Ukraine War

[JohnDe]

RT / all Russian news networks got dropped overnight after the invasion from Youtube / TV. In contrast all American and Indian propa- oops i mean news networks still operating.

Facebook / Twitter / reddit outright banning Russian accounts. Promoting the Russians-are-orcs theory. Asset seizure of rich Russians. Being banned for viewing the issue from both sides. If you don't get auto-banned, for some reason questioning media rhetoric is met with swift unanimous downvotes. Hmm who could be reacting to messages quickly! It's almost like they are being encouraged or... paid. Perhaps.

Anyways better not go against the narrative! Just force a smile and say "Nato good. Russia bad. More weapons for Ukraine"

I am no expert in psychology or history, though both have interested me since my high school days, so when I say this i am most likely incorrect, but to the untrained eye it appears that your fear of being censored and/or banned has clouded the lessons of history.

The USA have the most liberal and free internet access and use in the world, it is like the wild west without a sheriff. Most other countries have a free internet with minor laws in place to protect people from people like Alex Jones.

History was a big part of our education system; some schools and their students took it seriously while others concentrated on something else.

“Those that fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.” Winston Churchill. History never repeats itself. Every single historical moment is distinct from those past. However, we must learn from our mistakes so that we do not run the risk of repeating them.​

During the early 1930's the world turned a blind eye to what was happening in Germany by Hitler's policy changes. When Germany started to 'expand' its national borders, countries like England were too weary to stand up.

British Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain, one of the signers of the Munich pact, had taken Hitler at his word. Returning to Britain with this agreement in hand, he proudly announced that he had achieved “peace with honor. I believe it is peace for our time.”​

​

A year later, German troops stormed into Poland.​

When Russian troops were massing at the Ukrainian border world governments made a concerted effort to ensure that there would be no invasion or war.

Puttin gave his word that Russia was only conducting military exercises.

World leaders warned Puttin and Russia that the invasion of a free and sovereign country would be met by harsh sanctions.

When you go on about Russia being the victim here, it sounds like that you have not bothered to read all the facts or study some history. Instead, you try to guilt everyone by mentioning censorship and banning, 'going against the narrative', and so on. Maybe there is some truth in what you say, but you are yet to supply any evidence that would stand up to any simple assessment let alone an international court.

 

[mullokintyre]

I am no expert in psychology or history, though both have interested me since my high school days, so when I say this i am most likely incorrect, but to the untrained eye it appears that your fear of being censored and/or banned has clouded the lessons of history.

The USA have the most liberal and free internet access and use in the world, it is like the wild west without a sheriff. Most other countries have a free internet with minor laws in place to protect people from people like Alex Jones.

You have totally missed the point of what the poster was saying.
To have free internet media etc, you cannot have censorship.
Protecting the people from Alex Jones is just another way of saying protecting people from those you disagree with,
I do not support Alex Jones, but I support his right to say it, just as I support people right to sue him for saying obviously false crap.
As soon as you want to decide what people should hear or see, its censorship.
As for the USA having the most liberal and free internet, that is laughable.
Its just that they allow most of things you approve of.
You are happy not to be allowed to see Russian propaganda, or north Korean propaganda, or anything else that twitter, CNN , Facebook, and youtube censors.
Either everything is allowed, or else its censorship. period.
Mick

 

[bluekelah]

They can only fire a nuke if they have a nuke to fire, which they won’t in that system, as I said it’s designed to shoot down nukes, that’s the reason russia is upset.

Mutually assured destruction only works if both sides aren’t wearing bullet proof vest, Russia is upset that NATO is putting on a bullet proof vest, not that it’s pointing guns at them.

I would encourage u to read this article from 2019.

Sunday's US Missile Launch, Explained. - Federation of American Scientists

Arms Control Twitter has been abuzz since yesterday’s announcement that the United States had conducted a surprise launch of a Tomahawk missile on Sunday afternoon.

fas.org

[
Why is everyone so worked up about the launcher?

This is where things get really interesting. The Mk-41 VLS launcher that was used to launch the Tomahawk is the same type of launcher that would be used to launch SM-3 interceptors from Aegis Ashore ballistic missile defense stations in Romania and Poland, once the latter station is completed.]

Usa already started testing tomahawk launching in 2019, the Romanian and polished "defence stations" are now tomahawk capable.

So yeah they can claim the sites are defense only but it's nuke capable as well. Currently we know publicly tomahawks are not equipped with nukes but its not really rocket science to equip them with nukes as the tech already exists.

 

[JohnDe]

You have totally missed the point of what the poster was saying.
To have free internet media etc, you cannot have censorship.
Protecting the people from Alex Jones is just another way of saying protecting people from those you disagree with,
I do not support Alex Jones, but I support his right to say it, just as I support people right to sue him for saying obviously false crap.
As soon as you want to decide what people should hear or see, its censorship.
As for the USA having the most liberal and free internet, that is laughable.
Its just that they allow most of things you approve of.
You are happy not to be allowed to see Russian propaganda, or north Korean propaganda, or anything else that twitter, CNN , Facebook, and youtube censors.
Either everything is allowed, or else its censorship. period.
Mick

OMG

Censorship for telling the truth, and spreading misinformation, are two different things.

You need to do a lot more research before commenting, especially about people like Alex Jones that has a media organisation that 'spread misinformation' that causes pain and damage.

An Alex Jones type situation would never occur in Australia, the UK and many other countries because of laws that make it illegal. Look it up before guessing and commenting.

Jury to decide on damages in trial against Alex Jones over Sandy Hook lies

Research

Research

www.aph.gov.au

 

[JohnDe]

You are happy not to be allowed to see Russian propaganda, or north Korean propaganda, or anything else that twitter, CNN , Facebook, and youtube censors.
Either everything is allowed, or else its censorship. period.
Mick

I need to ask this; are you happy for someone to tell the world that you have done some heinous act? To put your name to it.

Or what if your home is broken into and you and family members assaulted, is it ok for the perpetrators representatives to say that it is a lie and to blame you for letting them in? And for media to report it as such.

If you are, why do you use an alias instead of your real name?

 

[mullokintyre]

I need to ask this; are you happy for someone to tell the world that you have done some heinous act? To put your name to it.

Or what if your home is broken into and you and family members assaulted, is it ok for the perpetrators representatives to say that it is a lie and to blame you for letting them in?

If you are, why do you use an alias instead of your real name?

At no stage did I express support for Jones view, merely his right to express them, no matter how stupid or incorrect.
The fact that Jones has been assessed by the legal system and forced to pay damages is the result of his stupidity, and that is the way to treat lies and disinformation.
Cancelling, censorship is not the way.
Using his case as the reason why you approve of suppression of some things makes you no better than all the others who try to justify their version of "the truth".
Mick

 

[JohnDe]

At no stage did I express support for Jones view, merely his right to express them, no matter how stupid or incorrect.

Mick

No one has the right to express views that are a lie or cause damage to people and society.

Would you be ok with a prominent media personality telling the world something about you, that causes you and your family pain, something that you know not to be true? The media personality may have some twisted proof.

Defamation laws should not stop at the internet. They have in the US for a long time, but the Jones case has sorted that out.

I do not know where people like you and joeno get your facts from. There is hardly any censorship on the net and social media. You both mention companies, well a business has the right to stop things that they believe is damaging. And users have the right to move on. Where is the censorship?

Can I come into your home and sleep on your couch whenever I want? Why not, are you censoring me?

 

[mullokintyre]

No one has the right to express views that are a lie or cause damage to people and society.

Would you be ok with a prominent media personality telling the world something about you, that causes you and your family pain, something that you know not to be true? The media personality may have some twisted proof.

Defamation laws should not stop at the internet. They have in the US for a long time, but the Jones case has sorted that out.

I do not know where people like you and joeno get your facts from. There is hardly any censorship on the net and social media. You both mention companies, well a business has the right to stop things that they believe is damaging. And users have the right to move on. Where is the censorship?

So Companies that believe that they can stop things that are damaging.
If that is not censorship, what the hell is?
!. Damaging to whom?
2. Who decides what should be repressed.

Can I come into your home and sleep on your couch whenever I want? Why not, are you censoring me?

Thats a pretty poor analogy.
Trespass is somewhat a long stretch from defamatory statements.
You are big on emotion, poor on logic.
Mick

 

[JohnDe]

So Companies that believe that they can stop things that are damaging.
If that is not censorship, what the hell is?

Mick

I gather, from all your recent comments, that you believe that governments need to introduce regulations that govern how companies run their business. Legislation that makes it illegal for management to make decisions, once legal and fair, that affects you and people like you from being able to access information regardless of any damage it may cause.

It's plainly too hard for some consumers to take their business somewhere else, or to write to management to explain their reasoning.

I am very happy that I don't have to run my business with regulations from people like yourself, thank God I live in a free and democratic country.

 

[Dona Ferentes]

meanwhile ..... in the real world Kherson hotting up, RUF wanting to push at Bakmut...?

Wagner financier Yevgeny Prigozhin is also continuing efforts to set himself and Wagner Group forces apart from conventional Russian military elements.

The Russian outlet RIA claimed that Wagner engineering units are actively building a fortified “Wagner Line” that runs adjacent to territories in Luhansk and Donetsk Oblasts. Prigozhin reportedly stated that the construction of the “Wagner Line” is meant to protect other elements of the Russian Armed Forces while Wagner units capture more territory in Donetsk Oblast. Prigozhin’s statements indicate that he is likely continuing to promote Wagner units as superior to conventional Russian Armed Forces in a bid to increase his influence among Kremlin officials. Russian outlet RIA published a supposed map of the “Wagner line” that suggests that Prigozhin and Wagner forces may expect the Russian military to lose considerable territory in Luhansk Oblast, putting Prigozhin’s publicity of the line at odds with the specious Kremlin narrative that Russia will hold all of Luhansk Oblast.

map

[[ Don’t believe anything until the Kremlin denies it TM ]]

 

[againsthegrain]

russia and china censor also, well its a free country here you can move to russia or china. and live the good life there. Don't put up any moment longer with the bad life here ?

 

[Dona Ferentes]

russia and china censor also, well its a free country here you can move to russia or china. and live the good life there. Don't put up any moment longer with the bad life here ?

And might take "Animal Farm" and "1984 " along for some light reading.

 

[JohnDe]

Thats a pretty poor analogy.
Trespass is somewhat a long stretch from defamatory statements.
You are big on emotion, poor on logic.
Mick

Russian troops and bombs are currently trespassing on Ukrainian land and in homes and businesses.

 

[mullokintyre]

Russian troops are currently trespassing on Ukrainian land and in homes and businesses.

So, what does that have to do with censorship?
Are you saying because its not reported or something that it is censorship?
Mick

 

[JohnDe]

So, what does that have to do with censorship?
Are you saying because its not reported or something that it is censorship?
Mick

That's what happens when you go in halfcocked with only half the information.

Lost in translation -

Russian Invasion

That’s actually a war crime under the Geneva convention and Rome statute. Civilian cities would be fine. Just the military installations I thought?

www.aussiestockforums.com

 

[mullokintyre]

I gather, from all your recent comments, that you believe that governments need to introduce regulations that govern how companies run their business. Legislation that makes it illegal for management to make decisions, once legal and fair, that affects you and people like you from being able to access information regardless of any damage it may cause.

It's plainly too hard for some consumers to take their business somewhere else, or to write to management to explain their reasoning.

I am very happy that I don't have to run my business with regulations from people like yourself, thank God I live in a free and democratic country.

You can believe what you want, as you say , its a free country.
Belief and facts unfortunately, are very much different things, you are putting words in my mouth.
I never at any stage suggested the government bring in regulations, they already do that, or more precisely, their lackeys in the press, the the think tanks, and the education system, and most recently, ESG experts from Superannuation funds, do that for them.
I want the government and its lackeys out of my life, I don't want or need them telling me how to think, what to eat, what car to drive, what things I should watch or read, or who I should believe.
You only have to look at how ineffectual the watchdogs like ASIC, ASX, APRA and hosts of other useless public service quangos
Mick

 

[JohnDe]

You can believe what you want, as you say , its a free country.

I never at any stage suggested the government bring in regulations,
Mick

Then what do you suggest is done to sort out your problem - business censoring information that you believe should be released regardless of consequences.

 

[Dona Ferentes]

And watch out for Chelsea Manning .... it's a honey trap

 

[qldfrog]

I think all the CIA trolls and let's eat commies dinosaurs here missed that one.

Damaged European undersea cables impact internet connectivity worldwide - PanamaTimes

An unlikely coincidence or did Russian sabotage temporarily put Internet access on hold?

panatimes.com

So either pay back from Russia after the pipelines sabotages, or just the US ramping up the heat:
after all ,how convenient that EU seems to be the only target from Russia time after time....

 

[waterbottle]

Anyone know how legit this is?

Trump's yearslong crusade against Ukraine has finally come home to roost as Republicans call for abandoning Kyiv

A far-right GOP faction is urging sharp cuts to US aid to Ukraine, which would cut the legs out from under Ukraine's efforts to retake its territory.

www.businessinsider.com

If true, it would be a game changer IMO. Would leave the door open for Russia to clean up. Big global implications.