The Gillard Government

[nulla nulla]

LOL hilarious the mob here think pokies are wonderful (libertarian what rubbish, lets release / legalise a few more additive habits)and would rather argue the politics rather that the findings of the productivity commission that its really screwing the lives of a lot of people.

Finaly a voice of reason. Alcohol, Smoking and Poker machines. Huge money spinners in the economy, huge sources of tax revenue and incredible drains on the community through health, poverty and crime.

Maybe we should legalise marijuana and herion as well because to deny users access to their prefered drug is an infringement on civil liberties. Get real.

 

[Julia]

LOL hilarious the mob here think pokies are wonderful

What an utterly illogical, silly interpretation of the assertion that people should be free to choose how they spend their money. So typical of the Left's inability to mount a logical argument.

I personally find pokies total nonsense, have no interest in them whatsoever. But I acknowledge that many people have some fun with them. In some regional towns it's probably the only 'entertainment' available.

I've also facilitated a support group for addicted pokie gamblers and am only too aware that if they couldn't play the stupid pokies they would be gambling in some other arena. It's not the machines that are the problem. It's the personal problems of particular people who find diversion from their boring lives in the promise of a nirvana when they strike that great jackpot. The same people are usually also addicted to alcohol and nicotine, often the horses as well.

 

[moXJO]

Don't forget to ban sugar, junk food, white flour, cars or anything else that might wreck peoples lives. Maybe mother government can wipe your ar$es as well so you don't put your fingers in your mouth cause you are too stupid to know the effects of it (plus might be addictive for you)

you losers would have it so we couldn't move.

 

[lindsayf]

What an utterly illogical, silly interpretation of the assertion that people should be free to choose how they spend their money. So typical of the Left's inability to mount a logical argument.

I personally find pokies total nonsense, have no interest in them whatsoever. But I acknowledge that many people have some fun with them. In some regional towns it's probably the only 'entertainment' available.

I've also facilitated a support group for addicted pokie gamblers and am only too aware that if they couldn't play the stupid pokies they would be gambling in some other arena. It's not the machines that are the problem. It's the personal problems of particular people who find diversion from their boring lives in the promise of a nirvana when they strike that great jackpot. The same people are usually also addicted to alcohol and nicotine, often the horses as well.

Julia
I hear that assertion a lot - ie that if it wasnt the pokies it would certainly be another form of gambling. The club lobby pushed that line a lot. It may be true for some. I have not seen any credible research that this kind of substitution is real and measurable. The vast majority of problem gamblers are still pokies players. I dont find this line of reasoning convincing at all as some kind of defense to do nothing about pokies. I agree that there are certainly 'boring lives' but also traumatised lives that play into the pokies siren.

 

[IFocus]

What an utterly illogical, silly interpretation of the assertion that people should be free to choose how they spend their money. So typical of the Left's inability to mount a logical argument.

Your statement is illogical and fails to mount a logical argument .

I personally find pokies total nonsense, have no interest in them whatsoever.

But I acknowledge that many people have some fun with them. In some regional towns it's probably the only 'entertainment' available.

I've also facilitated a support group for addicted pokie gamblers and am only too aware that if they couldn't play the stupid pokies they would be gambling in some other arena. It's not the machines that are the problem. It's the personal problems of particular people who find diversion from their boring lives in the promise of a nirvana when they strike that great jackpot. The same people are usually also addicted to alcohol and nicotine, often the horses as well.

From the pokies thread this post basically stop the discussion.

Apologies for off topic.

Cut pasted relevant parts of Tim Costello's article if any one can dispute his claims feel free to do so coming from WA I just find it mind boggling how people argue the political debate rather than the issue.

Abbott has chosen to fill this space with his predict BS statement.

After a decade of research and a comprehensive report by the Productivity Commission, we know the answers to address why 40 per cent of all profits come from problem gambling.

After illicit drugs, pokies are the second greatest contributor to crime.
Some 86 per cent of problem gambling in Australia is from pokies.
Australia has the highest loss machines in the world - it is possible to lose over $1,200 an hour on modern machines.

The 2008 Productivity Commission into gambling estimated that problem gamblers lose an average of $21,000 a year gambling - and that the social cost of problem gambling is at least $4.7 billion per year.

Supporters of pokies reform are not interested in stopping people enjoying recreational gambling. The reforms currently proposed will barely impact on the majority of players.

While you may have missed it in the clubs' misinformation campaign, the Wilkie scheme does not require pre-commitment for lower loss machines, which have maximum bets of $1 per spin and have an average hourly loss of $120 and consequently do less damage.

Mandatory pre-commitment will only apply to those high-loss machines that are causing the most damage.

In Western Australia, the absence of pokies has not resulted in an increase in online gambling

In fact, WA has mainland Australia's highest recreation and sports participation rates. NSW in contrast has the lowest.

only 2.7 per cent of pokie profits go to supporting community and sporting groups.
WA does not depend on exploiting weak and vulnerable people to achieve community activity.

Mr Abbott's solution to this problem of "more counselling" is not supported by the evidence. The Productivity Commission found that only 15 per cent of problem gamblers seek help.

The recent polling of public support for pokies reform is encouraging. The more than 60 per cent public support, despite a $20 million misinformation campaign by Clubs Australia, shows that Australians know vested interest when they see it.

 

[drsmith]

Apologies for off topic.

I hope you're not a Dockers supporter as well.

 

[sptrawler]

IFocus, I would love nothing more than to agree with you.
But my sons work and live in mining towns work $hit loads of hours and have to drive 1hr in 1hr out 12hr shift.
All for $/hr no penalties no time and a half for the first two hrs then double time. No time and a half for saturday double time for sunday.
So basically it ends up a 60 hr week for $40-50/hr. These are the guys labor are hitting for being fat cats.
Maybe if Julia tried a bit of the fly in fly out she wouldn't be a fat cat.
Maybe if she payed rent in these towns or bought food in these towns. She would realise they aren't any better off than people in the cities on a normal wage.
Actually Ifocus, don't know how old you are but if you are under 70 I'm sure I could get you a job.
May affect any dissability pension or normal pension your getting, but as labor says we have to get you back to work.LOL,LOL,LOL
Or maybe TPI, we can get you off that,. 15hrs a week is a lolipop man 1.5 morning 1.5 afternoon $20/hr. Thats $600/ fortnight gets you off the disabilityLOL,LOL
Hope youve put yourself down, they are screaming out for lolliop people, zimmer frame o.k, just wave the flag.LOL,LOL
Lets race to the bottom.

 

[Starcraftmazter]

What an utterly illogical, silly interpretation of the assertion that people should be free to choose how they spend their money.

So they should be able to buy guns, nuclear weapons, child prostitutes - that sort of thing?

So typical of the Left's inability to mount a logical argument.

So typical of you to label your opposition as belonging to a certain "wing" of politics instead of mounting a coherent argument

This is apart from the fact that it is far more typical of right wing to restrict personal liberties with the excuse of morality or whatnot. Take marijuana for instance - are you going to complain about the right's inability to ledge a coherent argument against it?

 

[IFocus]

IFocus, I would love nothing more than to agree with you.
But my sons work and live in mining towns work $hit loads of hours and have to drive 1hr in 1hr out 12hr shift.
All for $/hr no penalties no time and a half for the first two hrs then double time. No time and a half for saturday double time for sunday.
So basically it ends up a 60 hr week for $40-50/hr. These are the guys labor are hitting for being fat cats.
Maybe if Julia tried a bit of the fly in fly out she wouldn't be a fat cat.
Maybe if she payed rent in these towns or bought food in these towns. She would realise they aren't any better off than people in the cities on a normal wage.
Actually Ifocus, don't know how old you are but if you are under 70 I'm sure I could get you a job.
May affect any dissability pension or normal pension your getting, but as labor says we have to get you back to work.LOL,LOL,LOL
Or maybe TPI, we can get you off that,. 15hrs a week is a lolipop man 1.5 morning 1.5 afternoon $20/hr. Thats $600/ fortnight gets you off the disabilityLOL,LOL
Hope youve put yourself down, they are screaming out for lolliop people, zimmer frame o.k, just wave the flag.LOL,LOL
Lets race to the bottom.

sptrawler please post when your sober..............

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

sptrawler please post when your sober..............

What a demeaning response, you just don't get the reality of how much strife the ALP has created for workers.

gg

 

[sptrawler]

sptrawler please post when your sober..............

Will do. LOL
The fact still remains, labor have lost the plot with regard a normal wage.
Also the point I was making about disability pensions, I realise it is open to rorting, however 15hrs a week is ridiculously low. As I said cross walk attendants do 15hrs a week but their pay is too low to live on and the dole is a lot lower than disability.
It is just another tax saving rort by labor on the ones who can least afford it.
Now were did I put that beer.LOL

 

[IFocus]

What a demeaning response, you just don't get the reality of how much strife the ALP has created for workers.

gg

The only time the far right feel comfortable taking the high moral ground is when they can smell blood it over rides the guilt and shame LOL, as for the workers your good friend Gina has a plan for them and it unfortunately doesn't involve work.

 

[IFocus]

Will do. LOL
The fact still remains, labor have lost the plot with regard a normal wage.

Shezzers Sptrawer you have to stop reading those eastern states rags they the call news. The US is where real wages have not moved from the 90's in real terms Howard tried to do the same here but I think the number is 37% improvement in real terms for Australia over the same period quoted for the US. Keating reeled it off a few months back.

Also the point I was making about disability pensions, I realise it is open to rorting, however 15hrs a week is ridiculously low. As I said cross walk attendants do 15hrs a week but their pay is too low to live on and the dole is a lot lower than disability.
It is just another tax saving rort by labor on the ones who can least afford it.
Now were did I put that beer.LOL

Only bit I understand here is about the beer

 

[sptrawler]

Shezzers Sptrawer you have to stop reading those eastern states rags they the call news. The US is where real wages have not moved from the 90's in real terms Howard tried to do the same here but I think the number is 37% improvement in real terms for Australia over the same period quoted for the US. Keating reeled it off a few months back

It is hard to compare countries, I went to Kal a couple of weeks back and stopped in Southern Cross. The barmaid was from the U.S on a working holiday and said she was heading back as soon as possible because she was having to use her savings to suppliment her pay to make ends meet.
She couldn't believe how expensive Australia is, she said accomadation, food, fuel is double the cost of the U.S.
We all know the disparity in the cost of cars, clothing, housing, electronics, as can be seen by the increase in internet purchases. I think $10/hr in the U.S goes a lot further than$17/hr here. From what I can find out renting in the U.K is about 100-120pnd/wk, the U.S $130-200/wk, here $300-400/wk.
As for Keating, under the wages accord, wages went down 18% in real terms, on his watch.LOL
Also I think you will find the big payrises came under Howard, I know they did in the trades.

 

[So_Cynical]

What a demeaning response, you just don't get the reality of how much strife the ALP has created for workers.

gg

I'm a worker...im not in strife.

Sure your not just making **** up.

 

[sptrawler]

I'm a worker...im not in strife.

Sure your not just making **** up.

I'm not in strife either, but i'm not on $17-20/hr and renting.

 

[joea]

Well this week I will be turning off the TV and, maybe read a book or check the market closer.

I just do not think I will be able to handle the utter from Gillard::
"Friends"
"Well now the distraction is over I can continue on getting things done".
joea

 

[Logique]

In the background, Labor-Greens are quietly closing the two party preferred gap, despite electors still not warming to the PM. The time chart was in the media at the weekend, The Insiders I think. Once the carbon tax compensation gets under way the gap will close further.

 

[joea]

Oscars from Bloody Monday.

Most moving and honest speech...... Albanese

Worst director........Hawker.

Most unbelievable speech....Gillard.

Most unbelievable story.....Arbid.

Best dressed........... Annabel Crabb

joea

 

[Logique]

Mutiny kills PM's Bob Carr plan - Dennis Shanahan and Matthew Franklin From: The Australian February 29 - http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...ms-bob-carr-plan/story-fn59niix-1226284538034

Drafting Bob Carr? Has to be a 'what was she thinking' moment. Gillard thinks Bob Carr was a 'remarkable premier of NSW' Ask anyone living outside the Sydney Basin!

What has Stephen Smith done to deserve such disrespect? A very capable Foreign Minister who graciously stepped aside for Rudd.

Also the disposal of Rudd hasn't seemed to halt the leaks and backgrounding of the media. Funny that..