and her family are quite frankly, terrified about the future.

I have no idea what to say to her because I really don't think that I can say anything remotely comforting with any sort of honesty.

A reason why a lot of those Palestinians are in Australia is because of the jews.

 

[wayneL]

A reason why a lot of those Palestinians are in Australia is because of the jews.

Because Israel defends itself?

Anyway, the Jews living here had no part in that, and largely descended from refugees themselves. Why should they feel threatened?

 

[Knobby22]

I thought this was a particularly sad story.
The Gazan woman who had spent 10 years including 3 IVF treatments to get pregnant to finally have twin babies who were born just before the war started, and then have them both die from an airstrike.

After 10 years of trying, a Palestinian woman had twins. An Israeli strike killed them both

It took years of in vitro fertilisation for Rania Abu Anza to become pregnant, and only seconds for her to lose her five-month-old twins, a boy and a girl.

www.theage.com.au

“I didn’t get enough of them,” she said. “I swear I didn’t get enough of them.”

 

[Knobby22]

I hate looking at this stuff. Only look at it now and again but heard a professor on RN talk about the situation on the ground and so had a look. Honestly, I know what we think doesn't matter and we are just bystanders.

Starvation is rampant, especially in the north. Deaths of multiple children and babies in particular of dehydration (dysentry) and starvation.
I don't think the USA will put up with that much longer, especially as they have other allies in the middle east who are furious.

It's a smart move by the USA to build the port to help.

If you been closely following what the USA has been saying they have been gradually ratcheting the pressure on Israel.
Something has to give on Israel's side. Israel need to work something out lest they be accused of genocide.

Gazan children dying after months of famine warnings

After months of warnings over the risk of famine in Gaza, children are starting to die.

www.nzherald.co.nz

That kid below didn't make it. He had cerebral palsy so he was probably the child to miss out.
Obviously, most don't make it to the hospital.

 

[wayneL]

I hate looking at this stuff. Only look at it now and again but heard a professor on RN talk about the situation on the ground and so had a look. Honestly, I know what we think doesn't matter and we are just bystanders.

Starvation is rampant, especially in the north. Deaths of multiple children and babies in particular of dehydration (dysentry) and starvation.
I don't think the USA will put up with that much longer, especially as they have other allies in the middle east who are furious.

It's a smart move by the USA to build the port to help.

If you been closely following what the USA has been saying they have been gradually ratcheting the pressure on Israel.
Something has to give on Israel's side. Israel need to work something out lest they be accused of genocide.

Gazan children dying after months of famine warnings

After months of warnings over the risk of famine in Gaza, children are starting to die.

www.nzherald.co.nz

That kid below didn't make it. He had cerebral palsy so he was probably the child to miss out.
Obviously, most don't make it to the hospital.

View attachment 172504

(Assuming this is fair dinkum and not just another example of Palestinian propaganda)

Now do Yemen Syria Iraq Libya etc and other Muslim on Muslim conflicts, which have accounted for many hundreds of thousands of more deaths, including the starvation of children.

And if you don't, you have to admit to yourself that basically your post is either anti- Jewish, or that you have been propagandized

 

[Knobby22]

(Assuming this is fair dinkum and not just another example of Palestinian propaganda)

Now do Yemen Syria Iraq Libya etc and other Muslim on Muslim conflicts, which have accounted for many hundreds of thousands of more deaths, including the starvation of children.

And if you don't, you have to admit to yourself that basically your post is either anti- Jewish, or that you have been propagandized

No I vehemently disagree. It is not a lie and not anti Jewish.
The War has to take place, Hamas have to be defeated, but care has to be taken.

If you disagree with any point then make your case. The facts are there. No point in just accusing me. I think you have been propagandised if you aren't aware of what is happening.

I am sure that it can be done better at this point in time. If you are the good guys then you have to act as them. I believe that it's Netanyahu, who is very unpopular in Israel, that needs to be replaced so this can be completed in a better manner.

Benny Gatz would be a good replacement. He has been meeting world leaders and his time will come soon. He is on the war committee and was going to PM under a deal with Netanyahu, but it went awry. Netanyahu knows that any break in the war would likely see him removed.

Benny Gantz - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[wayneL]

No I vehemently disagree. It is not a lie and not anti Jewish.
The War has to take place, Hamas have to be defeated, but care has to be taken.

If you disagree with any point then make your case. The facts are there. No point in just accusing me. I think you have been propagandised if you aren't aware of what is happening.

I am sure that it can be done better at this point in time. If you are the good guys then you have to act as them. I believe that it's Netanyahu, who is very unpopular in Israel, that needs to be replaced so this can be completed in a better manner.

Benny Gatz would be a good replacement. He has been meeting world leaders and his time will come soon. He is on the war committee and was going to PM under a deal with Netanyahu, but it went awry. Netanyahu knows that any break in the war would likely see him removed.

Benny Gantz - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

War is hell, of course bad **** is happening, weather or not the article reflects the truth. My folk lived through the blitz... Do you think there might have been a few stories coming out of that, call even from the other side, Dresdon, Tokyo etc.... And dozens of other conflicts in between

What is unique is that western leftists highlighting what the Palestinians want you to highlight, while you curiously ignore what happens in other conflicts.

Why is that?

Indeed you people ignore of misery in other Middle eastern conflicts that do not involve Israel.

Do you know about that? If not, why not? If you do, why do you not highlight the misery in those places?

What's different? The oldest racism on the planet.

 

[Knobby22]

War is hell, of course bad **** is happening, weather or not the article reflects the truth. My folk lived through the blitz... Do you think there might have been a few stories coming out of that, call even from the other side, Dresdon, Tokyo etc.... And dozens of other conflicts in between

What is unique is that western leftists highlighting what the Palestinians want you to highlight, while you curiously ignore what happens in other conflicts.

Why is that?

Indeed you people ignore of misery in other Middle eastern conflicts that do not involve Israel.

Do you know about that? If not, why not? If you do, why do you not highlight the misery in those places?

What's different? The oldest racism on the planet.

You just go into personal attack and call me names. Childish.

Let me tell you something, what is going on at this moment needs to be handled better and most countries around the world agree and many Jews agree.

It will hurt Israel if this continues without some improvement.

 

[wayneL]

You just go into personal attack and call me names. Childish.

Let me tell you something, what is going on at this moment needs to be handled better and most countries around the world agree and many Jews agree.

It will hurt Israel if this continues without some improvement.

Where did I call you a name?

Why don't you address my points?

 

[Dona Ferentes]

.
I don't think the USA will put up with that much longer, especially as they have other allies in the middle east who are furious.

Not as I understand it.

Hamas is designated a terrorist organisation by Egypt, which incidentally shares a border with Gaza. A fortified no pasaran one at that.

Saudi was on the cusp of having a rapprochement with Israel in the months prior to 07 Oct. Recognition, ambassadors, those kinds of things .

if you scroll back, my post 315 on that day of infamy was along these lines:

It's on again .... with an emboldened Iran happy to fight the West to the last Palestinian

and I don't see what's changed; and with Houthi on board, it's worse

 

[Knobby22]

Where did I call you a name?

Why don't you address my points?

Read what you wrote. Why didn't you address my points rather than personally attack me?

 

[wayneL]

Read what you wrote. Why didn't you address my points rather than personally attack me?

Where did I call you a name?

 

[Knobby22]

Not as I understand it.

Hamas is designated a terrorist organisation by Egypt, which incidentally shares a border with Gaza. A fortified no pasaran one at that.

Saudi was on the cusp of having a rapprochement with Israel in the months prior to 07 Oct. Recognition, ambassadors, that kind of things .

if you scroll back, my post 315 on that day of infamy was along these lines:

and I don't see what's changed; and with Houthi on board, it's worse

Hamas has to be destroyed and Isreal has the support of most but the USA doesn't want to see mass starvation.

 

[Knobby22]

Where did I call you a name?

Read it.

 

[SirRumpole]

I would suggest that better results maybe achieved if Israel occupied Gaza and took over the distribution of food, energy etc so that they then become the good guys and Hamas is on the outer with the population. That seems better than just flattening the whole place but less fun for Netanyhu perhaps.

 

[wayneL]

Where did I call you a name Knobby?

 

[wayneL]

I would suggest that better results maybe achieved if Israel occupied Gaza and took over the distribution of food, energy etc so that they then become the good guys and Hamas is on the outer with the population. That seems better than just flattening the whole place but less fun for Netanyhu perhaps.

It's a nice idea but you would still have active terrorists who would be trying to kill Jews... And have much more opportunity to do so.

 

[wayneL]

@Knobby22 @SirRumpole - What Israel is faced with.

 

[IFocus]

I don't how people cannot separate Jews / Israeli's from Netanyahu's government.

Netanyahu is leading the most extremist governments in Israel's history such is his desperation to hold power and stay out of jail.

Some of his leading ministers in this whole debacle are convicted criminals, the security failures on Oct 7th were the worse in Israel's history and any normal PM would have been gone Oct 8th.

Scary that he is so much like Trump.

PS. 4 Corners has had a good look at this and asked the hard questions.