- Joined
- 30 June 2008
- Posts
- 15,586
- Reactions
- 7,466
In your zeal to regurgitate the mantra (again), you have totally missed my point.
Tell ya what, share a cab with Horace when I pull out those hard science *peer reviewed* equine papers.
You can cast an unbiased eye over them and we can all fall about, laughing our a55es off.
I don't expect you will connect the dots, but at least it will be a fun evening.
I can readily see how your "peer reviewed" equine papers could be suspect. No problems at all.
I don't think that CC science is in the ballpark.
I made two basic statements
One. Temperatures are rising at an historically very rapid rate.
Two. The overwhelming majority of climate scientists believe that CO2 and other GG are the main driver of this temperature increase. The reason they think is is because they have analysed the wide range of other climate change drivers and on all the evidence to date GG are the current principal driver.
This doesn't have to complicated. Find evidence to disprove theses statements. (And that doesn't mean saying all the meteorological societies around the world are in a global conspiracy to create a One World Government.
I can readily see how your "peer reviewed" equine papers could be suspect. No problems at all.
I don't think that CC science is in the ballpark.
I made two basic statements
One. Temperatures are rising at an historically very rapid rate.
Two. The overwhelming majority of climate scientists believe that CO2 and other GG are the main driver of this temperature increase. The reason they think is is because they have analysed the wide range of other climate change drivers and on all the evidence to date GG are the current principal driver.
This doesn't have to complicated. Find evidence to disprove theses statements. (And that doesn't mean saying all the meteorological societies around the world are in a global conspiracy to create a One World Government.
Bas, we have heard it all before....Why do you keep repeating yourself?
But Bas, I keep telling you, it was warmer in Greenland and the Arctic 1000 years ago than it is today
Don't you believe me?
Who can, your reference would not come up properly and your explanation was cloudy to say the least.
Give some anthropological and physical evidence and we can have a proper look at it.
I think I have posted the info 3 times already...How many more times do you want it?
In your zeal to regurgitate the mantra (again), you have totally missed my point.
Tell ya what, share a cab with Horace when I pull out those hard science *peer reviewed* equine papers.
You can cast an unbiased eye over them and we can all fall about, laughing our a55es off.
I don't expect you will connect the dots, but at least it will be a fun evening.
Yes, but not convincing. Sure there were parts then that were green for a few hundred years which allowed settlement.
However it had no effect on the three kilometer thick 400,000 year old ice sheet. It remained intact till recent times. The perma frost under it is breaking up and it is melting.
Noco, some of this icemelt has been intact for 800,000 years. Did not think I would need to bother with stuff that even school children are aware of.
Things are happening this time before our eyes which show, we have a problem
No it doesn't have to be complicated at all.
There are things that are known to be true.
There are things that are known to be untrue.
There are also things that are unknown and/or uncertain.
There are things that are believed or opined to be either, true, untrue unknown and/or uncertain.
There is a difference between reality and opinion of reality.
To assert that something claimed to be true by a select few, must be considered true unless detractors can prove otherwise, is simply deflecting the burden of proof away from where it truly belongs.
The dots have already been joined by the professional bodies wayne, who say that CC is unequivocal. I couldn't be bothered going back to find the statement that I posted by the American Meteorological Society to that effect , but I'm sure you can find it in this thread if you cared to look.
Roger A. Pielke Sr.’s Perspective On The Role Of Humans In Climate Change
There continues to be misunderstandings on my viewpoint on the role of humans within the climate system. This weblog is written to make sure it is clear, and can be used whenever someone asks the question as to where does Pielke Sr. stand on this issue.
As I have written in the Main Conclusions of Climate Science
“Humans are significantly altering the global climate, but in a variety of diverse ways beyond the radiative effect of carbon dioxide. The IPCC assessments have been too conservative in recognizing the importance of these human climate forcings as they alter regional and global climate.”
and that
“Attempts to significantly influence regional and local-scale climate based on controlling CO2 emissions alone is an inadequate policy for this purpose.”
These conclusions are different from those who claim that the global average radiative effect of carbon dioxide is by far the major human climate forcing, as well as from those who conclude that natural climate variations dominate climate change and that the human climate forcings are inconsequential.
My viewpoint is also well articulated in
National Research Council, 2005: Radiative forcing of climate change: Expanding the concept and addressing uncertainties. Committee on Radiative Forcing Effects on Climate Change, Climate Research Committee, Board on Atmospheric Sciences and Climate, Division on Earth and Life Studies, The National Academies Press, Washington, D.C., 208 pp
and you are encouraged to read the Executive Summary of that report [a report which whas been ignored by the media despite its broad base of authorship and its extensive review before it was published].
The reason that those who focus on the global average radiative forcing of carbon dioxide are missing the bulk of human climate forcings include the following:
1. Atmosphere and ocean circulations respond to regional forcings not a global average (e.g., see and see)
2. The other human climate forcings include
the diverse influence of human-caused aerosols on regional (and global) radiative heating (e.g., see).
the effect of aerosols on cloud and precipitation processes (e.g., see)
the influence of aerosol deposition on climate (e.g., see and see)
the effect of land cover/land use on climate (e.g., see and see)
the biogeochemical effect of added atmosopheric CO2 has a greater effect on the climate system than the radiative effect of added CO2 (e.g. see).
Natural climate variations and change, have also been underestimated (and are only poorly understood) based on examination of the historical and paleo-climate record (e.g., see and see).
Human climate forcings have a more significant role in altering the weather than does a global average increase in the radiative effect of an increase in the atmospheric concentration of CO2. This does not mean that we should not work to limit the increase of this gas in the atmosphere, but it is not the dominant climate forcing that affects society and the environment.
Policies that focus on CO2 by itself are ignoring definitive research results (such as reported in the 2005 National Research Council report) that humans have a much broader influence on the climate system than was communicated in the 2007 IPCC report. To neglect these other climate forcings represents a failure by policymakers (and the media) to utilize this scientifically robust information.
The neglect of including the diversity of human climate forcings indicates that the real objective of those promoting the radiative effect of the addition of atmospheric CO2 as the dominant human climate forcing is to promote energy and lifestyle changes. Their actual goal is not to develop effective climate policies.
Comiso’s new study presents some striking trends. When compared to longer- term, ground-based surface temperature data, the rate of warming in the Arctic from 1981 to 2001 is eight times larger than the rate of Arctic warming over the last 100 years. There have also been some remarkable seasonal changes. Arctic spring, summer, and autumn have each warmed, lengthening the seasons when sea ice melts by 10 to 17 days per decade. Temperatures increased on average by almost one and a quarter (1.22) degrees Celsius (C) per decade over sea ice in the Arctic summer. Conversely, Arctic winters cooled from the 1980s to the 1990s. The study finds that winters were almost 1 (0.89) degree C cooler per decade.
NASA article. Not sure if NASA have reason to fake data, but I found this interesting:
Evidence of Arctic Warming
There's even a colour chart for Noco to admonish and play Perry Mason with
http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/Features/ArcticIce/arctic_ice3.php
100years Phsst!!!!!!
Go back 1000 years it was a lot warmer then than it is today.
.
I must admit I'm having trouble understanding that statement. It could well qualify why Europeans decided to go crackers with war games, including 1066, but from what I've read we are in new territory since man invented fire.
Ah yes.....1066 ...William Cromwell.....I remembered that one from British history at school.....Just can't remember his significance.....Guess I will have to google it.
Orange
As far as the meteorological and other science bodies go, their statements do not reflect the spectrum of views of their membership and are more or less politically imperative in order to gaurantee funding.
If professional bodies make official policy statements I think we have to assume that it represents the majority of their members.
.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?