Islam: Is it inherently Evil?

[luutzu]

That's the whole problem. It's rarely a choice.

The more primitive the religion, the more likely the community's identity is enmeshed in it. To break free is to risk excomunication or even death.

All religion are primitive. And all religion have its fair share of religious nuts.

We might like to believe that Christians or Jews are all enlightened and nut-free; or that it's just superior and have no stupid superstition and voodoo crab. But that's just wrong, and a few seconds on google will prove it.

 

[luutzu]

Maybe they may have the guts to get out of a dominated relationship if they no longer have to wear the chains of submission.

One thing is for sure - if their dress are banned, they won't have many opportunity going to see community services or run into other women who could tell them where to go and what to do when the husband beat them up or whatever.

 

[Value Collector]

Maybe they may have the guts to get out of a dominated relationship if they no longer have to wear the chains of submission.

I find telling women what not to wear, to be just as bad as telling them what to wear.

Religion and government need to get out of the wardrobe, and let women decide what is best for them.

 

[MrBurns]

Maybe they may have the guts to get out of a dominated relationship if they no longer have to wear the chains of submission.

Doesn't just apply to Muslims.

 

[bellenuit]

Maybe they may have the guts to get out of a dominated relationship if they no longer have to wear the chains of submission.

I have read so many articles written by outspoken muslim women who want the West to ban the more repressive forms of dress as it would greatly assist Muslim women in general in confronting their husbands and, more often, the extreme fellow muslims in their locality. The regressive left and in particular the feminist movement who continually fail to understand that their dress code is rarely a voluntary choice is to them heartbreaking.

 

[luutzu]

I find telling women what not to wear, to be just as bad as telling them what to wear.

Religion and government need to get out of the wardrobe, and let women decide what is best for them.

I don't think any men would mind this Muslim garb

 

[wayneL]

Grasshopper, what do you think of western VIPs covering their hair in muslim countries?

 

[SirRumpole]

I find telling women what not to wear, to be just as bad as telling them what to wear.

Religion and government need to get out of the wardrobe, and let women decide what is best for them.

Trouble is it's their husbands that decide, not the women.

 

[luutzu]

Grasshopper, what do you think of western VIPs covering their hair in muslim countries?

I thought how lucky we are to live in a free country where the government and God's chosen clerics don't force people how to dress.


You were thinking maybe I'd say "house rules" or something right Sifu

 

[luutzu]

Trouble is it's their husbands that decide, not the women.

We're assuming that.

But say it's the husband and the clerics that force the women how to dress... what are we doing by putting our foot down, pass a bill that tell them how to dress?


Sometime it could just be that that's how it was done back in the old country, and given enough time, they might rethink that it's no longer for them.

Would forcing a ban do more harm than good?

 

[SirRumpole]

We're assuming that.

But say it's the husband and the clerics that force the women how to dress... what are we doing by putting our foot down, pass a bill that tell them how to dress?


Sometime it could just be that that's how it was done back in the old country, and given enough time, they might rethink that it's no longer for them.

Would forcing a ban do more harm than good?

It's a cultural difference. We don't trust people whose faces we can't see and if other cultures want to live here they should adapt to our culture, not the other way around.

 

[Macquack]

One thing is for sure - if their dress are banned, they won't have many opportunity going to see community services or run into other women who could tell them where to go and what to do when the husband beat them up or whatever.

I don't buy that argument. If the burqa was banned, do you think all these women would just lock themselves in their house?

Anyway, the French government are making sure that the next generation of muslim women will be "free" of this ridiculous shackle to an archaic custom.

The French government are not just picking on muslims -

The wearing of all conspicuous religious symbols in public schools was previously banned in 2004 by a different law, the French law on secularity and conspicuous religious symbols in schools. This affected the wearing of Islamic veils and headscarves in schools, as well as turbans and other distinctive items of dress.

 

[Macquack]

Your jokes (Tisme) can be too... mmm deep. Dumb it down a few notch McGuiness.

Back to agreeing with you luutzu. I know I am a bit slow on the uptake, but with all his cryptic twists, I haven't EVER got a f***ing clue what Tisme is going on about.

 

[luutzu]

I don't buy that argument. If the burqa was banned, do you think all these women would just lock themselves in their house?

Anyway, the French government are making sure that the next generation of muslim women will be "free" of this ridiculous shackle to an archaic custom.

The French government are not just picking on muslims -

Don't know. If the women (or their husband) weren't too serious about the burqa then sure, they'll just take it off and go out. If they're quite serious about it, the husband will either have to do all the work, the women sneaks out while he's away, or she'll just stay home.

I'm not sure it's a good idea to bet that they're just bluffing.

If the French were serious about the next generation of girls etc., they shouldn't need to.

All parents will learn quick smart that their children ought to adapt. That certain cultural and religious practices will have to be eased off or either the kids won't have many opportunity to study and advanced, or the kid will leave home and run away, or stay home.

I wouldn't want to say no parents are that ridiculous, but yea... these kind of policies are done to please the natives more than to protect the minority.

 

[luutzu]

Back to agreeing with you luutzu. I know I am a bit slow on the uptake, but with all his cryptic twists, I haven't EVER got a f***ing clue what Tisme is going on about.

He's Irish. Thick accent mix with alcohol mix with "humour"

ain't that right McGuyver?

 

[luutzu]

It's a cultural difference. We don't trust people whose faces we can't see and if other cultures want to live here they should adapt to our culture, not the other way around.

People can't adapt overnight.

And part of Australian culture is being tolerant to harmless beliefs and practices.

Hard to make the point about hating oppressive practices forcing women to wear "bags" but making laws forcing them to not wear it.

 

[SirRumpole]

People can't adapt overnight.

And part of Australian culture is being tolerant to harmless beliefs and practices.

It's not harmless if it's oppressive or providing a cover for crime.

 

[luutzu]

It's not harmless if it's oppressive or providing a cover for crime.

If it's oppressive, those oppressed women would have a better chance of seeking help then if the law give her husband more reason for her not to go out.

If our gov't really care for the oppressed Muslim women, they could send a social worker around... or just send letterbox pamphlets.

I'd imagine it'd be easier to commit crimes in an overcoat or clothing where you could breathe and run and not trip all over. That or a ski mask or those stockings.


Women and young girls needing to be in bikini for summer, need their body to slim way, way down to be "beach ready"... one can make a case that that is a form of oppression. Unhealthy, unrealistic, skin cancer, body image issue to young minds, sexualisation and objectifying women... that or freedom of expression?

anyway, it doesn't affect us or our safety, if the women wearing it is oppressed and abused existing laws already provide that protection... so I really don't think taking their rights to wear whatever is any of our business.

 

[Tisme]

He's Irish. Thick accent mix with alcohol mix with "humour"

ain't that right McGuyver?

Only certain nights have alcohol, other times it's more likely I'm running on three or four computers multitasking. I'm slightly more Scottish DNA pedigree than Oirish, but there isn't much left after that for the Viking remnants..... no wonder I feel so liberated as a superior being.

 

[Tisme]

People can't adapt overnight.

.

I remember the Pommy migrant men who, having isolated their wives from their English families, would turn into wife beaters. People back then didn't say a lot directly to the problem, but the drums beat the message out to the wider community and the coppers would be more than happy to give the hubby a few rounds in the cells when they inevitably got pinged. Sure they didn't change overnight, but the realisation there was always a tougher thug with a badge ready to pull them into line did modify the behaviours.