How to identify an investment scam

[divs4ever]

I also reflect on some of the big failures of companies I was invested in. I can accept that nothing is certain, that projects might not work out and that genuine errors can be made.

But IMV that wasn't the case with Linc Energy for example. The company knew its technology was failing from an early stage and just covered it up and left an emvironmental disaster behind

don't forget that major investor ( in Linc ) that is still too big to let fail ( in fact probably got ANOTHER bail-out recently ), nobody seemed to pursue them

( disclosure i had a very nice run in LNC but that was a combination of luck , instinct and skepticism )

 

[Belli]

By relying entirely on the education system it removes all responsibility of parents to be involved. And most school leavers probably couldn't give a rats about it anyway. Too many other things to do.

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

By relying entirely on the education system it removes all responsibility of parents to be involved. And most school leavers probably couldn't give a rats about it anyway. Too many other things to do.

That is why it needs to be embedded in the curriculum from Grade 1.

Dollar mites in G1.

When maths is taught move on to compound interest etc ...

History ... Tulips, GFC, Magellan Finance.

gg

 

[DannyB0000]

With the internet and cold calling anyone can claim they are somewhere and they’re not, you can’t believe everything written on the internet is legit.

If you bother reading the news, educate yourself about these scams, they stand out, easy to spot.

If some random person claiming to be from an investment firm calls you of the blue, it’s best to hang up, don’t rush into things. I think it’s better to visit these investment firms in person rather than do everything on the internet, scammers use fake websites to trick people.

 

[divs4ever]

By relying entirely on the education system it removes all responsibility of parents to be involved. And most school leavers probably couldn't give a rats about it anyway. Too many other things to do.

given my age ( closing in on 70 ) many of my peers either have already fallen for those scams ( and learned something the hard way ) or have survived in blissful ignorance.
so not only do THEY not have a solid financial education , but neither will their children or grandchildren ,
so how can the parents pass on the knowledge they themselves don't have

now i don't expect every school-leaver to have the equivalent of a CFA ( or CPA ) but certainly sufficient wisdom to ask pertinent questions of their financial adviser and wise enough to sense when something is awry

 

[basilio]

John Hempton owner of Bronte Capital has a newsletter. John's busines focus is identifying scam or overblown companies, writing an expose and shorting the hell out of them. He has had some spectacular successes.

This article outlines the Wire Card scam which in Johns view was the biggest fraud every run in Europe. He reviews a book which examines the Wire Card fraud in detail but his article does a good job of overviewing the story and identifying the signs of a corporate con.

John's newsletter is good value IMO.

The Wirecard Book​

John Hempton
Jun 30, 2022



Dan McCrum - the Financial Times journalist - has released a blockbuster finance book - the story of Wirecard.
The book is called Money Men: A Hot Startup, A Billion Dollar Fraud, A Fight for the Truth.

Wirecard is - I think - the biggest fraud by dollar value and scale ever conducted in Europe.

Whatever: just buy the book. It is really good fun. I do not agree with all of Dan's perspectives - or even some of the analysis - but it is a great story about bad accounting, worse sell side analysts and completely awful regulators.

It is also a story of Libyan and Austrian secret agents, guys who run night clubs, pornographers and fraud. Oh, and guys who turn up in Syria with the very best body armour money can buy only to be told by the cool heads that that body armour marks them as a high-value target and the snipers would shoot them dead so they better leave it behind.

Dan also tells a story about how he looked - for work - at several thousand pr0n sites - and how he even spent some of the Financial Times money using a credit card to buy pr0n.

And yes - this was a perfectly legitimate work activity. Not like when the SEC did it.
It is above all a story about how surprising (and often nasty) the world is.

The Wirecard Book

Dan McCrum - the Financial Times journalist - has released a blockbuster finance book - the story of Wirecard. The book is called Money Men: A Hot Startup, A Billion Dollar Fraud, A Fight for the Truth. Wirecard is - I think - the biggest fraud by dollar value and scale ever conducted in Europe.

johnhempton.substack.com

 

[basilio]

Came across this story from The Free Press website.
The creativity of the young wunderkids.

→ My favorite New York City arrestee: Is not Trump, though we had some fun Tuesday. My favorite is Charlie Javice, the 31-year-old wunderkind founder of a company called Frank, which helped students with financial aid applications. Javice was on top of the world (or at least on the 2019 Forbes 30 Under 30 list), and in 2021 she sold Frank to JPMorgan for $175 million. But when JPMorgan started kicking the tires, they realized our girlboss had claimed the company had four million customers—but it only had. . . 300,000. It turns out she basically made up that four million number and a bunch of emails bounced when JPMorgan tried to reach the pool of people. I mean, let them cast the first stone, am I right?

This week, she was arrested on conspiracy to commit wire fraud, wire fraud, bank fraud, securities fraud, you name it fraud.

If you’re like me and enjoy reading complaints, you might enjoy SEC v. Javice for gems like how she paid a data science professor to build her Potemkin village of student users: “In a series of messages, Javice guided the Data Science Professor in creating a list of fake user data, answering questions from him about how the data should look.”

Now she’s out on bail. But I think this arrest is foolish. If I were JPMorgan, I wouldn’t sue her, and here’s why: Javice sold her company for $175 million. But what did she pay the data scientist who made her entire fake company, filling it with fake activity? $18,000. He didn’t even get healthcare. If I were JPMorgan, I’d keep talent like that in-house. Charlie, come run The Free Press!

Charlie Javice freed on $2M bond after defrauding JPMorgan charge

If convicted, Charlie Javice — who was featured on the Forbes “30 under 30” list in 2019 — could face decades in prison.

nypost.com

 

[divs4ever]

Came across this story from The Free Press website.
The creativity of the young wunderkids.

→ My favorite New York City arrestee: Is not Trump, though we had some fun Tuesday. My favorite is Charlie Javice, the 31-year-old wunderkind founder of a company called Frank, which helped students with financial aid applications. Javice was on top of the world (or at least on the 2019 Forbes 30 Under 30 list), and in 2021 she sold Frank to JPMorgan for $175 million. But when JPMorgan started kicking the tires, they realized our girlboss had claimed the company had four million customers—but it only had. . . 300,000. It turns out she basically made up that four million number and a bunch of emails bounced when JPMorgan tried to reach the pool of people. I mean, let them cast the first stone, am I right?

This week, she was arrested on conspiracy to commit wire fraud, wire fraud, bank fraud, securities fraud, you name it fraud.

If you’re like me and enjoy reading complaints, you might enjoy SEC v. Javice for gems like how she paid a data science professor to build her Potemkin village of student users: “In a series of messages, Javice guided the Data Science Professor in creating a list of fake user data, answering questions from him about how the data should look.”

Now she’s out on bail. But I think this arrest is foolish. If I were JPMorgan, I wouldn’t sue her, and here’s why: Javice sold her company for $175 million. But what did she pay the data scientist who made her entire fake company, filling it with fake activity? $18,000. He didn’t even get healthcare. If I were JPMorgan, I’d keep talent like that in-house. Charlie, come run The Free Press!

Charlie Javice freed on $2M bond after defrauding JPMorgan charge

If convicted, Charlie Javice — who was featured on the Forbes “30 under 30” list in 2019 — could face decades in prison.

nypost.com

a different version

JPMorgan's dealmaking flurry being scrutinized by US regulator - FT

https://www.investing.com/news/stoc...being-scrutinized-by-us-regulator--ft-3050825

and here comes another ..... slap on the wrist with a damp lettuce leaf

if she goes to jail she is liable to become a hero there as ' the girl who screwed over JP Morgan ' ( the irony of tricking JP Morgan and Dimon ) ( not to mention going to jail before senior execs at JP Morgan despite their numerous out-of-court settlements )

will be interesting to see if the SEC investigates the due diligence process of JP Morgan as they seem to have paid up before discovering the anomalies ( surely they checked the Frank accounts and bank accounts at least to see if the company was generating the claimed income and complying with all the regulations ) , mind you the SEC seems to be wearing some egg as well ( just maybe not as much as the Bernie Madoff saga )

 

[divs4ever]

and to show Charlie is liable to put up a fight

*** Javice filed counterclaims in February, accusing JPMorgan of having "compromised her reputation" and wrongfully withheld $28 million of retention payments and equity. ***

i would have thought swindling JP Morgan would only enhance her reputation ( i can see the book now , with a movie to follow )

now of course if she can prove she signed up , say , 4 million illegal immigrants ( who are less likely to have real email accounts ) that could be real chaos ( and drag in a political party or two )

 

[basilio]

a different version

JPMorgan's dealmaking flurry being scrutinized by US regulator - FT

https://www.investing.com/news/stoc...being-scrutinized-by-us-regulator--ft-3050825

and here comes another ..... slap on the wrist with a damp lettuce leaf

if she goes to jail she is liable to become a hero there as ' the girl who screwed over JP Morgan ' ( the irony of tricking JP Morgan and Dimon ) ( not to mention going to jail before senior execs at JP Morgan despite their numerous out-of-court settlements )

will be interesting to see if the SEC investigates the due diligence process of JP Morgan as they seem to have paid up before discovering the anomalies ( surely they checked the Frank accounts and bank accounts at least to see if the company was generating the claimed income and complying with all the regulations ) , mind you the SEC seems to be wearing some egg as well ( just maybe not as much as the Bernie Madoff saga )

It does seem as if JP Morgan gets very itchy trigger fingers when making a "deal". Exactly how much due diligence was done? Where is teh paper work ? It will be intriguing to see the outcome.

 

[divs4ever]

It does seem as if JP Morgan gets very itchy trigger fingers when making a "deal". Exactly how much due diligence was done? Where is teh paper work ? It will be intriguing to see the outcome.

it is not as though JP Morgan is a novice in the acquisition game

was Frank ( the company ) packaged up as a business in deep distress ?

$175 million for ( allegedly ) 4.25 million student loan 'customers ' creates some interesting math (. given ( so far ) student loan debt is unforgivable aka 'debt for life ' ( or full repayment )

IF Charlie deliberately took advantage of Biden's promises to expunge existing student loan obligations , and so appear as a mortally wounded business ... well played Charlie , maybe she will get a cameo role in Ocean's 17 when it is made

 

[cynic]

https://asic.gov.au/about-asic/news...bsites or by direct contact with real victims

 

[sptrawler]

Good pickup @cynic , Jaden Erick joined today six posts all the same, very suss.

 

[farmerge]

Tax time is close to be being again.
Have had a couple of text messages claiming that the ATO is holding my refund.
All I have to do is click on the link and blah blah blah.
A bit odd as the financial year is not yet finished.
But I guess when a dud is trying to scam they are not smart enough to realise that June 30 is the cut off date not May 31.
No doubt, they the morons will keep trying.

 

[colly601]

given my age ( closing in on 70 ) many of my peers either have already fallen for those scams ( and learned something the hard way ) or have survived in blissful ignorance.
so not only do THEY not have a solid financial education , but neither will their children or grandchildren ,
so how can the parents pass on the knowledge they themselves don't have

now i don't expect every school-leaver to have the equivalent of a CFA ( or CPA ) but certainly sufficient wisdom to ask pertinent questions of their financial adviser and wise enough to sense when something is awry

Part of why life is so unfair is how so much depends on your upbringing, it's exactly like you said, except for a so called lucky few who get saved early on by an external force, again, lucky few given the nature of the world we live in

 

[Value Collector]

Part of why life is so unfair is how so much depends on your upbringing, it's exactly like you said, except for a so called lucky few who get saved early on by an external force, again, lucky few given the nature of the world we live in

Yeah, unfortunately it’s a growing threat that the older generation just didn’t grow up with, so don’t have the tools.

They know to lock their doors, avoid dark alleys, but clicking on those Text message scams seems so innocent. It’s terrible.

My teenage nieces can spot scams a mile away, but my parents are only slowly learning, atleast once a week I get a screen shot from my Mum saying “Is this real?” But she is getting better.

 

[colly601]

Yeah, unfortunately it’s a growing threat that the older generation just didn’t grow up with, so don’t have the tools.

They know to lock their doors, avoid dark alleys, but clicking on those Text message scams seems so innocent. It’s terrible.

My teenage nieces can spot scams a mile away, but my parents are only slowly learning, atleast once a week I get a screen shot from my Mum saying “Is this real?” But she is getting better.

It sucks how at some point our brains just refuse to absorb things as efficiently, not just technology but everything else, it's something we need most especially when things evolve so fast and there's always that "next big thing"

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

The problem is not "How to recognise an investment scam ?" but rather how in the majority of cases people are

1. so gullible and
2. so keen to find an easy way out of their problems in the first place.

Were I young again and wanted to study a certain course there is no way I would have used FRANK, whether I thought it was a con or not. I would have worked and saved to get admission to the course and then worked through my course length to achieve an education in my area of interest. Just me. Neither a borrower etc. particularly as many people now commit themselves to mickey mouse degrees part-time while they attend demonstrations, literary festivals and watch day time TV.

Australia has one of the higher percentages of people affected by scams on a worldwide population/income basis. This is partly due to our social security safety net whereby if one is stupid one is rewarded. ( I've no problem with a proper safety net btw ). It is also due to stupidity. Also every stupidity is medicalised e.g pokies gamblers are not stupid they are unwell. So a whole medical industry is set up to cater for a mob who just need to not be rescued to "get better".

End of rant.

gg

 

[farmerge]

The problem is not "How to recognise an investment scam ?" but rather how in the majority of cases people are

1. so gullible and
2. so keen to find an easy way out of their problems in the first place.

Were I young again and wanted to study a certain course there is no way I would have used FRANK, whether I thought it was a con or not. I would have worked and saved to get admission to the course and then worked through my course length to achieve an education in my area of interest. Just me. Neither a borrower etc. particularly as many people now commit themselves to mickey mouse degrees part-time while they attend demonstrations, literary festivals and watch day time TV.

Australia has one of the higher percentages of people affected by scams on a worldwide population/income basis. This is partly due to our social security safety net whereby if one is stupid one is rewarded. ( I've no problem with a proper safety net btw ). It is also due to stupidity. Also every stupidity is medicalised e.g pokies gamblers are not stupid they are unwell. So a whole medical industry is set up to cater for a mob who just need to not be rescued to "get better".

End of rant.

gg

Just paid an account on line but before I could get it processed the bank needed verification that the recipient was who he was saying he was. Good safety net I believe.