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Sentencing in Australia is a disgrace

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Happy said:
I’ll digress a little; we do not have enough money to provide free travel for children to attend school.
We do not have enough money to eliminate hospital elective surgery waiting lists, nor make dental care more affordable, nor have enough police to PREVENT CRIME, nor enough money to provide higher education at better prices that it is now, and the list if almost endless, obesity, diabetics, drugs dependence not to mention that some parents are not fit to raise children (this is where most bad seeds are sprouting)

We do cull problematic animals.

And we worry so much and build more and more >rehabilitation centres< as numbers just keep growing
(We even import more and more problems from overseas – just yesterday in Adelaide, Sudanese underage refugees had a knives out day)

I read article that one day there will be not enough carers for those who need care and hard decisions will have to be made,

Until then lets pretend that nothing can be made about everything that is wrong and let the avalanche just roll into too difficult basket.
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Have just been reading over the early posts in this thread.

Having had many years professionally trying to come to terms with sentencing I believe that what Happy posted here back in 08 is spot on.

This generation, forget it and punitive measures have been proved to not work, full stop.

We will only solve any of the problems by first concentrating on family's, to support parents and ensure the offspring are controlled properly from birth; and

properly educated with the state funding fully the education to at least 3rd year uni with several social science subjects as compulsory; and

no dole for those that can stand up, they must work at something for the state to recieve anything at all even if that is standing on a corner to make sure people are given directions; and

police focus on community involvement programs that encourage youth first, second, the community to work together on making a safer environment; and

where a person is sentenced that no release takes place till that person is educated to a dregree that ensures he/she not only not offends again but contributes constructively to the community wellbeing.

Hanging does not work, it just makes those left so bitter that the problem mutiplies times over.
 
Happy said:
http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/7941065/swearing-at-police-okay-queensland-magistrate



Not sure if it fits well here, but with attitude like that, we can see why sentences often do not fit some expectations.
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If someone does wrong and its against the law and the police have the powers then they can do something about it.

If the person has done nothing wrong at law and the police assert themsleves then perhaps they will be told in terms they may not like but are in fact terms that have become the normal community standard then that is stiff.

There was a case back in the late 60's exactly like this where they told the police where to go with the magic word and the Magistrate made the same finding.

Interesting.
 
explod said:
Have just been reading over the early posts in this thread.

Having had many years professionally trying to come to terms with sentencing I believe that what Happy posted here back in 08 is spot on.

This generation, forget it and punitive measures have been proved to not work, full stop.
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Good that you're at least attempting to put up some potential solutions, explod.

We will only solve any of the problems by first concentrating on family's, to support parents and ensure the offspring are controlled properly from birth;
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This sounds so sensible, and it is, except that the intensive social support systems required to do this would be impossibly expensive. There are simply some people who should never have children and who do nothing more than add to the problem of multi generational welfare dependence.

properly educated with the state funding fully the education to at least 3rd year uni with several social science subjects as compulsory;
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Just not practical in all instances. Some kids can't study and sending them to university would be a total waste of taxpayer funds. Instead, we should be funding more apprenticeships and education in basic social skills.


no dole for those that can stand up, they must work at something for the state to recieve anything at all even if that is standing on a corner to make sure people are given directions;
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Agree absolutely. And such a measure is not just to make the taxpayer feel better about paying the dole. The recipients' own welfare will be enhanced by productive activity, a sense of participation in the community. Sitting at home on the dole is utterly counter-productive.

police focus on community involvement programs that encourage youth first, second, the community to work together on making a safer environment;
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Yep, it's easy to sit back and be critical. If more community members were to become involved, especially in mixing the generations, the results would probably be worthwhile.

where a person is sentenced that no release takes place till that person is educated to a dregree that ensures he/she not only not offends again but contributes constructively to the community wellbeing.
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You're assuming all such people are capable of being so educated and/or rehabilitated. It's simply not always so. Also, to carry this out, you'd have to build a lot more jails and totally reconstruct the attitude of the judiciary.
 
Julia said:
Good that you're at least attempting to put up some potential solutions, explod.

Always put up solutions Julia its just that my side of things counter yours via our political eyes/view most often.

This sounds so sensible, and it is, except that the intensive social support systems required to do this would be impossibly expensive. There are simply some people who should never have children and who do nothing more than add to the problem of multi generational welfare dependence.
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Its always money, which is the real problem and is why a complete and honest socialist sytem like Sweeden is needed.

Just not practical in all instances. Some kids can't study and sending them to university would be a total waste of taxpayer funds. Instead, we should be funding more apprenticeships and education in basic social skills.
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My idea here is general, of course some are not up to it but a great deal of that comes from attitude too. Some of the more valuable contributers within academia admit themselve thier IQ is not that high (I am an example). Again it will get back to what we do with our people from the cradle. Real change will cost and require huge commitment by everyone, we know its probably a pipe dream but all the other stuff popped out by the major parties is just a stamping over and will never get to where we should be trying to go.

I think Gillard is a big one for the technical trades so that is a plus.

Agree absolutely. And such a measure is not just to make the taxpayer feel better about paying the dole. The recipients' own welfare will be enhanced by productive activity, a sense of participation in the community. Sitting at home on the dole is utterly counter-productive.
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And this would go someway towards moving the community towards the ideas of the previous para above

You're assuming all such people are capable of being so educated and/or rehabilitated. It's simply not always so. Also, to carry this out, you'd have to build a lot more jails and totally reconstruct the attitude of the judiciary
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Then they may have to stay in the can till they do pass at least several units of 3rd year level social science subjects and master a useful trade in which on release they would have to go into and hold down a civil job for a number of years as parole.

I cannot stop conceptualising as I worked for many years in a Research and Development think tank. No one will change the world on thier own but if we just sit on the fence and criticise we do no more than turn would be contributors off. You are not one of these Julia but just giving the drift.

cheers on a saturdy explod
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explod said:
...
I cannot stop conceptualising as I worked for many years in a Research and Development think tank.
...
explod
Click to expand...


Impossible to implement, but concept of getting rid of all undesirable individuals is doable, especially that even Dick Smith thinks of need for population control.

We have plenty of spares (just by looking at unemployment data)

Jails could be converted to aged care facilities (no my idea, mentioned on TV already)

Of course, hard decisions would have to be made, as it is now only criminals have right to execute at their will and our precious snowflake approach cannot stop that - almost funny!
 
Yes, unbelievable Mr Burns, that this guy only got 12 years for murder the last time - then out to do it all again.
 
Well they said he had no remorse, why would they sign him out.

I feel sorry for the families.
 
MrBurns said:
The system is horribly flawed, can you imagine how much dangerous scum is out there ?
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... and it would be so easy to fix.
Take a leaf out of the old "eye for an eye": make it "one testicle for a rape". Hardly anyone would get to three...
Maybe borrow - selectively! - from Sharia: One lash for a brawl; 100 lashes for the first manslaughter.
I'm sure they also have provisions for home invaders and common robbers...

For some scum, Jailing doesn't work, regardless for how long. A bullet is much more cost-effective.
 
pixel said:
... and it would be so easy to fix.
Take a leaf out of the old "eye for an eye": make it "one testicle for a rape". Hardly anyone would get to three...
Maybe borrow - selectively! - from Sharia: One lash for a brawl; 100 lashes for the first manslaughter.
I'm sure they also have provisions for home invaders and common robbers...

For some scum, Jailing doesn't work, regardless for how long. A bullet is much more cost-effective.
Click to expand...

I agree, at very least they should not let them out again, keep them off the streets and we'd all be a lot safer.
What makes them think that someone capable of murder , child molestation or rape will be miraculaouly cured by time in jail ?

Time to bring back the star chamber -

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0086356/
 
Now-quadriplegic stab victim sees attacker jailed

A man who stabbed another in the neck six times, causing him to become a quadriplegic, has been jailed for at least five years over the vicious attack.

Ken Weger, 70, was attacked in the backyard of his Adelaide home in February last year by Daniel Charles Hughes.

Hughes was arrested when police traced a television he stole from Mr Weger's Marion home.

The South Australian Supreme Court heard Hughes, 25, was drunk, on drugs and had not slept for days when he visited Mr Weger to ask to stay with him.
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5 years what a joke..........

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-12-11/stabber-jailed-over-attack-which-left-man-quadriplegic/4420780
 

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