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Craton said:
FWIW.
As an aside. Oddly, when I had my yearly flu jab that night I ended up with a headache and a few days later my partner had the same after her yearly flu jab. Thinking back, I seem to remember having the same reaction last year. Anyways, I digress...

CV19
I have two close medical professional friends working at the local Base Hospital, both had the AZ vaccine as soon as it become available locally.
One is female and has had her immune system compromised due to chemo a couple of years ago and she is in her early fifties. She was very worried about the AZ as the chemo has affected her adversely, for example, she has a weak heart (dilated cardiomyopathy), is now lactose intolerant and is very susceptible to picking up a bugs like flu/cold and tummy bugs.

The other mate, a male, suffers from diabetes, will be 70 this year and is working 3 weeks on, 3 weeks off until his long service leave is used up and then will retire, again. Lucky bugger, lol! Although he did retire when he turned 65, that only lasted six months before being accepted back into his old role.

Within 24 hours of the jab, both reported fever like chills and flu like symptoms which lasted about a day or so. Of course this is understandable as the body builds up the defense against Covid.

My mate was back at work within two days however, my female friend due to her heart issue (dizzy and fainting spells) ended up in ICU on the third night after the AZ jab. She was closely monitored and given treatment as necessary, O2 etc. She recovered and was back home after 48 hrs and back at work after a week.

So yes, she was obviously high risk but both have survived the initial first dose. Has their experience influenced my decision?
Not in any way. I was in the wait and see group but as a pro-vaxxer, I've done a complete 180 and said to hell with it, just get it over and done with.
If I don't make it that means my number's up. Plus side, I already have my affairs in order. I'll try to post up what, if any reaction I have to the AZ vaccine later next week.
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Great post Craton, real life examples are far better than copy and paste, or off the cuff remarks.
I also am no anti vaxxer, my mum who is 90 has had both jabs, without any issue, and the kids were all vaccinated in their childhood.
You just have to read my post script below, to see where I'm coming from, allow for the worst, hope for the best, so I'll sit on my hands until I have to have it.
I'm not worried about the clotting, adverse reaction etc, I just think I'm not going anywhere and there is no rampant outbreak.
So why have the shot when they are no doubt monitoring it and tweaking it, like I said I will no doubt have to have it at some time, but it is like buying the first car in a production run, the recalls and improvements over the life of the model run are amazing. ;)
 
sptrawler said:
Great post Craton, real life examples are far better than copy and paste, or off the cuff remarks.
I also am no anti vaxxer, my mum who is 90 has had both jabs, without any issue, and the kids were all vaccinated in their childhood.
You just have to read my post script below, to see where I'm coming from, allow for the worst, hope for the best, so I'll sit on my hands until I have to have it.
I'm not worried about the clotting, adverse reaction etc, I just think I'm not going anywhere and there is no rampant outbreak.
So why have the shot when they are no doubt monitoring it and tweaking it, like I said I will no doubt have to have it at some time, but it is like buying the first car in a production run, the recalls and improvements over the life of the model run are amazing. ;)
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A lot of the population are waiting and knowing that the government plans to isolate us till after the election. They are likely to be safe.

It is a personal risk reward calculation.

If, however, the Indian virus does get loose then it will be difficult to stop as it is said to be more contagious than the UK virus. The desperate lines to get a vaccine will then start forming In earnest.

In a few months Europe, China, Singapore, Israel, USA will be operating open economies again and we will still be in danger.
 
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I don't like to keep defending so I wont comment on other posts and besides, seeing many sides is good, so I will clarify my personal concerns instead which is not necessarily anti-vaxx, it is pro good health solutions.
I still believe we are being conned, the government is being conned and our medical officers are being conned that a vaccine is the only answer to Covid safety.
Great doctors have attested to the excellent benefits of cheap, freely-available, generic drugs for both prevention and treatment of Covid, yet the government is pushing very unsafe (relatively) and poor supply of so-called vaccines of questionable performance, making people wait, causing many deaths.
The other treatments are very well documented with large case studies. Why is this happening? Who is pulling the strings? I don't like this deceit, the manipulation of wellness in favour of expensive solutions that produce very poor results. And the companies behind the vaccine solutions have complete absolution from any damages caused. That is a big worry, they should not have that power.
I would like our government leaders to do far more research before recommending a medical solution for all instead of bowing to international peer pressure without doing their own investigations.
 
pozindustrial said:
I don't like to keep defending so I wont comment on other posts and besides, seeing many sides is good, so I will clarify my personal concerns instead which is not necessarily anti-vaxx, it is pro good health solutions.
I still believe we are being conned, the government is being conned and our medical officers are being conned that a vaccine is the only answer to Covid safety.
Great doctors have attested to the excellent benefits of cheap, freely-available, generic drugs for both prevention and treatment of Covid, yet the government is pushing very unsafe (relatively) and poor supply of so-called vaccines of questionable performance, making people wait, causing many deaths.
The other treatments are very well documented with large case studies. Why is this happening? Who is pulling the strings? I don't like this deceit, the manipulation of wellness in favour of expensive solutions that produce very poor results. And the companies behind the vaccine solutions have complete absolution from any damages caused. That is a big worry, they should not have that power.
I would like our government leaders to do far more research before recommending a medical solution for all instead of bowing to international peer pressure without doing their own investigations.
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@pozindustrial - you actually need to offer something better than your opinion.
The world's best medical experts completely disagree with you.
The treatment you say have been freely available definitely did not make a dent in rampant covid outbreaks, and to this day has been no help. Whatever you are claiming, it's simply not backed up by medical science.
 
Knobby22 said:
A lot of the population are waiting and knowing that the government plans to isolate us till after the election. They are likely to be safe.

It is a personal risk reward calculation.

If, however, the Indian virus does get loose then it will be difficult to stop as it is said to be more contagious than the UK virus. The desperate lines to get a vaccine will then start forming In earnest.

In a few months Europe, China, Singapore, Israel, USA will be operating open economies again and we will still be in danger.
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Very true knobby and that is why I said it is a personal choice, not because Im anti vaxx.
I have always paid for private health insurance, I cant see why I cant chose which vaccine I want, if I want the Pfizer I should be able to access it.
Why is the only vaccine available for those over 50, the AstraZeneca, I know it is great, but if I pay extra for choice, why isnt there choice, isnt that discrimination?
I guess discrimination is only when it affects those that the media class as deserving.
Just my opinion.
 
I find the insistence that it be one or the other rather odd, the drugs that have been proven to work against Covid can still be taken if vaccinated.

I have read that if a person gets sick with Covid they are given no treatment just oxygen to help with breathing.

If I get the flu and I go to hospital they will treat me, why not with Covid, seems like they don't want to acknowledge that symptoms can be eased with other meds.

From the very outset there was no concerted effort to find a treatment, it was all about waiting for the vaccine.

It was individual Doctors who wanted to save their own patients that came up with treatments that worked

I think this disregard for anything But the Vaccine is the main thing driving the conspiracy theory.

Just dreadful for the people that died in the meantime though
 
macca said:
I find the insistence that it be one or the other rather odd, the drugs that have been proven to work against Covid can still be taken if vaccinated.

I have read that if a person gets sick with Covid they are given no treatment just oxygen to help with breathing.

If I get the flu and I go to hospital they will treat me, why not with Covid, seems like they don't want to acknowledge that symptoms can be eased with other meds.

From the very outset there was no concerted effort to find a treatment, it was all about waiting for the vaccine.

It was individual Doctors who wanted to save their own patients that came up with treatments that worked

I think this disregard for anything But the Vaccine is the main thing driving the conspiracy theory.

Just dreadful for the people that died in the meantime though
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Absolutely macca.
Now it is you will take this one if you're under 50 and take the other one if you are over 50, WTF if you are 50 and two months? Best of luck?
If the Pfizer has a better long term efficacy, just pour the AZ down the sink or give it to a Country that really needs it at the moment and wait for the Pfizer to be available, it isn't as though a$hit load of money hasn't already been thrown at this.
 
I am not against immunisation that has been proven safe and does the job. Most vaccines unfortunately do not come into that category.

For those who think a vaccine is the choice of doctors ...
Dr. Peter McCullough is in the top five most-published medical researchers in the US. He testified before a senate committee asking why patient treatment is being ignored in favour of a vaccine solution.

There are many high-level doctors, researchers and scientists globally who have been asking the same question. They are ignored and most have been silenced. That really worries me. What is the difference here between what is happening to us via our governments and communist China? - Very little. My interest is in good health, my concern is in the commercialization of everyone's health and the censorship of any voice of reason against it.
 
pozindustrial said:
I am not against immunisation that has been proven safe and does the job. Most vaccines unfortunately do not come into that category.

For those who think a vaccine is the choice of doctors ...
Dr. Peter McCullough is in the top five most-published medical researchers in the US. He testified before a senate committee asking why patient treatment is being ignored in favour of a vaccine solution.

There are many high-level doctors, researchers and scientists globally who have been asking the same question. They are ignored and most have been silenced. That really worries me. What is the difference here between what is happening to us via our governments and communist China? - Very little. My interest is in good health, my concern is in the commercialization of everyone's health and the censorship of any voice of reason against it.
Click to expand...

@pozindustrial again offers zero medical science evidence. Carlson and Hannity on US Fox News have championed conspiracy theories and promoted pseudoscience for many years.
YouTube withdrew Dr McCulloch's upload because it was inconsistent with medical findings.
When the medical centre where McCullough holds his position disagrees with what he promotes as a treatment for an area of medicine has have no expertise in then we have a problem!
macca said:
From the very outset there was no concerted effort to find a treatment, it was all about waiting for the vaccine.
Click to expand...
This is completely false. Dozens of papers were published on possible treatment regimes in China within months of the Wuhan outbreak.
Meanwhile a March 2020 French paper proposed a potential cure using hydroxychloroquine, especially in combination with azithromycin. There are now thousands of medical science papers available (Dr McCulloch actually suggests around 50000) on the issue of treating SARS-CoV-2.
 
Fixed - my proof reading does not exist :mad:.
rederob said:
When the medical centre where McCullough holds his position disagrees with what he promotes as a treatment for an area of medicine he has no expertise in then we have a problem!
Click to expand...
 
rederob said:
@pozindustrial again offers zero medical science evidence. Carlson and Hannity on US Fox News have championed conspiracy theories and promoted pseudoscience for many years.
YouTube withdrew Dr McCulloch's upload because it was inconsistent with medical findings.
When the medical centre where McCullough holds his position disagrees with what he promotes as a treatment for an area of medicine has have no expertise in then we have a problem!

This is completely false. Dozens of papers were published on possible treatment regimes in China within months of the Wuhan outbreak.
Meanwhile a March 2020 French paper proposed a potential cure using hydroxychloroquine, especially in combination with azithromycin. There are now thousands of medical science papers available (Dr McCulloch actually suggests around 50000) on the issue of treating SARS-CoV-2.
Click to expand...

There may be papers released but the medical profession in OZ sat back and ignored them, We will wait for the vaccine thank you !!

WHY ????

There are many studies proving that some very well proven drugs can be repurposed but here in OZ they are simply not mentioned by the so called experts.

Vitamin D is not a magic bullet but it Does greatly improve the defences of the body against URTIs, why no recommendation to take Vit D

Lots of Royal Commissions get called for, maybe we need one into the lack of action by the medical profession on Covid
 
macca said:
There may be papers released but the medical profession in OZ sat back and ignored them,
Click to expand...
And your evidence for this is what?
macca said:
There are many studies proving that some very well proven drugs can be repurposed but here in OZ they are simply not mentioned by the so called experts.
Click to expand...
Again, where is your evidence that this is not happening?
Do we keep taking your word for claims which are sometimes totally false?
 
As he reported the news that night, Kory expressed disgust with “the physician scientists in the ivory towers and public health agencies” who are “just not getting it.” It was up to doctors now to save lives as the scientists are “completely disconnected to how to treat this disease and what to do.”
Click to expand...

That quote is from this article about doctors pleading with governments to use ivermectin to save lives. The scientists are the ones who have gone mad, and active censorship by governments, Google, Wikipedia and many others has labelled the doctors at the frontline and anyone else who tells us how things really are regarding Covid treatments as "Anti Vaxxers & Conspiracy Theorists" How can exposing what is really happening be a conspiracy? How can denying life-saving treatment to dying patients be considered good public health?

I say again, we are being conned.

 

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