Coronavirus (COVID-19/SARS-CoV-2) outbreak discussion

[moXJO]

Completely false.
Why do you believe the rubbish you post!

Good chat

 

[wayneL]

Good chat

If it doesn't fit the narrative, it ain't true.

 

[qldfrog]

No glee on my part. Its a public health issue afaic, not an ideological $hit fight.

That is where you are so wrong but hey 2 y of propaganda, i do not blame you and you are not alone. Mean it

 

[wayneL]

Context

 

[wayneL]

And for the vestige of critical thinkers:

(I don't expect more than a few here to get the point)

Deaths in Australia, Age at death

Deaths data are a vital measure of a population@s health and provide information on patterns of diseases that cause death, by population groups and over time. Examining death patterns can help...

www.aihw.gov.au

 

[bellenuit]

Context

According to the below table, COVID-19 was the 3rd leading cause of death in the US in 2020 with suicides at number 11.

Aren't we lucky that unlike the USA, we had Federal and State Governments who, to a large extent, acted responsibly and ensured that we did not end up with the appalling COVID-19 death rates of the USA, where recommended action was thwarted by anti-vax sentiment in the Federal Government and in particular among many state leaders.

The Leading Causes of Death in the US for 2020

This Viewpoint from the US National Center for Health Statistics reports a 2020 mortality estimate 17.7% higher than that of 2019, with leading causes of death comprising heart disease, cancer, and COVID-19.

jamanetwork.com

 

[wayneL]

According to the below table, COVID-19 was the 3rd leading cause of death in the US in 2020 with suicides at number 11.

Aren't we lucky that unlike the USA, we had Federal and State Governments who, to a large extent, acted responsibly and ensured that we did not end up with the appalling COVID-19 death rates of the USA, where recommended action was thwarted by anti-vax sentiment in the Federal Government and in particular among many state leaders.

The Leading Causes of Death in the US for 2020

This Viewpoint from the US National Center for Health Statistics reports a 2020 mortality estimate 17.7% higher than that of 2019, with leading causes of death comprising heart disease, cancer, and COVID-19.

jamanetwork.com

View attachment 131984

Good reading, Freakonomics.

It might lead you to see the statistics behind the statistics.

 

[bellenuit]

Good reading, Freakonomics.

It might lead you to see the statistics behind the statistics

You mean as in the US statistics completely renders meaningless the idea you were trying to convey with your post, but as you have no counter argument, you might as well throw out some stupid cliche about statistics behind the statistics, something you seem unable to enumerate yourself.

 

[SirRumpole]

According to the below table, COVID-19 was the 3rd leading cause of death in the US in 2020 with suicides at number 11.

Aren't we lucky that unlike the USA, we had Federal and State Governments who, to a large extent, acted responsibly and ensured that we did not end up with the appalling COVID-19 death rates of the USA, where recommended action was thwarted by anti-vax sentiment in the Federal Government and in particular among many state leaders.

The Leading Causes of Death in the US for 2020

This Viewpoint from the US National Center for Health Statistics reports a 2020 mortality estimate 17.7% higher than that of 2019, with leading causes of death comprising heart disease, cancer, and COVID-19.

jamanetwork.com

View attachment 131984

About 6 times the death rate for flu.

Just like the flu huh ?

 

[rederob]

It might lead you to see the statistics behind the statistics.

Please show the critical thinking you referenced above, as you seem unable to work out how devastating covid has been across the globe.
As @bellenuit pointed out, Australia's data has been conditioned by State and Territory measures to mitigate covid spread.
Here's an example of what happened in England last December:

 

[IFocus]

According to the below table, COVID-19 was the 3rd leading cause of death in the US in 2020 with suicides at number 11.

Aren't we lucky that unlike the USA, we had Federal and State Governments who, to a large extent, acted responsibly and ensured that we did not end up with the appalling COVID-19 death rates of the USA, where recommended action was thwarted by anti-vax sentiment in the Federal Government and in particular among many state leaders.

The Leading Causes of Death in the US for 2020

This Viewpoint from the US National Center for Health Statistics reports a 2020 mortality estimate 17.7% higher than that of 2019, with leading causes of death comprising heart disease, cancer, and COVID-19.

jamanetwork.com

View attachment 131984

Yup


Lost count of the times I have seen COVID deaths compared to what ever with no mention of the counter measures to reduce COVID deaths.

Then there is the freedom mob with no mention of what the COVID death rate / hospital over loads would look like if you just let it rip.

 

[cynic]

Perhaps if one were to "follow the money", one might, perchance, gain some profound insight, into the more likely cause, underlying the reported statistics, on COVID in the US of A:
https://www.foxnews.com/health/hospitals-medicare-patients-cost-coronavirus

 

[wayneL]

Perhaps if one were to "follow the money", one might, perchance, gain some profound insight, into the more likely cause, underlying the reported statistics, on COVID in the US of A:
https://www.foxnews.com/health/hospitals-medicare-patients-cost-coronavirus

They will never indulge in critical thinking. It's futile mate.

 

[moXJO]

According to the below table, COVID-19 was the 3rd leading cause of death in the US in 2020 with suicides at number 11.

Aren't we lucky that unlike the USA, we had Federal and State Governments who, to a large extent, acted responsibly and ensured that we did not end up with the appalling COVID-19 death rates of the USA, where recommended action was thwarted by anti-vax sentiment in the Federal Government and in particular among many state leaders.

The Leading Causes of Death in the US for 2020

This Viewpoint from the US National Center for Health Statistics reports a 2020 mortality estimate 17.7% higher than that of 2019, with leading causes of death comprising heart disease, cancer, and COVID-19.

jamanetwork.com

View attachment 131984

If these figures are right then biden will end up with close to the same in his first year. I think it's around 327000 under Biden currently.
Delta was meant to be less deadly as well.

Victoria has twice as many deaths yet only 9000 or so more cases then nsw.

Interesting how the numbers are stacking up.

 

[bellenuit]

They will never indulge in critical thinking. It's futile mate.

Your critical thinking is based on a Fox News report from near the beginnings of the epidemic (May 2020) when misinformation was rife. The report itself gives very plausible reasons why COVID cases require greater funding as they incur greater costs to care for such patients. Although there may be an economic incentive to inflate COVID numbers, your article concludes:

But despite some concerns that hospitals – which are struggling nationwide given that most states have shut down elective and non-emergency procedures which needed to keep budgets balanced – there are no reports of flagrant exploitation, exaggerated coronavirus numbers, or evidence that facilities are purporting to profit off the pandemic to collect more in Medicare payments.

"In a crisis like this, the fees for service payments are unlikely to be abused. Long-term hospitalizations with medically complex patients on ventilators cannot be paid with a simple standard sticker price," McGee asserted. "Hospitals should be paid for the services they are providing at a premium because of the extremely challenging situation they are in."

I think for most of 2020, the USA was in about 10th position worldwide in number of deaths per 100k people. If you can only attribute that to hospitals being paid to report non-COVID deaths as COVID because it is better financially for them, then one must assume that you think that is also the case with the nine that rank above them which is simply nonsense. Medical funding is quite unique in the way it is handled in the USA.

You would also have to assume that countries like Russia which are experiencing over 1,000 deaths per day currently are also in it for the money. But that is not the case there. The reason that is attributed most to their high death rate is due to their poor vaccination rates because of distrust in their vaccine, partly because it is not as effective as those from the West, but also because of the influence of the anti-vaxxers.

The common denominator between different countries that have high death rates from COVID is low vaccination rates or lax protection measures or a combination of both. The fact that in the US that deaths are mainly now among the unvaccinated is testament to the effectiveness of the vaccine.

 

[rederob]

Perhaps if one were to "follow the money", one might, perchance, gain some profound insight, into the more likely cause, underlying the reported statistics, on COVID in the US of A:
https://www.foxnews.com/health/hospitals-medicare-patients-cost-coronavirus

You appear to have made a presumption that does not have a sound basis.
Worse, in this case, you make a number of points that together make no sense.
First, data on people contracting covid comes from testing sources, so the number of people in America appearing in data has very little to do with hospitalisation numbers.
Second, those in hospital get a higher standard of care than those who are not, so if we are looking at death rates, then hospitals are mitigating factors.
Third, your "follow the money" idea only means that there may be more money available for treating covid, and if there are financial irregularities they have nothing to do with the reported number of covid cases or deaths.
Concluding, you have shown no insights at all into how America collects and reports covid data and your premise is fundamentally flawed.

I note @wayneL has given you a thumbs up, suggesting you might be on to something. However, as @bellenuit points out, @wayneL has not presented a case for his views, which suggests his critical thinking skills are at your level. Given the abundance of good data on covid freely available you might be better placed developing your own ideas from these rather than concocting something devoid of common sense.

 

[cynic]

Well it seems the content of post #4613, has, unsurprisingly, proved most prophetic.

 

[wayneL]

A truth bomb from across the ditch. Applies equally here.

 

[Humid]

Perhaps if one were to "follow the money", one might, perchance, gain some profound insight, into the more likely cause, underlying the reported statistics, on COVID in the US of A:
https://www.foxnews.com/health/hospitals-medicare-patients-cost-coronavirus

Hospital Payments and the COVID-19 Death Count - FactCheck.org

Q: Are hospitals inflating the number of COVID-19 cases and deaths so they can be paid more? A: Recent legislation pays hospitals higher Medicare rates for COVID-19 patients and treatment, but there is no evidence of fraudulent reporting. FULL QUESTION Are hospitals getting 13,000 per patient if...

www.factcheck.org

 

[cynic]

Yep! Such a wise choice!

Let the "factcheckers" do all your thinking and research for you!

Now, now, don't let the fact, that there are no fact checks, being performed, on the fact checkers' findings, deter you!

And since you're here, today happens to be your lucky day!

It just so happens that I have a bridge with beautiful views of the harbour, that I would dearly like to sell at bargain basement prices.

And since I am feeling especially generous, I am also throwing in a free opera house, as a deal sweetener, for the first 3 callers only, so be sure to get in quick!