Asylum immigrants - Green Light

[sptrawler]

Consider this....

Why not excise Christmas Island from Australian control and gift it to our Indonesian buddies? Just compensate the existing legal inhabitants (move to mainland if they want to + new housing). Huge reduction in on-going costs for us.

plus

Indonesia get some nice piles of bird poo to mine + a very close strategic outpost to help control the people smugglers currently leaving their shores in droves to go to Aussie Christmas Island. If the island is Indonesian however, how many are then going to head direct for Oz mainland to bypass it? Very, very few I believe.

Win, win all round? I'm not the only one with a favorable view to this idea

http://oursay.org/hangout-with-the-...se-to-indonesia-and-a-long-way-from-australia

I'm pretty sure Howard did this in early 2001.

http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2002/s578166.htm

http://www.greenleft.org.au/node/54103

It isn't a new idea, from memory I think it was overturned.

 

[Julia]

In the context of the current situation, it's obviously more appropriate to prioritise the living over the dead, but that's an issue of resource allocation.

Of course it is. But you still have various members of the Greens plus refugee advocates insisting that retrieving bodies should be the first priority.

 

[Country Lad]

A truly gruesome task -and for what?

For no real reason I can see. Subjecting our people to the trauma of picking dead bodies or body parts out of the ocean which will never be identified because they have thrown or given away their identification, seems a little pointless to me. Just consider them buried at sea after a tragic voyage.

Cheers
Country Lad

 

[Aussiejeff]

I'm pretty sure Howard did this in early 2001.

http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2002/s578166.htm

http://www.greenleft.org.au/node/54103

It isn't a new idea, from memory I think it was overturned.

...but that was only excising Christmas Island and others as far as the migration zone & immigration/refugee policy was concerned. It did not involve any notion of handing over total sovereignty of the place.

I'm talking about a total sovereign handover. Now, could you imagine John Howard would have given Christmas Island away for nix? Nah....

The Island was occupied by Japanese forces from March 1942 until the end of the Second World War and in 1946 became a dependency of Singapore. By agreement with the United Kingdom sovereignty was transferred to the Commonwealth of Australia on 1 October 1958 under the Christmas Island Act 1958. This day is still celebrated as Territory Day.

http://www.regional.gov.au/territories/christmas/enviro_herritage.aspx

So, its not as if it hasn't happened before. Most of the problem now is because Indonesia is happy to let Australia carry the can (financially and morally) for their corruption, pathetic naval patrolling and weak, ineffective leadership in dealing with the whole refugee crisis on their doorstep. Why should we accept their mis-handling without question? Let them have the place, lock stock and barrel.

 

[Country Lad]

I doubt that by far the majority of Australians have any idea where Christmas Island is located. I suspect that most will think it is close to Australia.

It is no wonder the boats head there. It is about 380 km from the Indonesian coast which is only about 20% of the distance to the Australian mainland which is a further 1,600 km away. So, without Christmas Island, the boats would need to travel about 2,000 km to the WA coast. That on its own would likely be a little off putting.

Cheers
Country Lad

 

[nioka]

Consider this....

Why not excise Christmas Island from Australian control and gift it to our Indonesian buddies? Just compensate the existing legal inhabitants (move to mainland if they want to + new housing). Huge reduction in on-going costs

Maybe there is more to it than that. Think oil and gas. Think continental shelf. Think marine resource. I guess that is why we still have it.

 

[Bintang]

I believe the solution is fairly simple:
1) Identify the Indonesian officials who are making the most money out of this scam.
2) Figure out how much money they are making currently.
3) Offer to pay them a bit more than what they are making now if they will stop allowing the asylum seekers to transit through Indonesia.

It sounds unpalatable but it will be far, far cheaper for Australian tax payers.

What will definitely not work is any kind of attempt to pressure Indonesia with 'moral arguments' or 'punishment' such as cutting off foreign aid. These type of approaches simply cause 'loss of face' and guarantee that Indonesia will not co-operate. In fact the Indonesians will just smile and then go about making things worse for us.

 

[bigdog]

What about stopping our welfare payments to Indonesia!

Also, we could sell Christmas Island to Indonesia!!

Abbot can't turn the boats around; they will simply jump overboard to be rescued!

 

[drsmith]

Labor's latest excuse.

As per usual, it's not their fault.

It's never Labor's fault.

CRAIG EMERSON: Now, what happened at around the time of the change of government, is that people smugglers learned that of all those people on temporary protection visas, a huge proportion of them were allowed to stay in Australia after being in mandatory detention for a very long period. They then told - they then told those who wanted to come by boat, "Don't worry about it. You will end up being able to stay in Australia because these TPVs are just a deterrent for a period of time but if you are patient enough you will be able to stay".

http://www.abc.net.au/tv/qanda/txt/s3767548.htm

With regard to disposing Xmas Island to Indonesia (in whatever form), we would be better exiting the UN refugee convention. At least that way we get to keep the airstrip.

 

[Julia]

I believe the solution is fairly simple:
1) Identify the Indonesian officials who are making the most money out of this scam.
2) Figure out how much money they are making currently.
3) Offer to pay them a bit more than what they are making now if they will stop allowing the asylum seekers to transit through Indonesia.

It sounds unpalatable but it will be far, far cheaper for Australian tax payers.

Isn't this like any other form of what is essentially blackmail? What is there to stop them continually upping the price?

Abbot can't turn the boats around; they will simply jump overboard to be rescued!

So if they did turn the first boat around, and the people did jump overboard, would you advocate (as a harsh measure of deterrence for the future) just letting the people drown?

I raised this earlier and no one was up for responding.

 

[Bintang]

Isn't this like any other form of what is essentially blackmail? What is there to stop them continually upping the price?

Yes they will up the price. However..........
Every illegal boat is costing tax payers $12.8 million. On average each boat has 58 passengers which means that each person arriving on these boats is costing taxpayers $220,000. This cost is much more than the asylum seekers are paying in fees/bribes to Indonesian officials. So Australia would need to pay more to the Indonesians than the asylum seekers can afford to pay but it in the long run it will be cheaper for us.

So if they did turn the first boat around, and the people did jump overboard, would you advocate (as a harsh measure of deterrence for the future) just letting the people drown?
I raised this earlier and no one was up for responding.

Yes, in fact I would but only after a period of highly publicised warnings that Australia will enact such a deterrent. I consider the assault on our borders to be like war. We are being invaded. So respond by warning that Australia will 'go to war' on the invaders if they do not stop. As far as I am concerned all the bleeding heart liberals who will disagree with me and berate me for what am saying can all be damned because there is no such thing here as a soft, warm and fuzzy solution here.

 

[sptrawler]

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/vi...asylum-time-bomb/story-fni0fit3-1226662780447

It sounds as though Melbourne is coping the brunt of the asylum seeker problems. Oh well, we will see how that translates to votes in September.
What I can't understand is, if they are being provided housing and 89% of the newstart allowance, why such a public outcry?
Our unemployed have to find housing and get a similar sum of money, nobody appears to be worried about them.

 

[Julia]

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/vi...asylum-time-bomb/story-fni0fit3-1226662780447

It sounds as though Melbourne is coping the brunt of the asylum seeker problems. Oh well, we will see how that translates to votes in September.
What I can't understand is, if they are being provided housing and 89% of the newstart allowance, why such a public outcry?
Our unemployed have to find housing and get a similar sum of money, nobody appears to be worried about them.

Exactly. And they do not have the same immediate access to all kinds of medical, psychological, dental treatment, plus free legal counsel.
Just so, so unfair and disgusting.

 

[Calliope]

What I can't understand is, if they are being provided housing and 89% of the newstart allowance, why such a public outcry?

Yes, and free mobiles and unlimited free calls, running into thousands, to their homelands.

 

[Ijustnewit]

Just thought I would add they are receiving full eye exams and optical and spectacle needs as well. :1zhelp:

 

[noco]

Shoooooo, we must not talk about asylum seekers, we have more important things to talk about like MENUS and BLUE TIES

 

[Bintang]

Shoooooo, we must not talk about asylum seekers, we have more important things to talk about like MENUS and BLUE TIES

How about talking ANIMAL RIGHTS as well. I think all these comparisons of our fine feathered friends with Labor party politicians is very demeaning and if it continues will surely invoke the ire of Animal Rights Activists.

 

[noco]

Ha Doc, how many boats this week?

The media have gone to sleep again.

Or are they still dreaming about menus, blue ties and whether Tim is gay?

What a slack lot they are!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[drsmith]

Ha Doc, how many boats this week?

9 so far.

I'll do the add-up over the weekend.

 

[tigerboi]

What I can't understand is, if they are being provided housing and 89% of the newstart allowance, why such a public outcry?
Our unemployed have to find housing and get a similar sum of money, nobody appears to be worried about them.

maybe you can understand this???

http://www.smh.com.au/business/fede...als-cost-blows-out-by-32b-20130514-2jkq8.html

or this

http://pickeringpost.com/article/asylumseeker-travel-costs-70m-report/310

so what is right about putting 10 illegals in a 2 bed unit in Liverpool Sydney,
none can speak English & they cannot work here legally & we are GIVING them money
WHILE PREGNANT WOMEN HAVE BABIES IN TOILETS BECAUSE THE GOVERNMENT
HASNT GOT THE MONEY TO FUND EXTRA BEDS...do you remember that ? it happened
at royal north shore a few years ago.

pensioners that have worked their ar5es off for 50 years cant get a procedure done before 18 months
because our traitorous government has bent over for the likes of the UN instead of looking after
AUSTRALIANS...

these people inparticular offer nothing to this country they are a burden we can do without

so do you understand now...tb