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There has been a lot of media attention recently regarding negative gearing etc. so I decided to take same action and write Mr Hockey an email stating my displeasure at his inaction on housing affordability. His email address is joe.hockey.mp@aph.gov.au for anyone interested in doing the same. Email was as follows:

Dear Mr. Hockey,

I'm a 31 year old non-homeowner and single working professional and I wanted to state my displeasure at your lack of real action on tackling affordability issues of housing for young Australians.

You have previously stated recently that "I get a lot of people approaching me saying that young people should be able to use their superannuation to fund a deposit on their home". Now this is obviously very different to "I get a lot of young people saying they should be able to use their superannuation to fund a deposit on their home". If I was a baby boomer with investment properties and I was only concerned for my own welfare I'd probably want young people to access Superannuation also as this additional buying power would go straight into my pockets. However, I'd like to think I put the welfare of Australia first before my own benefit - These people do actually exist Mr. Hockey.

By focusing purely on increasing demand you do very little to increase housing affordability and this simply increases already extremely high housing. The same thing happened when First Home Owner Grants were double or even tripled by the Labor Party during the last financial crisis it simply brought future demand forward and increased the cost of housing. Young people don't want gimmicks to assist with housing they want cheaper housing which the generations before them received.

In regards to negative gearing which you have talked about recently you stated that this actually increased the costs of rents when it was previously removed by the Hawke/Keating government in 1985. You are 100% correct that rents increased during this period however clearly you don't understand the difference between correlation and causation or you are choosing to ignore the real reason rents increased. As you are aware this was an extremely high inflationary period so if we actually adjusted for inflation rents were actually stable during this period although they did rise in Sydney and Perth but fell in every other state in inflation adjusted terms.

I think we should constantly strive to be the best country in the world and at the moment if I was being honest I feel ashamed to be Australian. High house prices does not create wealth it creates debt. For every seller there must be a buyer it is a zero-sum game. We had a once in a life time mining boom and we have nothing to show for it except for high housing. The fascinating thing about basic economic theory is you can constantly change the rules (i.e. negative gearing, FHOG, leverage for super funds etc.) as much as you want but you are only prolonging the inevitable when things revert to the mean. So you can either take some initiative now or potentially be remembered as the treasury who led us into the next depression. Three out of four of the major bank CEO's have left in the last six months or so and the current CEO of CBA recently sold a property in Paddington, Sydney. Perhaps they see the writing on the wall..

Although I would benefit greatly from a crash in house prices this is not my wish. The only way to prevent a crash from occurring is to take action today. Sadly I think real tax reform will only happen during times of crisis which is a real shame. All the work has already been done for you Mr Hockey with the David Murray inquiry and the Ken Henry tax review. It is just awaiting someone of your capacity to implement. Wouldn't you rather have this as your legacy?

Regards,
 
No worries. :)

For the record, I'm not suggesting that anyone should, or shouldn't move to Tas or any other particular state. I am just observing that there is a significant difference in the price of comparable housing between (say) Sydney versus Hobart or Adelaide and that this would logically lead to at least some people considering a move for financial or other reasons.

There are some really cheap houses down in TAS. Have prices moved up much in recent years smurf?
 
There are some really cheap houses down in TAS. Have prices moved up much in recent years smurf?

Circa 1996 I remember someone I knew buying a house for $160K. I thought they were crazy, since that was a ridiculously high price to pay for a house at that time. They got a 5 bedroom place with water views in a nice suburb of Hobart. A more typical house at that time was around $100K give or take a bit.

Today, an typical house would be around the $350K mark but that hasn't changed much since around 2007-08, prior to which prices were going up at a ridiculous pace and roughly quadrupled in a decade. But I could buy a comparable house today for the same price I paid for this one 7.5 years ago so not much movement since no matter what any official stats might say.

Overall, it very much depends on where in the state. Hobart isn't doing too badly economically. But if you go to Burnie then things are pretty dismal up there so far as employment is concerned. And if you look at somewhere like Queenstown well then it's jobs? What jobs? With the mine shut there really aren't any apart from a handful in tourist accommodation, local shops, with the local council and on the (steam) railway. Hence house prices vary hugely across the state.

The mine at Queenstown may reopen someday, that is a definite possibility although it is by no means certain. House prices there will rise if it does get going again. But if you look at Burnie, well manufacturing will never recover there because the big factories that once dominated the place haven't simply downsized, they've closed altogether and are now physically demolished. They're not coming back and whatever economic future exists in that region depends largely on the shipping port, tourism, agriculture and things like that. :2twocents
 
The medication also produced some unexplained rage which i cannot explain as it shouldnt really do that. Having read what was actually written i have to apologise to you and smurf.

Quincy Magoo (or simply Mr. Magoo) is a cartoon character created at the UPA animation studio in 1949. Voiced by Jim Backus, Quincy Magoo is a wealthy, short-statured retiree who gets into a series of comical situations as a result of his nearsightedness, compounded by his stubborn refusal to admit the problem. However, through uncanny streaks of luck, the situation always seems to work itself out for him, leaving him no worse than before.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mr._Magoo

Glad we have sorted this one out Mrmagoo.

Over the last 20 years, the cost of building a new house has increased nearly fourfold. The increase can be partly explained by a 32.7% increase in the average size of new houses.

http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@...2609898B87F95519CA25792D000E2DF5?OpenDocument

Old data I know but it does evidence what I have been banging on about. No one wants a 3 bedroom 1 bathroom starter home anymore. Consumerism has been rampant for a while now and will not show any signs of slowing down IMO :2twocents
 
Quincy Magoo (or simply Mr. Magoo) is a cartoon character created at the UPA animation studio in 1949. Voiced by Jim Backus, Quincy Magoo is a wealthy, short-statured retiree who gets into a series of comical situations as a result of his nearsightedness, compounded by his stubborn refusal to admit the problem. However, through uncanny streaks of luck, the situation always seems to work itself out for him, leaving him no worse than before.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mr._Magoo

Glad we have sorted this one out Mrmagoo.



http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@...2609898B87F95519CA25792D000E2DF5?OpenDocument

Old data I know but it does evidence what I have been banging on about. No one wants a 3 bedroom 1 bathroom starter home anymore. Consumerism has been rampant for a while now and will not show any signs of slowing down IMO :2twocents

Your diagnosis would be more convincing if 3 bedroom, 1 bathroom homes hadn't also increased massively in price.
 
Old data I know but it does evidence what I have been banging on about. No one wants a 3 bedroom 1 bathroom starter home anymore. Consumerism has been rampant for a while now and will not show any signs of slowing down IMO :2twocents

I think you are right again trainspotter, probably the reason why country W.A is struggling and inner city Perth has been rampant.
Everyone figures buy close to the city, no matter what the cost, develop it no matter what the cost and make a zillion dollars.

Simple logics don't worry about the debt, you're going to double your money.:eek:
 
Your diagnosis would be more convincing if 3 bedroom, 1 bathroom homes hadn't also increased massively in price.

You have trouble understanding the written word do you not? So price increase 4 fold in a 20 year period to construct a home with 1/3 of the cost due to the increase in size of the home means nothing to you? SHEEEEEEEEEESH !! :banghead:
 
You have trouble understanding the written word do you not? So price increase 4 fold in a 20 year period to construct a home with 1/3 of the cost due to the increase in size of the home means nothing to you? SHEEEEEEEEEESH !! :banghead:

point taken for the average house but that would not apply to units.There are only so many shiny european appliances you can add in a unit, sizes are even smaller and quality (real aka insulation, etc) is not exactly great
 
point taken for the average house but that would not apply to units.There are only so many shiny european appliances you can add in a unit, sizes are even smaller and quality (real aka insulation, etc) is not exactly great

Sorry qldfrog but the point I am trying to make is that the price increase for CONSTRUCTION has been 4 fold in a 20 year period. PERIOD. It does not matter if they are units or houses or town houses or complexes or whatever you want to call it. The COST to build has risen 400% in 20 years. Let's do some maths shall we:

$50,000 to build a "whatever" in 1980
$70,750 IN 1985 - Year 5
$100,111 IN 1990 - Year 10
$141,657 IN 1995 - Year 15
$200,445 IN 2000 - Year 20

Or a rate of 41.5% COST increase over a 5 year period to construct thereon. Approx 7.19346% per annum compounding (date range is for comedy purposes only and to evidence a formulae)

NOT forgetting that the SIZE of the home has increased by 33% as well. Ipso facto the cost of building as well as the size increase has contributed to the overall increase of the price of homes. Not saying that this is the be all and end all of WHY houses are so expensive. Just trying to explain as to not all of it is the Guvmints fault but some of the blame has to be borne by the CONSUMERISM of society who demand they want bigger homes with more sophisticated methods of construction as well as higher end internal finishes (read marble tops and glass splash backs cause they saw it on telly)

*RANT OVER*
 
Sorry qldfrog but the point I am trying to make is that the price increase for CONSTRUCTION has been 4 fold in a 20 year period.
Fair but basically even if you want a fairly basic home /unit as a result as well of the construction cost increases you mention (and that should actually point to the hourly rate in Australia of the sparky/brick layers/carpenters), you end up having no fair priced option.
Of course, some will say that 100$ an hour for a sparky is required as he /she has to buy a house as well to live in.
But indeed, negative gearing (as it is most often seen as the culprit) is not IMHO such a big deal;
land and red tape (council mostly) are more to blame.
All this in one of the less populated place on earth.
 
This is what we need ASAP - 3D printed homes.

Might solved the govt. current superannuation housing problems, insurances companies will love it - cyclone damage, no worries - new house in 2 days cheaper than repairing, bring house prices down - with labour costs higher than materials costs, etc, etc.

No tradies trying to rip off and of course most of them will be out of work.

Go away for the weekend and have your home ready when you're back.



http://news.domain.com.au/domain/re...block-20150122-12vkri.html?rand=1421894371139
 
Sorry qldfrog but the point I am trying to make is that the price increase for CONSTRUCTION has been 4 fold in a 20 year period. PERIOD. It does not matter if they are units or houses or town houses or complexes or whatever you want to call it. The COST to build has risen 400% in 20 years. Let's do some maths shall we:

$50,000 to build a "whatever" in 1980
$70,750 IN 1985 - Year 5
$100,111 IN 1990 - Year 10
$141,657 IN 1995 - Year 15
$200,445 IN 2000 - Year 20

Or a rate of 41.5% COST increase over a 5 year period to construct thereon. Approx 7.19346% per annum compounding (date range is for comedy purposes only and to evidence a formulae)

NOT forgetting that the SIZE of the home has increased by 33% as well. Ipso facto the cost of building as well as the size increase has contributed to the overall increase of the price of homes. Not saying that this is the be all and end all of WHY houses are so expensive. Just trying to explain as to not all of it is the Guvmints fault but some of the blame has to be borne by the CONSUMERISM of society who demand they want bigger homes with more sophisticated methods of construction as well as higher end internal finishes (read marble tops and glass splash backs cause they saw it on telly)

*RANT OVER*

Fair point TS, a friend of mine owner built a triplex 20 years ago 5 k's from Perth cbd, cost $360,000.

He has decided to knock over his own home and owner build a double storey composite home, steel frame, thermal insulated cladding, high spec fit out.
He said at the conception phase, he would build two for less than $1m and sell one for $1m. I said he would get a shock.
Well he has now got the fixed price contract in, $800k each.:eek:
Double what he expected, and he is an astute investor, just shows how costs have quietly blow out, during the mining boom.
 
Consumerism and large houses are a Gen X and Baby boomer thing. Gen Y simply can't afford them. If anything they get very small houses in the outer suburbs. Often only a two bedroom townhouse. The boomers did not start with such small properties. Most were able to buy f family sized by 1s. Most Gen Y are simply struggling to survive. The older part of Gen Y at least have careers but the young ones of today don't even have that.

Drive around any prestige estate in the outer burbs and all you will see is empty Nester baby boomers with massive houses. They're the one's buying the 4 bedroom 2 bathroom plus study homes. Gen Y don't have that sort of coin. Maybe some of the older one's who were very successful might but they'd be more likely to take on a bigger mortgage and be closer to work. So that really only leaves the rich young tradesmen who might buy these mansions and they do. However, that is only a small portion of Gen Y. That is like saying all boomers are rich because they worked in the mines in the 1980s.

Living close to the city is not about prestige. You live close to the city so that you don' end up leaving home at 6:30 in the morning and getting home at 9:00 pm. The inner city is mostly dirty and over crowded. You end up having a much happier healthier life in suburbia.
 
In the past it was pretty common to see a young couple, early-20's, buy a modest 3 bedroom home with 1 bathroom in a reasonable suburb. Then a couple of years later, they were down to one income once the kids came along and the woman stopped work, or worked part time at most.

Plenty of people did that, indeed being married with kids and a house in the suburbs was society's "normal" expectation by the time someone was in their mid-20's.

Social attitudes and expectations have certainly changed, what was "old" to be getting married or having children is considered "young" today, but the point here is about housing. What was affordable then, even at much higher interest rates, is not affordable today. Housing has become far more expensive relative to the normal, typical jobs that someone in their 20's or even 30's is likely to actually have.

Society is increasingly divided. On one side are various professions and some trades as well as a few successful entrepreneurs etc. On the other side is the rest. What was available to just about anyone in the past, provided they were willing to work, is not available to many people today under the same circumstances. :2twocents
 
Living close to the city is not about prestige. You live close to the city so that you don' end up leaving home at 6:30 in the morning and getting home at 9:00 pm. The inner city is mostly dirty and over crowded. You end up having a much happier healthier life in suburbia.

Part of the issue there is that I strongly suspect that both Sydney and Melbourne have exceeded their most efficient scale. What, exactly, does having over 4 million people in a city achieve that can't be achieved with 2 million? Just about every business, public event and other thing that is viable in Sydney or Melbourne is also viable in Brisbane with roughly half the population.

Take a look at a map of Australia. Now realise that we've got 40% of our entire population living in just two cities. That doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Firstly there's the problem of transport around big cities in terms of both time taken and the cost. Secondly it's a massive strategic risk to have so much in just two places.
 
Part of the issue there is that I strongly suspect that both Sydney and Melbourne have exceeded their most efficient scale. What, exactly, does having over 4 million people in a city achieve that can't be achieved with 2 million? Just about every business, public event and other thing that is viable in Sydney or Melbourne is also viable in Brisbane with roughly half the population.

Take a look at a map of Australia. Now realise that we've got 40% of our entire population living in just two cities. That doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Firstly there's the problem of transport around big cities in terms of both time taken and the cost. Secondly it's a massive strategic risk to have so much in just two places.

Thing that annoys me is when they say: "a rising population is fine as long as we build the infrastructure required". The infrastructure required isn't going to get built for a variety of reasons (nimbyism, budget issues etc.) so immigration policy etc. should factor that in.
 
Society is increasingly divided. On one side are various professions and some trades as well as a few successful entrepreneurs etc. On the other side is the rest. What was available to just about anyone in the past, provided they were willing to work, is not available to many people today under the same circumstances

But Australia is supposed to be one of the most ‘egalitarian’ countries in the world!
I guess that just means there is one egalitarian class who own property and another egalitarian class who rent it. Or to put it another way, everyone is egalitarian but some are more egalitarian than others.
 
Secondly it's a massive strategic risk to have so much in just two places.

Suppose that something drastic happens in Sydney or Melbourne. Cyclone, major earthquake, major terrorist attack, whatever. The risk may be low, but it's not zero and never will be. We're pretty much stuffed as a country in terms of ability to deal with that given that 20% of the national population lives in each of those cities.

Obviously it wouldn't be good if something drastic happened somewhere smaller, say Adelaide or Newcastle, but at least it's more manageable in terms of scale both in terms of the physical effects and the broader economic ones.

I'm not suggesting that we go as far as reducing population in the 2 big cities, but it would be logical to direct growth elsewhere. And if you look at the sorts of economic activity which actually occurs in Sydney and Melbourne, well a lot of it has no reason to be there other than due to the current population balance. It's not like a mine which has to be where the minerals are, an office can be anywhere. And if we had more such businesses in Adelaide, Newcastle etc then it becomes viable for more people to live there.

Water? We already bring water quite some distance to Melbourne and Sydney. Same with power, it mostly comes from 150 - 200km away. Gas in Sydney comes all the way from Vic and SA. Food is mostly from quite some distance away as well. There's nothing stopping us, apart from the will to do so, from bringing those things into some other city if the population increases there.:2twocents
 
I don't know that the landmass supports much industry or population outside of population centers. This is not Europe.
 
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