The Conspiracy Theory thread

[moXJO]

Don't go willy-nilly looking at Holocaust denial sources as research. The majority of it is denial crap and its easy to fall down that hole. There's a lot of good info and debate that came out of things like the Zündel trial transcripts. Prof. Hilberg and Prof. Faurisson was a real info packed session.

There's other trials such as the David Irving vs lipstadt in which a lot of Irvings work is deconstructed.

There's a few trials where a lot of stuff from either side gets debunked

 

[moXJO]

Yeah Nah..

If you somehow can believe only 300,000 Jews were killed by the Nazis in WW2 than really what is the point ? Just the fact that there were around 6 million less Jews alive in Europe after the war than before it says much ( And that may not fully account for the murders across Russia )

The argument about the "exact" number of people killed/died/worked to death /disappeared in WW2 will always be moot. The round figure of 6 Million Jews falls into that category. Was it 6.1 m? 5.58 M ? 7,657,943 ?

What, in my view, isn't moot is the overwhelming process of State sanctioned massacres across all theaters of the war and in all countries.
I quoted the Wiki articles because of their indepth dive into all of these areas.

I struggle to see the point of attempting to minimise the extent and horror of what happened.

It's not "minimisation". The figures I quoted are still abhorrent. The Jews were still rounded up put into camps and mistreated. I have a problem with the numbers that were supposedly gassed. No there isn't definitive proof of the numbers either.

The figures at Auschwitz were already revised down from 4 million to 1.1 million. There were problems with various illnesses that killed a lot of people along with supply lines. There were other camps that were outright killing people and there were camps that were shown to not have gassed anyone despite "eyewitnesses" saying they did.

There are plenty of debates still raging on around the subject. Picking off Wikipedia is not the best source. There are plenty of historians that have debated on the subject.

I believe it should be talked about as there are currently a large amount of people who are now believing it didn't take place from one sided sources. It did take place. But the reasoning, scale, logistics have been wrapped in propaganda.
My figures or thinking are not set in stone. I'm actually reading a lot of the Jewish historians stuff at the moment.

 

[basilio]

I believe it should be talked about as there are currently a large amount of people who are now believing it didn't take place from one sided sources. It did take place. But the reasoning, scale, logistics have been wrapped in propaganda.
My figures or thinking are not set in stone. I'm actually reading a lot of the Jewish historians stuff at the moment.

Well good luck to you with that goal.. Your attempting to discuss/debate with "a large number of people" who now believe the Holocaust didn't take place ?
That is truly heroic..

The only dog I have in this fight is as getting as close to the truth as reasonable. I'm also not prepared to look away when rank misinformation/lies are postulated as possible or options or whatever.

If you are intent on researching the topic these resources may be of use.

WWII: victims of the Holocaust and Nazi genocide 1933-1945 | Statista

Most estimates place the total number of deaths during the Second World War at around 70-85 million people.

www.statista.com

Christian Gerlach - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Peter Longerich - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Empire of Destruction - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

-------------------------------------------------------
A quick point. The people sent to the concentration camps were not "mistreated" Moxjo. That sort of sounds like they were sent to bed without supper or something similar.

 

[moXJO]

Well good luck to you with that goal.. Your attempting to discuss/debate with "a large number of people" who now believe the Holocaust didn't take place ?
That is truly heroic..

The only dog I have in this fight is as getting as close to the truth as reasonable. I'm also not prepared to look away when rank misinformation/lies are postulated as possible or options or whatever.

If you are intent on researching the topic these resources may be of use.

WWII: victims of the Holocaust and Nazi genocide 1933-1945 | Statista

Most estimates place the total number of deaths during the Second World War at around 70-85 million people.

www.statista.com

Christian Gerlach - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Peter Longerich - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Empire of Destruction - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

-------------------------------------------------------
A quick point. The people sent to the concentration camps were not "mistreated" Moxjo. That sort of sounds like they were sent to bed without supper or something similar.

Murdered bas. You can insinuate what you want. I'm not denying the fact huge amounts of people were murdered.
Cherry pick the court cases. Idiots refer to Wikipedia

 

[basilio]

Murdered bas. You can insinuate what you want. I'm not denying the fact huge amounts of people were murdered.
Cherry pick the court cases. Idiots refer to Wikipedia

Idiots don't understand how to read. If you can't recognise quality information by just checking out the sources your welcome to fossick in your own select pools

Just because information is in Wiki in no way makes it wrong.

It may be. It may not be the full story. There may be other sources of information. The value of having multiple people looking over, updating, correcting, adding to information is substantial.

Was Statisa was also a site for idiots ?

Basta. Bye Moxjo.

 

[moXJO]

Idiots don't understand how to read. If you can't recognise quality information by just checking out the sources your welcome to fossick in your own select pools

Just because information is in Wiki in no way makes it wrong.

It may be. It may not be the full story. There may be other sources of information. The value of having multiple people looking over, updating, correcting, adding to information is substantial.

Was Statisa was also a site for idiots ?

Basta. Bye Moxjo.

I'd rather something presented under the threat of perjury. Even then it can still be wrong as a lot was simply interpretation of documents.

Europe is right on the edge again. Peoples take on the history of war there is simply "Hitler" and that they think the entire population of Germany went mad. I wonder what propaganda they will use this time if the war kicks off. A bit of history without the gloss isn't a bad thing.

The Germany-French war, WW1, Spanish war Italy and what was going on, not to mention Russia was all connected. We get this segmented view where each event is separated. But the true picture is only seen when these things are linked together.

Then you have the "Holocaust" simply shut down debate. Not only that, but there's this fear in talking about it. Exactly what is happening here. I don't want to risk talking about it either.
Yet the atrocities in Russia and even the massacre of millions of German civilians is largely ignored.

Well, now the younger generation all now get their one sided information off social media. There's a lot of bad takes. There's also Candace Owens going full pelt denialist along with the groupers. The whole thing appears to be gaining traction. The Israel/Palestine conflict is just fuelling it. So it just cycles back to the start again.

But you're right bas "Basta". I'm not pushing that barrow as it only pi55es everyone off.

 

[wayneL]

Yet another conspiracy theory bites the dust.

 

[moXJO]

The shift against Biden is noticeable.

How about this for a conspiracy theory:
Biden gets assassinated by a loony maga as revenge.
Gets Biden out and installs dems for a few more terms.

 

[basilio]

These former conspiracy theory believers were deep down the rabbit hole. Here's what pulled them out​

ABC RN
/
By Anna Kelsey-Sugg for All in the Mind
Posted 8h ago8 hours ago

Joel Hill believed in big pharma conspiracies and that the government was deliberately contaminating tap water.(ABC RN: Nick Baker)

Link copied


When Joel Hill's friend and sister were both seriously ill, and needed medical intervention to stay alive, it threw his world of conspiracy theory beliefs into chaos.

Joel, who lives in Sydney, was born into conspiracy theories, in a family where alternative beliefs were shared. He grew up being congratulated by adults around him for his knowledge about conspiracies.

They included theories like the government is "trying to dumb us down with fluoride in the water … to make sure that you don't revolt and overthrow the government, because they're inherently evil" — and that modern medicine is "the enemy"
.
He believed vaccines were poison designed to make people more sick so they had to buy more medicine.

These conspiracy believers thought vaccines were used to control us before something changed their minds

Four former conspiracy theorists held beliefs that governed almost every aspect of their lives. Then, for each of them, a powerful trigger made them change their minds. Their stories offer insight into life inside the rabbit hole — and hope for escaping it.

www.abc.net.au

 

[sptrawler]

Asbestos Cover-Up | Corporations Hid the Dangers of Asbestos

Johns Manville, Raybestos-Manhattan, Bendix and others orchestrated a massive asbestos cover-up to hide the dangers of asbestos exposure from workers.

www.asbestos.com

 

[moXJO]

These former conspiracy theory believers were deep down the rabbit hole. Here's what pulled them out​

ABC RN
/
By Anna Kelsey-Sugg for All in the Mind
Posted 8h ago8 hours ago
View attachment 180694
Joel Hill believed in big pharma conspiracies and that the government was deliberately contaminating tap water.(ABC RN: Nick Baker)

Link copied


When Joel Hill's friend and sister were both seriously ill, and needed medical intervention to stay alive, it threw his world of conspiracy theory beliefs into chaos.

Joel, who lives in Sydney, was born into conspiracy theories, in a family where alternative beliefs were shared. He grew up being congratulated by adults around him for his knowledge about conspiracies.

They included theories like the government is "trying to dumb us down with fluoride in the water … to make sure that you don't revolt and overthrow the government, because they're inherently evil" — and that modern medicine is "the enemy"
.
He believed vaccines were poison designed to make people more sick so they had to buy more medicine.

These conspiracy believers thought vaccines were used to control us before something changed their minds

Four former conspiracy theorists held beliefs that governed almost every aspect of their lives. Then, for each of them, a powerful trigger made them change their minds. Their stories offer insight into life inside the rabbit hole — and hope for escaping it.

www.abc.net.au

Glad you got over your TDS bas.

 

[sptrawler]

Top Ten Conspiracy Theories

From a faked moon landing to wild ideas about JFK's assassination, conspiracy theories and believers abound.

www.livescience.com

 

[moXJO]

Top Ten Conspiracy Theories

From a faked moon landing to wild ideas about JFK's assassination, conspiracy theories and believers abound.

www.livescience.com

The "fake moon landing" has been doing the rounds again. I wonder what the explanation for how those reflectors (used for measuring the distance between moon and earth) got there?

 

[sptrawler]

The "fake moon landing" has been doing the rounds again. I wonder what the explanation for how those reflectors (used for measuring the distance between moon and earth) got there?

Yes I've always wondered, how come if they could get there within 8 years using slide rules and 1960's technology, they can't get back there now with all the improvement that have been made.

 

[sptrawler]

Wild conspiracies crop up accusing Trump of faking shooting

Trump used a theatrical gel pack to fake being shot. No, the Secret Service colluded with Trump to get a great photo. These are just some of the “BlueAnon” theories.

www.theage.com.au

 

[wayneL]

Wild conspiracies crop up accusing Trump of faking shooting

Trump used a theatrical gel pack to fake being shot. No, the Secret Service colluded with Trump to get a great photo. These are just some of the “BlueAnon” theories.

www.theage.com.au

This is profoundly ridiculous. Something absolutely stinks about this whole thing, but it was not faked. A bystander got a bullet in the head FFS.

 

[Dona Ferentes]

turn off Twitter for 24 hours.

 

[sptrawler]

This is profoundly ridiculous. Something absolutely stinks about this whole thing, but it was not faked. A bystander got a bullet in the head FFS.

Like we keep saying, loonies are loonies, the only thing that differentiates them, is which political leaning the loony chooses.

 

[sptrawler]

NRA Condemns Trump Rooftop Shooting, Calls for Immediate Ban on Rooftops​

View attachment 180771


America’s peak gun lobby says this weekend’s shooting, which saw a man fire at Donald Trump with an AR-15 from a nearby rooftop, is further evidence of the need for an urgent nation-wide ban on building coverings.

In a press conference following the incident, NRA CEO Wayne LaPierre said the time for complacency was over. “America has more rooftops than any other nation in the developed world. We have an obsession with rooftops and without them, today’s events would never have happened,” he said.

He called on the Government to immediately ban all rooftops, with a grace period for rooftop owners to hand in their rooftops without penalty.

“I want my children to grow up in an America that’s free of roof coverings. Sure, it’d be harder to keep the house dry in winter. But that’s a small price to pay for safety,’ he said.

Not all Republicans agree with the NRA’s plan for an outright ban however, with some calling for a different approach. “I actually think we need more rooftops,” one Republican voter said. “If every member of the crowd at the Trump rally had their own rooftop, we could have avoided this. Because let’s be clear – the only thing stopping a bad rooftop is a good rooftop”.

NRA Condemns Trump Rooftop Shooting, Calls for Immediate Ban on Rooftops — The Shovel

“I want my children to grow up in an America that’s free of roof coverings"

theshovel.com.au

My case rests, your honour.

 

[Smurf1976]

Yet another conspiracy theory bites the dust.

I'd have thought everyone was aware of the basic concept.

Cloud seeding for example has been quite extensively tested and applied in Australia at various times with separate programs run the CSIRO, Hydro Tasmania and Snowy Hydro. They've used different methods and for different underlying reasons but all had the common objective of increasing precipitation (rain / snow).

Hadn't occurred to me anyone thought it was a conspiracy.