Victorian cops shoot 15 year old kid dead!

[2020hindsight]

Re: Victorian cops shoot 15 year old kid Dead @!

The old wogs just have plenty because they hate the
birds eating there tomatoe plants in the backyard

Maybe that explains that tomato I bought the other day that was full of buckshot.

 

[Wysiwyg]

This is something that concerns me and can probably never be quantified, what grudges do associates hold and what crimes eventually get perpetrated as vengence ?

The sowers of revenge are never the ones that commit the revenge.They are cowards and always get someone immpressionable & easily manipulated to do their dirty work. Terrorist recruiters work this way.

For those people I hope they are shown the tree of enlightenment in the dark forest of bitterness.

 

[Ageo]

Re: Victorian cops shoot 15 year old kid Dead @!

Maybe that explains that tomato I bought the other day that was full of buckshot.

buckshot?? they must have big birds down your way.

 

[refined silver]

Re: Victorian cops shoot 15 year old kid Dead @!

Agree, yet we catch them, eventually sentence them and they are out in 3 years. (Cricket Bat Killer). Knifes are used to kill in 33% of homicide cases (2005-6) That kid if he happened to be pulled up and searched and a knife found = slap on the wrist (being 15 yrs old)

We are the mugs I feel for cause maybe one of us may have to defend family/friends from these armed crazed individuals with our bare hands.
A knife is a very effcient killing weapon, just ask some WW II diggers

Totally agree.

I'm not against the death penalty, I agree most judges are way out of step with the community and sometimes give absurdly low sentences, if at all. I also think you should be able to protect yourself, your loved ones and your home with all force necessary. Its absolutely absurd that home invaders have sued the owners for harming them when they invaded.

If this kid had been shot in any of these circumstances, to me there is no debate. But, this was 4 armed police, 15m from a skinny, angry, flipped out kid in a park. To me, their training should have treated them as more capable than it does, and given them the discretion to shoot to disable rather than kill if it was safe to do so. It also should have supplied them with more weapons/tools which could be used in a non-lethal way to contain the situation.

Surely even shields and long batons in the hands of fully trained police officiers can disarm a skinny kid, especially if there is four of you.

 

[numbercruncher]

Surely even shields and long batons in the hands of fully trained police officiers can disarm a skinny kid, especially if there is four of you

Police should recruit Lassoo wielding Cowboys, thats a sure way to round em. up ...... cheaper than bullets (x7) too boot !

 

[r34ztune]

No offence to the mother, however she is now asking people to show restraint in commenting on the events leading up to the incident, however she herself has gone to the media, and made her own comments.
She is now pursuing murder charges against the officers WHAT THE
Apparently the group he was in, is now posting revenge notes on myspace.
If anyone, I feel for the police who have to deal with this while trying to do their jobs.
http://news.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=696655

 

[chops_a_must]

Mate. Why shouldn't she be allowed to come out in the media and defend herself? It was the anniversary of his dad's death ffs.

It seems that racist group he was a part of was just a bit of a beat up.

And from what seems to be coming out in dribs and drabs, continues to show the abject incompetence of the police.

This suicide by police thing I thought was sorted out 15 years ago. He rang them twice... he was never a threat to anyone but them.

Absolutely pathetic decision making it seems.

 

[It's Snake Pliskin]

Mate. Why shouldn't she be allowed to come out in the media and defend herself? It was the anniversary of his dad's death ffs.

It seems that racist group he was a part of was just a bit of a beat up.

And from what seems to be coming out in dribs and drabs, continues to show the abject incompetence of the police.

This suicide by police thing I thought was sorted out 15 years ago. He rang them twice... he was never a threat to anyone but them.

Absolutely pathetic decision making it seems.

No doubt Chops would have done better with a sour attitude hanging on his belt.
Armchair critique bandits.

 

[It's Snake Pliskin]

Re: Victorian cops shoot 15 year old kid Dead @!

Shoud have a picture of a dead kid full of bullets as well then for good measure ??
Dont know what it is with people in this day and age how they embrace depictions of violence but a good 50pc are offended by nudity, freaks.

If needed for shock value. Perhaps there will be no incentive to be a radical amongst society.
Love nudity and agree there should be places for it.
I even like photos of cats running on treadmills.

 

[Julia]

Mate. Why shouldn't she be allowed to come out in the media and defend herself? It was the anniversary of his dad's death ffs.

It seems that racist group he was a part of was just a bit of a beat up.

And from what seems to be coming out in dribs and drabs, continues to show the abject incompetence of the police.

This suicide by police thing I thought was sorted out 15 years ago. He rang them twice... he was never a threat to anyone but them.

Absolutely pathetic decision making it seems.

Throughout this thread you've been contemptuous of everything the police did and of the police in general.

Let's have a hypothetical situation where you are the most senior officer amongst the four called to the current situation. You are, apparently, faced with a violent kid, armed with two large knives, jumping about, yelling that he will kill you. You don't know if he's psychotic, freaked out on ice, whatever.
He corners one of your female colleagues. He fails to respond to your calls to drop the knives. He is unresponsive to capsicum spray, indicating his psychosis or drug-induced state of mind is extreme.

What would you do, Chops?

Don't go on about what the police did wrong. Just explain, exactly, what you would have done had it been your responsibility to contain the situation.

 

[It's Snake Pliskin]

Throughout this thread you've been contemptuous of everything the police did and of the police in general.

Let's have a hypothetical situation where you are the most senior officer amongst the four called to the current situation. You are, apparently, faced with a violent kid, armed with two large knives, jumping about, yelling that he will kill you. You don't know if he's psychotic, freaked out on ice, whatever.
He corners one of your female colleagues. He fails to respond to your calls to drop the knives. He is unresponsive to capsicum spray, indicating his psychosis or drug-induced state of mind is extreme.

What would you do, Chops?

Don't go on about what the police did wrong. Just explain, exactly, what you would have done had it been your responsibility to contain the situation.

Julia,

That one is easy.

Just uncouple the sour attitude from the belt and let it rip on the knife weilding bandit. Fixed no problem.

 

[MrBurns]

Julia,

That one is easy.

Just uncouple the sour attitude from the belt and let it rip on the knife weilding bandit. Fixed no problem.

Non of us were there so it's impossible to know for sure but surely they could have shot him in the legs, he was carrying a knife not a gun or explosives.
Saw his mother on TV, heartbreaking stuff.
I have every respect for the police (more when Nixon goes) but shooting to kill should be avoided if possible IMHO

 

[chops_a_must]

Throughout this thread you've been contemptuous of everything the police did and of the police in general.

Let's have a hypothetical situation where you are the most senior officer amongst the four called to the current situation. You are, apparently, faced with a violent kid, armed with two large knives, jumping about, yelling that he will kill you. You don't know if he's psychotic, freaked out on ice, whatever.
He corners one of your female colleagues. He fails to respond to your calls to drop the knives. He is unresponsive to capsicum spray, indicating his psychosis or drug-induced state of mind is extreme.

What would you do, Chops?

Don't go on about what the police did wrong. Just explain, exactly, what you would have done had it been your responsibility to contain the situation.

It may have been that there wasn't anything left they could do in that situation. Who knows? The fact that 3 of them shot, indicates that they were all largely on their weapons, which is what he wanted. Keeping hands away from their holsters in this situation may have been something that could have helped de-escalate the situation. Pepper spraying at less than 15m might have worked as well. Getting the cornered officer to stay away from their gun whilst the others made the call could also have been an option.

But the bolded part is what concerns me. I'm not sure how you can separate that from their actions, because that changes what actions are available. I'm not sure how exactly you can be cornered in a skate park without doing something massively wrong.

It smacks of ****house teamwork and pathetic communication. Anyone that has played full back or spare man in defence in footy knows that you are reliant on others to tell you where to move, as you can't see behind you. It really isn't hard, and is something you would think they train for. I think I've even seen it in promo videos as they are walking backwards in standoffs...

 

[numbercruncher]

Did he corner a Female officer now ?

Hell im even starting to wonder if he was also shooting lightning bolts from his eyes and fireballs from his ears ?


Facts I read in the media are Police followed him from road to skate park, shot off spray and warning shot/s - They had to be able to leg shot him in that time span @!

Look im sure the Poilce involved feel awful but the "system" they currently have needs looking into. I fully understand the Police are not aloud to legshot, and they have to follow orders, personal opinion doesnt enter the equation, which means id be disciplined if I was ever a cop in exactly the same situation.

 

[2020hindsight]

chops - I have a feeling that a few posters here trust everything the police do - unquestioned.

 

[numbercruncher]

chops - I have a feeling that a few posters here trust everything the police do - unquestioned.

You can say that three times loudly !

 

[It's Snake Pliskin]

Perhaps only perfect people should join the Police Force. They may get one cop doing everything for a state but I suspect there would not be many people trying to be recruited if the prerequisite quality was perfection.

 

[2020hindsight]

Lol - well in one case , I can tell you I'd simple like some honesty and integrity - and not to charge someone with assault when he was the assaulter - as later shown in court

 

[AAA]

I'm not sure how exactly you can be cornered in a skate park without doing something massively wrong.

It smacks of ****house teamwork and pathetic communication. Anyone that has played full back or spare man in defence in footy knows that you are reliant on others to tell you where to move, as you can't see behind you. It really isn't hard, and is something you would think they train for. I think I've even seen it in promo videos as they are walking backwards in standoffs...

It's interesting that you compare this with a sport. Professional footballers and teams often get caught out of position or have stuffups due to poor communication. Look at the amount of training they do.

Now take the average general duties police officer. They would be lucky to do operational skills training 2-4 days a year. This training involves revision of a multitude of skills including control and restrain, weapon retention, searching, removing offenders from cars, oc spray ect. Nothing gets covered in real depth and there is not the repetitive practice that needs to be done to perfect these skills. Unlike a peacetime army police have a job to be done. This limits the time that can be allocated to training.

I think you underestimate the dynamic nature of these types of incidents. Police strategy in containment of them is developed on the run and it is no wonder there is not always a happy ending. I am guessing that at least half of the officers present had less then two years service and may not have experienced a similar incident. I have experienced two such incidents in almost 20 years

 

[AAA]

Did he corner a Female officer now ?

Hell im even starting to wonder if he was also shooting lightning bolts from his eyes and fireballs from his ears ?


Facts I read in the media are Police followed him from road to skate park, shot off spray and warning shot/s - They had to be able to leg shot him in that time span @!

Look im sure the Poilce involved feel awful but the "system" they currently have needs looking into. I fully understand the Police are not aloud to legshot, and they have to follow orders, personal opinion doesnt enter the equation, which means id be disciplined if I was ever a cop in exactly the same situation.

Think of the uproar there would have been if police had shot him in the leg whilst following him or whilst he was standing still. Police cannot use lethal force until they are in fear of death or GBH themselves. It then is too late for a precise shot to the leg.