Military strike on Iran

[Superfly]

and speaking of Abu Ghraib (gee - anyone else have words they keep forgetting how to spell ? )

Have you ever heard Peter Cosgrove on the subject?
Mind you he was quick to move onto the next topic , but (interviewed last Anzac Day) he made it crystal clear that "the Yanks aren't playing by the rules" etc.


so superfly
did you contribute to the thread on Burma that I started ? (I forget - maybe you did - in which case you've forgotten that I also post on matters other than USA)

Burma thread no... but would have if seen it...esp coz been there and I spend most of my time in that part of the world.

People are in uproar about Guantanamo Bay, but do not blink an eye lid at China hosting the Olympics...

Because of Guantanamo no longer can the Muslims laugh in our guys faces saying "see you in New York with my lawyer"...

 

[Stan 101]

Why is Iran not giving access to all sites ?? what does Iran have to hide ...

Officer Stan 101 here. I have reason to believe that you, Superfly have been implicated in some nefarious activity by the local town drunk. He has a track record of not being all that accurate and will say just about anything to further his agenda (get more booze) but I'd still like to enter your house on short notice on a regular basis and sift through your undies drawer amongst other places..

How do you feel about that?



cheers,

 

[2020hindsight]

Because of Guantanamo no longer can the Muslims laugh in our guys faces saying "see you in New York with my lawyer"...

question is will they blow themselves up in our faces as well

violence begets violence
stupidity begets stupidity
torture begets torture
beheadings beget beheadings
etc

the PNG natives call it "payback"
then again they are a lot more inteligent than Abu Ghraib ever was.

GWB might brag "He who lives by the sword, dies by the smartbomb"

trouble is
how will "he who presses the trigger of the smartbomb" die?

 

[2020hindsight]

speaking of WWIII
Einstein I think it was

"I'm not sure exactly how WWIII will be fought,
but I can tell you that WWIV will be fought with sticks and stones"

 

[KIWIKARLOS]

I don't believe that the world can avoid a large scale war or a large number of regional wars.

Why
1. There are 6 billion people on the planet and by 2020 that could be 10 billion the earth can not support that many people so either naturally or un naturally the balance will be restored.
2. Energy, food and water will become more and more scarse and expensive
3. There is no global body that has effective means of settling disputes or solving any world problems such as hunger or aids. The UN is a farce and no individual country is going to sacrifice its prosperity to help others without every one else doing the same.
4. Religeon is still very closly and if not increasingly tied to the state. When you mix religeon and politics you loose the ability to make the right decisions. Policy based on religeons thousands of years old will push our progress backwards.

There is always a balance and IMO that balance is screwed across the globe in trade, environment and politics. These imbalances tend to adjust very quickly.

 

[YOUNG_TRADER]

Because of Guantanamo no longer can the Muslims laugh in our guys faces saying "see you in New York with my lawyer"...

Thats a pretty big generalisation, see I know I haven't taken this thread seriously but then when you make generalisations like that well its hard to,

Perhaps you should replace the word Muslim with terrorist?

Also who is "our guys faces"?

And do you really know what goes on at Guantanamo?

What about the stories coming out of Iraq, ie military crimes etc etc?

There is 2 sides to a coin

 

[metric]

it would be hard to argue that any invaded country in history didnt have some type of suicide action or other. the french did in ww11. if oz was invaded and whole families were murdered, friends and family murdered, suburbs blown up, infrastructure devestated, peoples future ruined, you were starving, no sanitation, oppression, etc, etc, im pretty sure there would be aussies that wold take the same action the "terrorist" iraqis do.

 

[KIWIKARLOS]

thats right mate, people do start commiting SUICIDE (bombings)
when they get to a point of desperation. You don't see israelies launching suicide attacks in Gaza.

People say but they have tanks and guns why shouldn't they use them....
They are using tanks and helicopters against a general population not an army or significantly armed force.

Katusha rockets are a joke compared to any of the arsenal Israel has.

And YT i totally agree with the lack and distorting of the news reported by our mainstream media. There is a tonne of documentary evidence showing exactly what is going on in the middle east at the moment.

That said i think that the innocet people are caught in a power struggle bewtwen the US / Allies and the emerging powers and russian comback.

I don't think the chinese are having to much concern about killing civilians in Tibet any more than the US does in Iraq

 

[disarray]

That said i think that the innocet people are caught in a power struggle bewtwen the US / Allies and the emerging powers and russian comback.

i disagree. most innocent people are caught in a power struggle between old, established factions and the US / russia / china are taking advantage of this to pursue their own goals in their own power struggles.

look at the palestinians breaking up into hamas and fatah, or tribal genocides in africa - these places have been fought over since they were settled by man, the civilised and stable parts of the world are just profiting from the conflict. this also is nothing new, ther persians profited from a divided greece, rome profited from a divided gaul, england profited from a divided india, pick an empire, any empire.

 

[juw177]

And YT i totally agree with the lack and distorting of the news reported by our mainstream media. There is a tonne of documentary evidence showing exactly what is going on in the middle east at the moment.

I don't think the chinese are having to much concern about killing civilians in Tibet any more than the US does in Iraq

ahem.. (on China) and I thought you knew a thing or two about news distortion. There is also a tonne of documentary evidence showing exactly how CIA is manipulating Tibetan people and western public opinion for their causes.

disarray you have the right idea about the powerful dividing other countries.... why would you view Tibet and China any different?

 

[doctorj]

:topic

There are plenty of other threads discussing China/Tibet - could we please try to keep the discussion of that issue there and keep this one as on-topic as possible.

Cheers!

 

[Superfly]

Thats a pretty big generalisation, see I know I haven't taken this thread seriously but then when you make generalisations like that well its hard to,

Perhaps you should replace the word Muslim with terrorist?

Also who is "our guys faces"?

And do you really know what goes on at Guantanamo?

What about the stories coming out of Iraq, ie military crimes etc etc?

There is 2 sides to a coin

Would be nice to not take this subject seriously, but with Iran now enriching and refusing to stop enriching ever again, there are real storm clouds on the horizon...

Yes ok, will replace that with Islamic terrorist with muslim sympathizers... and because of Guantanamo these dangerous inmates can not get a lawyer and start using the law to evade being held (out of circualtion) where they can do no harm to ordinary people or until they have given up the infomation that they may hold.
Why don't you start looking at the reasons why those people are being held in the first place, not the current position they are in, D Hicks is a prime example.

The 9/11 hijackers broke no laws did nothing wrong until 9/11... !

Considering how many troops are in Iraq and the vicious cowardly attacks that these troops face day in day out in some areas of that country, the amount of crimes coming out is minor..

 

[mayk]

Considering how many troops are in Iraq and the vicious cowardly attacks that these troops face day in day out in some areas of that country, the amount of crimes coming out is minor..

can't argue with a person who is lacking the skills of perception, and knowing the feeling of putting oneself in another person shoes.


Were Nazis not the victims of cowardly acts by french freedom fighters? Did they not think the same about jews, crimes commited are just minors...

Even the presedential candidates of USA acknowledge that the Iraq war was unjust , unfair and want to withdraw troops. Your prime minister is withdrawing troops, Uk is withdrawing troops, and you still believe that Iraq war is a right cause?

Which reality are you living in mate, what happened to Justice and innocent until proven guilty doctorine? Are the great principles of west crumbling under terrorist threat? Then I concur that Terrorist have already won...

 

[Santob]

Considering how many troops are in Iraq and the vicious cowardly attacks that these troops face day in day out in some areas of that country, the amount of crimes coming out is minor..

Who asked them to be there in the first place?

 

[robert toms]

I thought that the vicious cowards were the coalition of the willing...After they killed at least ten thousand in a cowardly indiscriminate bombing attack on Baghdad,Bush starting bragging about the victory.
The old make sure that your opponent is defenceless then attack them.
In Vietnam the Americans published their kill rates...In Iraq they either do not value human life,or the truth about their cowardice would not be good for propaganda.
Americans publish their death rate in Iraq....but are we meant to have sympathy for them?
Criminal invaders should not get sympathy,
I can empathise with the ordinary ideologically conditioned soldiers,but not with their masters in the White house and the Pentagon
I was ideologically conditioned once like Superfly,but I transcended myself..

 

[treefrog]

I don't believe that the world can avoid a large scale war or a large number of regional wars.

Why
1. There are 6 billion people on the planet and by 2020 that could be 10 billion the earth can not support that many people so either naturally or un naturally the balance will be restored.
2. Energy, food and water will become more and more scarse and expensive
3. There is no global body that has effective means of settling disputes or solving any world problems such as hunger or aids. The UN is a farce and no individual country is going to sacrifice its prosperity to help others without every one else doing the same.
4. Religeon is still very closly and if not increasingly tied to the state. When you mix religeon and politics you loose the ability to make the right decisions. Policy based on religeons thousands of years old will push our progress backwards.

There is always a balance and IMO that balance is screwed across the globe in trade, environment and politics. These imbalances tend to adjust very quickly.

great summary Karlos - only thing needed to add is that homo sapiens are by nature self serving and religious: sure there are many who don't like or accept this and appear to display more desirable altruistic tendencies, but when the chips are down its back to the fundamentals we were born with.
any equation(s) trying to solve world issues must factor this in or it simply will not solve the issue(s).

 

[KIWIKARLOS]

Terrorism is a war tactic not group of people.

By having a war on "terror" you essentially justify endless rolling wars against any advesary you label a terrorist.

who are we actually fighting against ?
Al quada ?
Iran ?
China?
russia?
are we fighting against freedom and self determination
or is it just national soveighty.

 

[derty]

Terrorism is a war tactic not group of people.

By having a war on "terror" you essentially justify endless rolling wars against any advesary you label a terrorist.

"Oceania is at war with Eastasia.
Oceania has always been at war with Eastasia.
Eurasia is our ally. Eurasia has always been our ally."

 

[metric]

al CIAda. its a lie. its a phanton organisation. the us invented an enemy.

 

[disarray]

well not exactly, but kinda.

The Power of Nightmares

Part 1 on Youtube