Electric cars?

[sptrawler]

Maybe they made good cars in the past but their quality control has since declined.

I wouldn't know, I traded the Grand Cherokee in on the Hyundai a couple of years ago, I tend to buy a car because it suits my selection criteria not because of the badge or folklore.
That's why I bought the Jeep 3.5T tow capacity and 350kg ball load and also a reasonable fuel economy when towing, a mate raved about his Prado, until he had to get rid of it because it wasn't able to tow his van legally, he now has a DMax.
Horses for courses.

 

[Value Collector]

Well, Morrison is gone and Albanese has been as civil as he can be, and yet China still keeps firing missiles over the Pacific ocean and engaging in provocative acts like attacking our aircraft in international airspace.

So maybe our attempts to defend ourselves better through AUKUS is provocative to the Chinese and we shouldn't be doing it?

Which Australian aircraft was attacked? (by the way I was talking about Morrisons accusations about covid that lead to the trade sanctions)

I think the USA is doing a lot more to provoke china than china is doing to provoke us, could you imagine how crazy the USA would get if china was constantly sending planes and ships to,

You only have to look at how crazy Australia got and the media hysteria was when china sent a single warship to near the coast of WA but still in international waters, yet we along with the USA do that routinely to them.

 

[SirRumpole]

Which Australian aircraft was attacked?

Video appears to show Chinese intercept of Australian aircraft

The incident in 2022 involved a People's Liberation Army aircraft and a RAAF plane.

www.smh.com.au

 

[mullokintyre]

Sigh, how quickly we diverge from the thread topic.
Mick

 

[SirRumpole]

Sigh, how quickly we diverge from the thread topic.
Mick

You're right, but it happens now and then and could be relevant to our trade with the world's largest EV maker.

 

[sptrawler]

Back on topic, BYD to put the blowtorch on the ute sector.

2024 BYD Shark 6 AWD review: International first drive

The BYD Shark 6 brings a petrol-electric drivetrain to the ute segment at a price that’ll turn heads.

www.drive.com.au

Propulsion comes courtesy of identical motors on each axle tuned to offer power and torque where needed most. With a 170kW/310Nm output on the front and 150kW/340Nm output on the rear, this provides more than enough torque and traction to handle steep inclines and rutted trails even on standard road tyres.
That drivetrain means the Shark 6 is a hefty chunk more powerful than a PHEV Ranger but offers less torque overall, with 650Nm to the Ranger's 690Nm. However, the benefits of the electric delivery become apparent in the ease with which the Shark 6 outpaces rivals from a standing start, hitting 100km in just 5.7 seconds courtesy of torque delivered in a typically linear fashion.

But if greater economy is the greater draw, 100km of EV-only capability (likely closer to 80km in real-world driving) and 2.0 litres per 100km of fuel useage in those first 80km might just be a clincher, alongside more than 800km of claimed range.

In the Premium edition we tested, a pair of electric motors drives all four wheels at anything below 70km/h, above which the 1.5-litre petrol joins in to directly drive the wheels. The rest of the time, the engine remains idle or whirrs away charging the 29.58kWh battery for full electric propulsion.

Official prices aren’t yet confirmed, but our sources suggest the flagship Shark 6 Premium model, which will be followed later by more affordable variants, will retail at around $60,000.

 

[Value Collector]

Video appears to show Chinese intercept of Australian aircraft

The incident in 2022 involved a People's Liberation Army aircraft and a RAAF plane.

www.smh.com.au

An interception is not an attack, and don’t you think us routinely sending ships and aircraft that close to China is an act of provocation from us?

How would Australia feel if China was doing the same thing to us, eg constantly sending ships and aircraft around Australia? I think if they did it to USA mainland or Hawaii they would be intercepted too.

 

[mullokintyre]

You're right, but it happens now and then and could be relevant to our trade with the world's largest EV maker.

Firstly, the problem is there is already 125 threads about China where such comments about about its beligernt behaviour would be more appropriate.
Secondly, it degenerated into a bunch of comments about who hates jeeps.
Mick

 

[SirRumpole]

An interception is not an attack, and don’t you think us routinely sending ships and aircraft that close to China is an act of provocation from us?

If it's international waters and part of our trade routes then it's our business if those routes are inhibited.

China has no trade routes in the Pacific/Indian oceans as far as I can tell, so sending warships here is just sabre rattling.

 

[Logique2]

Governments please mandate: a prominent label on them "EV-metropolitan only" .. where the charging stations are.

If seen in Goulburn, Bunbury, Benalla or Stanthorpe .. book them as a traffic hazard.

Metropolitan owners, if you must have these polluting indulgences, please don't clog our highways with them.

Polluting you say, what happens to the battery after 10 years?

 

[divs4ever]

Governments please mandate: a prominent label on them "EV-metropolitan only" .. where the charging stations are.

If seen in Goulburn, Bunbury, Benalla or Stanthorpe .. book them as a traffic hazard.

Metropolitan owners, if you must have these polluting indulgences, please don't clog our highways with them.

Polluting you say, what happens to the battery after 10 years?

some don't last 10 years , a BMW shut down half the motorway last week.
but you can bet insurance premiums will rise just to help inflation along

 

[Value Collector]

If it's international waters and part of our trade routes then it's our business if those routes are inhibited.

China has no trade routes in the Pacific/Indian oceans as far as I can tell, so sending warships here is just sabre rattling.

Hahahaha, our biggest trade routes are too China, and their trade routes are every where.

The international waters argument, is a bit like game you play as a kid to annoy your sibling, where you hold the tip of your finger an inch from their face and say “But, I am not touching you” eventually they will probably slap your hand away, and you can’t say you didn’t provoke it.

China intercepting our planes in what we claim is international airspace is just like the sibling rightfully slapping your hand away because you are being an annoying C#@T

 

[Value Collector]

Governments please mandate: a prominent label on them "EV-metropolitan only" .. where the charging stations are.

If seen in Goulburn, Bunbury, Benalla or Stanthorpe .. book them as a traffic hazard.

Metropolitan owners, if you must have these polluting indulgences, please don't clog our highways with them.

Polluting you say, what happens to the battery after 10 years?

After the batteries end of life they just recycle it and make a new battery.

Common mate, you recycle your bogus arguments so often you should understand recycling by now.

(I don't expect you will watch the video, you want to believe the batteries don't get recycled, so that is what you will believe)

 

[Value Collector]

Firstly, the problem is there is already 125 threads about China where such comments about about its beligernt behaviour would be more appropriate.
Secondly, it degenerated into a bunch of comments about who hates jeeps.
Mick

The subject of China is bound to come up in a lot of different ways, you can’t really expect us to move a conversation across multiple threads constantly every time a little side road in the conversation pops up.

 

[SirRumpole]

China intercepting our planes in what we claim is international airspace is just like the sibling rightfully slapping your hand away because you are being an annoying C#@T

So China owns the world and can do whatever it likes wherever it likes?

How ridiculous.

 

[JohnDe]

So China owns the world and can do whatever it likes wherever it likes?

How ridiculous.

There are people that believe themselves to be wise in all things worldly. And they may be, but most are also naive to the thinking of leaders of countries.

for me, the old saying "Power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely" still rings true.

China has been looked at by all the West as a country transitioning to a democratic capitalist system, starting from the late 1970's and early 1980's.

China and the West have benefited greatly from each other, but something changed in the last 15 or so years. China's political elite want to reclaim the past glories of the warrior dynasties of the past.

And like the past, some nations will accept a powerful nations ruling class and join in their common-wealth leadership, regardless of the loss of freedoms that brings. While other nations will stand firm and protect their citizens freedom at all costs.

In my 30 plus years of following world politics and the political class, I have come to the conclusion that most people on the extreme left believe in the Stalinist socialist beliefs and see things as "for the better good". They think that some disruption and upheaval is required to bring some sort of utopian system.

I believe that what we are currently seeing, with the increasing number of politicians and political parties like the Greens and Dan Andrews support of China and the support of organizations like Hamas and Hezbollah, is a fight for change to our system and way of life.

The 1930's all over again.

 

[SirRumpole]

In my 30 plus years of following world politics and the political class, I have come to the conclusion that most people on the extreme left believe in the Stalinist socialist beliefs and see things as "for the better good". They think that some disruption and upheaval is required to bring some sort of utopian system.

True but what I can't understand is some people support capitalism, but not democracy and think that might is right and those with most weapons should rule the world regardless of their politics.

eg Trump. He is supposed to be a fan boy of Putin and Xi because of the power they have, not for their principles. That's very dangerous I think.

(Sorry Mick, wandered off topic again. )

 

[Value Collector]

So China owns the world and can do whatever it likes wherever it likes?

How ridiculous.

No that’s the USA acting like that, with its daily flights along Chinas border and constant buzzing of its ships.

As I was explaining the person that slaps the others persons hand away and says “leave me alone” isn’t the problem.

If China was constantly flying around Hawaii or mainland land USA you can bet they would be intercepted.

 

[SirRumpole]

No that’s the USA acting like that, with its daily flights along Chinas border and constant buzzing of its ships.

As I was explaining the person that slaps the others persons hand away and says “leave me alone” isn’t the problem.

If China was constantly flying around Hawaii or mainland land USA you can bet they would be intercepted.

And if China left Taiwan and the Philippines alone and instead behaved like a civil country like you expect others to do, then there would be no need for the US in the South China Sea.

 

[rederob]

There are people that believe themselves to be wise in all things worldly. And they may be, but most are also naive to the thinking of leaders of countries.

for me, the old saying "Power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely" still rings true.

China has been looked at by all the West as a country transitioning to a democratic capitalist system, starting from the late 1970's and early 1980's.

China and the West have benefited greatly from each other, but something changed in the last 15 or so years. China's political elite want to reclaim the past glories of the warrior dynasties of the past.

And like the past, some nations will accept a powerful nations ruling class and join in their common-wealth leadership, regardless of the loss of freedoms that brings. While other nations will stand firm and protect their citizens freedom at all costs.

In my 30 plus years of following world politics and the political class, I have come to the conclusion that most people on the extreme left believe in the Stalinist socialist beliefs and see things as "for the better good". They think that some disruption and upheaval is required to bring some sort of utopian system.

I believe that what we are currently seeing, with the increasing number of politicians and political parties like the Greens and Dan Andrews support of China and the support of organizations like Hamas and Hezbollah, is a fight for change to our system and way of life.

The 1930's all over again.

The so called "absolute power" you mention has been wielded by America since WWII.
America has dominated all international forums, including the UN, and used "aid" as a means to curry favour with the developing world.
Additionally, America has not been a signatory to the most beneficial UN conventions, including UNCLOS, but has been instrumental in destabilising dozens of governments and actually overthrowing some. That's aside from the many conflicts it has instigated, with few ending well... Afghanistan being the latest. China's record is somewhat different.

Your idea that China was a "country transitioning to a democratic capitalist system" was never in play. It was just a hope predicated largely on its enrty to the WTO.

In my 50+years following world politics, China's post-Mao period has not only been exceptionally stable but has also transformed an incredibly poor nation into an industrial behemoth. From a solely political perspective, no nation has a higher regard for their leadership, so whatever freedoms people think are foregone in China, they are not reflected by its citizens.

On topic, China's transformation has been led by successive 5 year plans which typically propose roadmaps to be followed over the long term. America regularly claims these to be failures (eg https://www.uscc.gov/sites/default/files/Research/12th-FiveYearPlan_062811.pdf) but the writing on the wall suggests otherwise. The above link inlcudes the many areas of focus from 2011 and includes electric cars.


We now know that apart from being the largest global manufacturer, consumer, and exporter of vehicles, it leads in all areas of mobile electrification. On the electric car front, over 50% of its internal sales are new energy vehicles. That share will continue to increase as China is producing EVs cheaper than ICEvs.

The recent imposition of tariffs by America/Canada and the EU will harm both consumers and their vehicle industries. Consumers unable to afford BEVs will pay a lot more for inferior products that are also inefficient. Aside from Tesla, America's BEV industry is a long way behind South Korea's and China's.

An interesting questionmark is over the issue of whether or not North America and the EU will have amajor impact on China's NEV industry. We can immediately discount North America as China's EV's don't ship there. The EU would be a good market to grow in, but overall BEV numbers to date do not determine any Chinese manufacturer's future. On the other hand there is a rapidly growing SE Asian market being tapped, plus further potential for South America and, later, Africa.

Europe's tariffs are going to remain problematic. Most major European car manufacturers also produce some of their BEVs and other models in China, and these are their most profitable offerings.

Then there's the global move to decarbonise, and BEVs play an important role in the plans of most nations. With China producing the widest range of BEVs, and at the lowest price, it will be interesting to see if consumer demands win out over ideology.