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I dont understand a word you said after the word "The"
Gold Price - Where is it heading?
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I dont understand a word you said after the word "The"
Whiskers
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I'm inclined to think it may just take out a new high above 915 in the next couple of days while the US congress thrash out whatever they are thrashing out, but once the 'plan' is on the table and everyone knows what it is, I'd expect gold to correct back for a few days even below current levels, probably into the 800's again.
But I'm still looking for gold to go much higher in the medium to longer term.
wayneL
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On physical, the buy price and the sell price you get at the dealer is a few percent. http://www.perthmint.com.au/metalPrices.aspx
It will be a lot narrower if you're tipping 6 figures in, but still a couple of percent. That's expensive. Then you have to store it, insure it etc.
When you buy it, the Australian gu'mint will know all about it. So if they ever do confiscate gold, they'll be sure to knock on your door.
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Thanks, I think there's a very good chance the bail out optimism will very quickly fade, there's a lot of changes have to be made before it even gets through and when it does it may not work and once the bail out fails it's all over rover.
It's a gamble, I think I'll wait a little longer.
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Confiscate gold ? geez whats that !
wayneL
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It happened in the US the last time the markets blew up.
Research ==>> http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=gold+confiscation&btnG=Google+Search&meta=
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Ok thanks - Think I'll buy property instead but I need to wait for the property market to crash, will take up to 12 months if I can wait that long, don't want to wait too long and find the banks are restricting withdrawals if there's a run.
Come to think of it I think the financial crises will come a lot sooner than the expected property crash , it will be a fine balancing act.
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True, but that was in the 30s and only in the US. There's a lot of scare stories running round the internet now. It couldn't be done on a global level now.
If you buy, there's a couple of percent on spread, then depending on how its stored could be a percent or so in storage. Thats very small biccies for the insurance.
However, best bet is to hold it yourself, safety deposit box, or something. If you let someone else hold it, it must be an allocated account, (not a pool account where the institution keeps it all in one pool and works from it, as a few of those are going bust and holders will be left with nothing)
You also need a lawyer to read the custodial and golding terms to determine 100% that it is fenced off from the holding institition and that in the event of their collapse it cannot be touched by them or their creditors. If you cheap out, now you'll pay much more later.
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That's exactly why holding physical silver may be a better choice. They wouldn't confiscate silver because it is just not worth the effort. While they are bulky to "hide" for large amounts, it is a good practice to spread it out.
But then good luck trying to get physical silver now, especially in the 6 digits range..the spread is even bigger than gold.
But then good luck trying to get physical silver now, especially in the 6 digits range..the spread is even bigger than gold.
explod
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That is not correct, there have been a number of crashes since President Hoover outlawed gold in the US about 1925. And the price paid to people handing it in still made them a decent profit at the time.
I could not imagine the US doing it again, perhaps China because they hold US dollars, but the big players in the US who are behind the US Senate have been hoarding gold for some time whilst the sheeple play with the monopoly money.
I am sure Waynel that you would be more useful on some other thread.
And the problem of storing gold is a very small problem compared to the problems elsewhere.
Trembling Hand
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LOL. Should I leave as well boss?
wayneL
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errr... you might want to brush up on a few of your facts there explod. 1925??
Try 1933.I bet there were a few things you didn't imagine last month that happened this month, maybe not. But be careful of the cognitive bias of endowment effect; it's showing through your clothes mate.
MrBurns asked what he was missing. I let him know two factors. Isn't that helpful? Or would you prefer that all are treat like mushrooms?
Unbelievable.
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errr... you might want to brush up on a few of your facts there explod. 1925??
I bet there were a few things you didn't imagine last month that happened this month, maybe not. But be careful of the cognitive bias of endowment effect; it's showing through your clothes mate.
MrBurns asked what he was missing. I let him know two factors. Isn't that helpful? Or would you prefer that all are treat like mushrooms?
Unbelievable.
For the record I appreciate all help and I'm equally sure Wayne's contributions would be welcome in any thread.
Mr Burns there are many ways of buying gold bullion, going to the big guns are surely gonna attract larger spreads and with all this volatility they will probably stretch them even further.
My suggestion is if your serious then find some of the smaller bullion houses where the spread is minimal (as they buy 2ndhand jewellery, refine it then on sell the bullion) these guys have less overheads and can afford to sell at better prices. I know because im in the jewellery industry and thats where i buy it from if i need it.
As for storing well 10kg of pure gold is around $350,000 so a small strong safe tucked away somewhere would be fine and you can insure through various insurance companies (overall it would be less then to leave it at a bullion house for storage as they charge you for everything).
If you reall wanna save goto jewellers or pawnbrokers that have 24ct gold jewellery and buy it off them for well below the spot price, then all you need to do is melt it and store it.
There are always different paths to take, its choosing the right 1 for you that will make a difference.
Hope this helps
My suggestion is if your serious then find some of the smaller bullion houses where the spread is minimal (as they buy 2ndhand jewellery, refine it then on sell the bullion) these guys have less overheads and can afford to sell at better prices. I know because im in the jewellery industry and thats where i buy it from if i need it.
As for storing well 10kg of pure gold is around $350,000 so a small strong safe tucked away somewhere would be fine and you can insure through various insurance companies (overall it would be less then to leave it at a bullion house for storage as they charge you for everything).
If you reall wanna save goto jewellers or pawnbrokers that have 24ct gold jewellery and buy it off them for well below the spot price, then all you need to do is melt it and store it.
There are always different paths to take, its choosing the right 1 for you that will make a difference.
Hope this helps
wayneL
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Ageo,
Interesting point there.
1/ Is it possible for a private person to refine gold alloy to pure (or near pure)? If so what is the process?
2/ If not, is it worth buying second hand jewelery (9 & 18 ct) where the price is cheaper than the gold content? How does one realize the value of the gold. How does one determine the gold content of a block of melted down jewelery?
Whiskers
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Yeah, here too.
I just realised I had an old signet ring that my granny gave me in the 70's.
I stopped wearing it because it wore too thin and nearly broke. It looks like 9C stamped on it. Not sure of the weight, but must be at least 5 or 6 grams or 2 grams of gold in it worth 50 or $60 at todays values... 2 or 3 hundred in a year or two maybe.
...and hmm there's a red stone mounted in it... looks a lot like a ruby too... might be worth same again!
Gees I luv my late granny.
explod
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To store 30 kilogrammes in a secure bank vault costs about $250 per annum.
9 carat cannot be rescued by reprocessing. 18ct can. A small foundry in any of the inducstrial areas would assist in making your own gold coins blocks atc. I would and have contemplated doing it myself. If the price of bullion goes anywhere near some of the higher predictions it may be well worth it.,
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Whiskers said:
If this 6 figure sum consitutes 'all your eggs' then I'd question the wisdom of putting them all in one basket. Even if it isn't, there's a few good reasons to phase the entry. Firsly whiskers point above - in the short term the perception that the bailout has removed the risk could cause a short term pullback in the gold price. Overall though I think its highly inflationary for the US and will contribute to USD decline in the longer term.
In relation to the govt logging the purchase - if you buy over $10,000 worth then you have to fill out heavier paperwork issued by the federal government under the anti money laundering/anti terrorism legislation - so if you're paranoid its better to buy in under $10k lots. (you still have to fill out paper work - but it apparently stays at the dealer and not to the govt).
Ageo's idea's are interesting. Seems like there would be no reason someone couldn't refine their own gold.
quick web search - first hit gave me this: http://www.shorinternational.com/RefineStart.htm and this GoldRefiningForum.com
This is all sounding a bit paranoid now though ...
Ok 1st up
1/ yes it is possible but hardly worth the effort (hence i said buy 24ct which is already pure and it doesnt need refining just melting into a bar). The process is intense and the best method would be chemical reaction (yes i have refined and its the best method for small scale stuff) but as i said not worth it to a normal individual.
2/ it is much better to buy 2ndhand jewellery as it is then on sell it to a buyer. In my business what i do is buy all 2nd hand jewellery from private people, to business's etc... the pricing structure is quite simple but it vary's from people but i will give you an idea:
Say you have 100grms of 9ct gold well todays AU spot is 1056 per ounce so you need to divide that into grams (1056 / 31.1 which is the conversion), that will give you 33.96 so the 24ct fine gold price is $33.96 per gram. Now times 33.96 by 0.375 (37.5% purity for 9ct) and it will give you $12.73
Now $12.73 is the spot price for 9ct but no1 will give you that as their is a spread in their, plus refining fee's etc.. but today i paid someone for their 9ct @ $10.80 which is a very competitive price since bullion houses and places like cash converters are offering $5-$8 per gram on 9ct.
And to answer your question about testing the value of the gold content in a melted block, we use an XRF machine that mining site's use, it determines all the precious metals in % thats in your item (not cheap about $80,000 or so).
Thats incorrect 9ct can most definately be refined into pure gold. I have done it many times
As for the other suggested refining your own gold well the really only other option is to send it off to a refiner but then you will see what sharks they are (fee's, giving you less amount of gold etc...)
I have found if you have 2nd hand gold (or any gold for that matter) your better off selling it as it is. But remember shop around as the prices vary, all i was suggesting before was if you could get your hands on a few kilo's of 24ct gold jewellery then you could just simply melt it (with a oxy) and pour it off into a bar form, then store it. There is alot that can be done with gold and other precious metals (not just trading them on paper). Hope this helps
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