Is Global Warming becoming unstoppable?

[Knobby22]

Doesn't take much thinking to recognise how many critical elements of our society will breakdown in further temperature extremes. I believe our current first world environments are far more fragile than we would like to think. Smurfs observations about A/C, power generation, transport and the capacity of a multitude of devices to fail under extreme temperature loads need a very focused attention - before the heat wave.

It will be one of the necessary adaptions we need to make for the CC that is already certain to happen.

That's one reason I have a pool at my house.

 

[Smurf1976]

I believe our current first world environments are far more fragile than we would like to think

As a broad comment just contemplate what would have occurred if SA's big blackout had lasted longer than it did.

At first it's just a nuisance.

Then it's a bigger nuisance because you can't cook dinner or do the washing etc.

Then you've got issues with not being able to buy petrol and things like communications networks failing as their batteries run down.

Then you realise you also can't buy food and that everything you had in the fridge is now unsafe to eat.

Then the water supply stops working.

And all that would happen just due to a technical failure, no extreme weather required unless it happens to coincide.

We're all far more dependent on this stuff than most like to admit.

 

[sptrawler]

As a broad comment just contemplate what would have occurred if SA's big blackout had lasted longer than it did.

At first it's just a nuisance.

Then it's a bigger nuisance because you can't cook dinner or do the washing etc.

Then you've got issues with not being able to buy petrol and things like communications networks failing as their batteries run down.

Then you realise you also can't buy food and that everything you had in the fridge is now unsafe to eat.

Then the water supply stops working.

And all that would happen just due to a technical failure, no extreme weather required unless it happens to coincide.

We're all far more dependent on this stuff than most like to admit.

That's why everyone should have a water tank attached to the house, you never know when you will need a bucket of water to flush the toilet, it might sound funny but try turning off your water mid summer and see how you go.
Living on a rural block, without mains water, soon makes you realise the importance of electricity or gravity.

 

[basilio]

We have had this conversation about the impact of regular bouts of 50C temperatures and the effects on people, the infrastructure, the survival capacity of eco systems. There is an excellent article in The Guardian that explores these issues and points out where it is already happening and how close many other cities are to reaching these critical levels.

Sweltering cities
Halfway to boiling: the city at 50C
In a city at 50C, the only people in sight are those who do not have access to air conditioning. Illustration: Kevin Whipple
It is the temperature at which human cells start to cook, animals suffer and air conditioners overload power grids. Once an urban anomaly, 50C is fast becoming reality

by Jonathan Watts and Elle Hunt



Cities is supported by

About this content
Mon 13 Aug 2018 06.00 BST Last modified on Mon 13 Aug 2018 09.55 BST

Shares
1659

Imagine a city at 50C (122F). The pavements are empty, the parks quiet, entire neighbourhoods appear uninhabited. Nobody with a choice ventures outside during daylight hours. Only at night do the denizens emerge, HG Wells-style, into the streets – though, in temperatures that high, even darkness no longer provides relief. Uncooled air is treated like effluent: to be flushed as quickly as possible.

School playgrounds are silent as pupils shelter inside. In the hottest hours of the day, working outdoors is banned. The only people in sight are those who do not have access to air conditioning, who have no escape from the blanket of heat: the poor, the homeless, undocumented labourers. Society is divided into the cool haves and the hot have-nots.

Those without the option of sheltering indoors can rely only on shade, or perhaps a water-soaked sheet hung in front of a fan. Construction workers, motor-rickshaw drivers and street hawkers cover up head to toe to stay cool. The wealthy, meanwhile, go from one climate-conditioned environment to another: homes, cars, offices, gymnasiums, malls.

https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2018/aug/13/halfway-boiling-city-50c

 

[Tisme]

We have had this conversation about the impact of regular bouts of 50C temperatures and the effects on people, the infrastructure, the survival capacity of eco systems. There is an excellent article in The Guardian that explores these issues and points out where it is already happening and how close many other cities are to reaching these critical levels.

Sweltering cities
Halfway to boiling: the city at 50C
In a city at 50C, the only people in sight are those who do not have access to air conditioning. Illustration: Kevin Whipple
It is the temperature at which human cells start to cook, animals suffer and air conditioners overload power grids. Once an urban anomaly, 50C is fast becoming reality

by Jonathan Watts and Elle Hunt



Cities is supported by

About this content
Mon 13 Aug 2018 06.00 BST Last modified on Mon 13 Aug 2018 09.55 BST

Shares
1659

Imagine a city at 50C (122F). The pavements are empty, the parks quiet, entire neighbourhoods appear uninhabited. Nobody with a choice ventures outside during daylight hours. Only at night do the denizens emerge, HG Wells-style, into the streets – though, in temperatures that high, even darkness no longer provides relief. Uncooled air is treated like effluent: to be flushed as quickly as possible.

School playgrounds are silent as pupils shelter inside. In the hottest hours of the day, working outdoors is banned. The only people in sight are those who do not have access to air conditioning, who have no escape from the blanket of heat: the poor, the homeless, undocumented labourers. Society is divided into the cool haves and the hot have-nots.

Those without the option of sheltering indoors can rely only on shade, or perhaps a water-soaked sheet hung in front of a fan. Construction workers, motor-rickshaw drivers and street hawkers cover up head to toe to stay cool. The wealthy, meanwhile, go from one climate-conditioned environment to another: homes, cars, offices, gymnasiums, malls.

https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2018/aug/13/halfway-boiling-city-50c

How can the wealthy stay in a climate controlled environment? I thought this forum's experts had established AC would fail?

 

[Smurf1976]

We have had this conversation about the impact of regular bouts of 50C temperatures and the effects on people, the infrastructure, the survival capacity of eco systems.

I think the key point is that the problems start at temperatures not far above that which has already been experienced. So we don't need 10 or even 5 degrees more to start seeing the effects.

I recall the day Hobart set it's all time record of 41.8 and quite a few dramas resulted. In contrast I can recall previous summers where it hit 39.x with no real incident.

The record for Adelaide is about 47 and suffice to say I'm pretty sure there would be some issues at 50.

Same everywhere. Things are built to suit whatever is "normal" locally and it goes wrong beyond that point. So Hobart will in pratice have problems at a lower temperature than Adelaide would for that reason and same concept everywhere.

 

[SirRumpole]

Not a good look on the drought predictions for the next 4 years.

https://www.smh.com.au/environment/...h-points-to-warmer-years-20180814-p4zxgk.html

 

[Tisme]

The westerlies and low morning temps rising to mid 20degs came in smack on cue with the Ekka show. Howse that for climate anarchy?

 

[Smurf1976]

The westerlies and low morning temps rising to mid 20degs came in smack on cue with the Ekka show.

Any chance you could send some warmth down to Melbourne airport? The heating would seem to be not working and it’s rather chilly inside waiting to board a plane.

 

[Tisme]

Any chance you could send some warmth down to Melbourne airport? The heating would seem to be not working and it’s rather chilly inside waiting to board a plane.

You know fully well that Melbourne is exempt from any kind of predictable weather system. Joh is no longer with us, so the spare sunshine that used to shine out of his a4se is not resold anymore.

 

[explod]

ABC news just now,

USA, huge fires across one side of the country and extremely bad floods on the other.

Sydney, fires everywhere and it's winter.

 

[basilio]

Looking at efforts to adapt to a hotter climate - particularly with regard to creating wheat crops that will survive the heat.
Wheat in heat: the 'crazy idea' that could combat food insecurity
Food security

Durum wheat varieties can withstand 40C heat along the Senegal River basin, and could produce 600,000 tonnes of food

https://www.theguardian.com/global-...lerant-durum-wheat-crazy-idea-food-insecurity

Still thinking about the insurance bill on the fires and floods around the world.

 

[explod]

That's at 40c, what about at 50 and probably more soon.

 

[basilio]

That's at 40c, what about at 50 and probably more soon.

Yeah I know... Probably more relevant to whatever parts of the earth won't reach those extremes.

Just trying to find small glimmers.

 

[brty]

A bit over 20 years ago I drove a petrol/LPG truck from just outside of Adelaide to Southern Victoria in mid 40's heat, early January. I did the entire trip on LPG, even though the tank full should have run out early (I had the option to switch over to petrol when it ran out of gas).

I get to my local service station and go to fill the LPG tank, but the pump wouldn't work, would not put in any gas at all. I had to spray cold tap water on the tank for about 10 minutes for it to reduce the internal pressure of the tank, for it to accept the refill.

To me this has always been an indication of just how close to the wind we sail on many things unexpected. If those temperatures that day had been a few degrees warmer, LPG tanks everywhere would have been giving a lot more trouble.

 

[Tisme]

https://www.ipcc.ch/publications_and_data/ar4/wg1/en/spmsspm-projections-of.html

 

[Tisme]

Interesting truth from WA

"
The West Australian colony's earliest known meteorological analysis is The Climate of Western Australia 1876-1899 (PDF 25.4mb) compiled in 1901 by then Government Astronomer William Ernest Cooke. This document contains raw, unregulated data that is considered unreliable.

As the Government Astronomer explains in this historic document: "... it may be safely assumed that the results in this document give a close approximation to the truth; sufficiently so for all practical purposes, but scarcely to be considered quite accurate enough for the scientist."

 

[Smurf1976]

To me this has always been an indication of just how close to the wind we sail on many things unexpected. If those temperatures that day had been a few degrees warmer, LPG tanks everywhere would have been giving a lot more trouble.

There's an example I hadn't thought of.

That's the issue really. There are just so many things that are potentially affected. Everything from expansion joints on bridges through to lawnmowers were all designed to work in a particular temperature range that's fairly limited.

There's going to be 1000's of things like that.

 

[basilio]

A few days ago a scientific paper was released called The Hothouse earth. Basically indicated how a number of postive feedback mechanisms were threatening to move the earths climate to a far hotter space in a far shorter time than we had imagined. CC is happening Now not sometime in the future.

It seems that the paper has struck a nerve. Whether it is enough to create its own tipping point for widespread, immediate mobilisation to decarbonise our society
and drawdown atmospheric CO2 is the next question.

Because the ugly facts are that whatever pleasant future we want to believe is likely in the next 5-10-15 years ain't happening.

World is finally waking up to climate change, says 'hothouse Earth' author
Report predicting spiralling global temperatures has been downloaded 270,000 times in just a few days

Jonathan Watts

Fri 17 Aug 2018 20.29 AEST

Shares
25



Johan Rockstrom, director of Stockholm Resilience Centre. Photograph: Rex/Shutterstock
The scorching temperatures and forest fires of this summer’s heatwave have finally stirred the world to face the onrushing threat of global warming, claims the climate scientist behind the recent “hothouse Earth” report.

Following an unprecedented 270,000 downloads of his study, Johan Rockström, executive director of the Stockholm Resilience Centre, said he had not seen such a surge of interest since 2007, the year the Nobel prize was awarded to Al Gore and the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change.

“I think that in future people will look back on 2018 as the year when climate reality hit,” said the veteran scientist. “This is the moment when people start to realise that global warming is not a problem for future generations, but for us now.”

https://www.theguardian.com/environ...-reality-climate-change-hothouse-earth-author

 

[Smurf1976]

USA, huge fires across one side of the country and extremely bad floods on the other.

Sydney, fires everywhere and it's winter.

Meanwhile in Tasmania, which is not that far from the fires in NSW, flow rates in the River Derwent have peaked at over 30 million litres per minute.

In rough terms that's enough water coming down in one day to supply Sydney for a month. All going out to sea......

The Pieman, Mersey-Forth, Lake Margaret, Trevallyn and Derwent hydro catchments have all spilled water despite running the associated power stations flat out 24/7 and most of those are still spilling right now. There's a pretty high chance the King scheme will spill within the next few weeks also, the only ones that are sure not to spill being Lake Gordon, Great Lake / Arthurs Lakes and Lake Echo.

So a very uneven distribution of weather in Australia at the moment. I keep hearing about the "drought" but there's no sign of that in Tas at the moment indeed it's persistently wet (though not so much in Hobart itself).