Colorado, gun control and the 2nd Amendment

[Boggo]

The reality...
http://www.beliefnet.com/News/Articles/Harvard-University-Study-Reveals-Astonishing-Link.aspx?p=1

 

[Wysiwyg]

The reality...
http://www.beliefnet.com/News/Articles/Harvard-University-Study-Reveals-Astonishing-Link.aspx?p=1

Who to believe?

From the Uni. study -

Norway, Finland, Germany, France and Denmark, which have high rates of gun ownership, have low murder rates. On the other hand, in Luxembourg, where handguns are totally banned and ownership of any kind of gun is minimal, the murder rate is nine times higher than Germany.

American Bureau of Diplomatic Security 2014 -

Overall Crime and Safety Situation

Crime Threats

Luxembourg is a safe and modern European country with effective law enforcement and security services. Although violent crime is less prevalent in Luxembourg cities than in similarly sized American cities, property crimes still occur.

Maybe insanity is more prevalent in U.S.A.

Number of Privately Owned Firearms
The estimated total number of guns (both licit and illicit) held by civilians in the United States is 270,000,000 to 310,000,000

Compare Rate of Civilian Firearm Possession per 100 Population
The estimated rate of private gun ownership (both licit and illicit) in the United States is 101.052 firearms per 100 people

 

[Wysiwyg]

In further response to the Uni report (unreality). Pays to cross check facts especially when a report tries to play down the impact privately owned firearms have on the gun death rates not including maiming and injuries.

Uni. report -

On the other hand, in Luxembourg, where handguns are totally banned and ownership of any kind of gun is minimal, the murder rate is nine times higher than Germany.

Luxembourg

In Luxembourg, annual deaths resulting from firearms total

2011: 6
2010: 11
2009: 9
2008: 11
2007: 14
2006: 12
2005: 9
2004: 6
2003: 6
2002: 13
2001: 9
2000: 13
1999: 12
1998: 15
1997: 7

Germany

In Germany, annual deaths resulting from firearms total

2012: 819
2011: 878
2010: 903
2009: 936
2008: 953
2007: 959
2006: 953
2005: 1,044
2004: 1,145
2003: 1,122
2002: 1,061
2001: 1,102
2000: 1,112
1999: 1,201
1998: 1,164

Source - http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/luxembourg

 

[wayneL]

Slight population difference between Luxembourg and Germany


What's the comparative rate per 100,000?

 

[Wysiwyg]

In Luxembourg, the annual rate of all gun deaths per 100,000 population is

2011: 1.19
2010: 2.21
2009: 1.81
2008: 2.26
2007: 2.92
2006: 2.53
2005: 1.92
2004: 1.30
2003: 1.31
2002: 2.88
2001: 2.02
2000: 2.96
1999: 2.77
1998: 3.52
1997: 1.66


In Germany, the annual rate of all gun deaths per 100,000 population is

2012: 1.01
2011: 1.08
2010: 1.10
2009: 1.14
2008: 1.16
2007: 1.17
2006: 1.16
2005: 1.27
2004: 1.39
2003: 1.36
2002: 1.29
2001: 1.34
2000: 1.35
1999: 1.46
1998: 1.42

 

[Boggo]

Who to believe?

Who to believe is definitely the issue.

Unfortunately most of the George St keyboard warriors who have never been further west than Katoomba are the ones who seem to be the self proclaimed authority on firearms in Australia and would have to go to Google to work out the difference between ogive and anus.

 

[Wysiwyg]

Significant reduction from early 1990 onwards.

In Australia, the annual rate of all gun deaths per 100,000 population is

2012: 1.03
2011: 0.86
2010: 1.08
2009: 1.06
2008: 1.10
2007: 1.11
2006: 1.18
2005: 1.09
2004: 1.20
2003: 1.46
2002: 1.49
2001: 1.69
2000: 1.70
1999: 1.84
1998: 1.68
1997: 2.32
1996: 2.84
1995: 2.61
1994: 2.90
1993: 2.91
1992: 3.49
1991: 3.59
1990: 3.51
1989: 3.29
1988: 4.11
1987: 4.30
1986: 4.26
1985: 4.35
1984: 4.35
1983: 4.20
1982: 4.54
1981: 4.14
1980: 4.70
1979: 3.29

 

[Wysiwyg]

I reckon gun possessors can be -

Farmers (livestock and ferals), Professional shooters (culling, meat/skins, ferals etc.), Law enforcement (people) and Pro. Am. club shooters (targets).

 

[McLovin]

America's gun problem is not solely explained by access to firearms, although it doesn't help. Americans society is horrifically fragmented, individualistic, stratified and unequal. It manifests itself in many ways, not just being trigger happy when an unknown "black male" is on your property, but also in the zealous overuse of the death penalty and the steadfast objection to universal health care. Spend a bit of time on a US gun range (esp in the South) and you'll notice that the average shooter is not the "good guy" with a gun that the NRA likes to talk up.

America is broken in many ways, guns are just part of the problem.

 

[Boggo]

I reckon gun possessors can be -

Farmers (livestock and ferals), Professional shooters (culling, meat/skins, ferals etc.), Law enforcement (people) and Pro. Am. club shooters (targets).

Agree.

America's gun problem is not solely explained by access to firearms, although it doesn't help. Americans society is horrifically fragmented, individualistic, stratified and unequal. It manifests itself in many ways, not just being trigger happy when an unknown "black male" is on your property, but also in the zealous overuse of the death penalty and the steadfast objection to universal health care. Spend a bit of time on a US gun range (esp in the South) and you'll notice that the average shooter is not the "good guy" with a gun that the NRA likes to talk up.

America is broken in many ways, guns are just part of the problem.

Agree, the problem stems from the "God given right" to buy a firearm and the exploitation of that "right" by the wrong people.

The ownership and justification of the need to own is the issue that needs to be policed and that is where Australia has got it right.
As soon as you hear the loonies and melonheads complain about a particular type of gun (such as the Adler import) then you know that they are missing the point and don't understand the laws and rules to justify a purchase, acquire, retain and use a firearm legally.

 

[Boggo]

The loonies will probably claim that these are racist and will want them banned

 

[Macquack]

Spend a bit of time on a US gun range (esp in the South) and you'll notice that the average shooter is not the "good guy" with a gun that the NRA likes to talk up.

I am visualising a "Rambo" type character with a rocket launcher (down his pants), driving the biggest monster pick-up truck money can buy, with an American pitbull dog chained (with a piece of string) in the back to protect his prized wheels.

 

[luutzu]

America's gun problem is not solely explained by access to firearms, although it doesn't help. Americans society is horrifically fragmented, individualistic, stratified and unequal. It manifests itself in many ways, not just being trigger happy when an unknown "black male" is on your property, but also in the zealous overuse of the death penalty and the steadfast objection to universal health care. Spend a bit of time on a US gun range (esp in the South) and you'll notice that the average shooter is not the "good guy" with a gun that the NRA likes to talk up.

America is broken in many ways, guns are just part of the problem.

That's a good point. We seem to just blame the guns and the NRA - they are not blameless and have a lot to do with access etc. - but yea, there's the psychological instability, the socio-economic factors, the political game of pitting one group against another for each other's ill.

Take away the guns will help, but there are knives and baseball bats and Molotov cocktails.

 

[So_Cynical]

Significant reduction from early 1990 onwards.

In Australia, the annual rate of all gun deaths per 100,000 population is

2012: 1.03
2011: 0.86
2010: 1.08
2009: 1.06
2008: 1.10
2007: 1.11
2006: 1.18
2005: 1.09
2004: 1.20
2003: 1.46
2002: 1.49
2001: 1.69
2000: 1.70
1999: 1.84
1998: 1.68
1997: 2.32
1996: 2.84
1995: 2.61
1994: 2.90
1993: 2.91
1992: 3.49
1991: 3.59
1990: 3.51
1989: 3.29
1988: 4.11
1987: 4.30
1986: 4.26
1985: 4.35
1984: 4.35
1983: 4.20
1982: 4.54
1981: 4.14
1980: 4.70
1979: 3.29

Says it all.

Take away the guns will help, but there are knives and baseball bats and Molotov cocktails.

I don't seem to remember any baseball bat massacres.

 

[luutzu]

Says it all.



I don't seem to remember any baseball bat massacres.

One death is still a tragedy.

A father of two a couple of streets away from where we are was murdered early this morning by some crazy idiot with a broken bottle. Read in the paper he was dropped off by his parents, his mother took the kids in and to use the bathroom so he chatted with the old man who's hard of hearing.

Some neighbour tell them to keep their voices down, they tried but apparently not enough and next we know he was stabbed in the neck with a broken bottle and died. wtf?

 

[Tisme]

Guns seem to surface as a conversation every other week down at my local. I don't know why that is.

They prattle on about this gun that and that gun this as if they possess some special innate talent. .... a bloke hasn't got his chops unless he's shot a gun. I don't understand a lot of what they talk about and I get bored of it.... and I was a crack shot back in the day, but still manage a stuffed toy at the Royal Show.

Gun worship sucks.

 

[dutchie]

Anther mass killing in USA.

San Bernardino shooting: multiple dead after gun rampage

http://www.news.com.au/world/north-...e/news-story/befedad61bd43e3d68a326f689b5ce26



There is of course a simple solution to all these deaths. It will require an addition to the Constitution.

"All American citizens have the right to bare bullet proof vests."

If all Americans wore bullet proof vests all the time there would be less deaths.

 

[Tisme]

Anther mass killing in USA.

San Bernardino shooting: multiple dead after gun rampage

http://www.news.com.au/world/north-...e/news-story/befedad61bd43e3d68a326f689b5ce26



There is of course a simple solution to all these deaths. It will require an addition to the Constitution.

"All American citizens have the right to bare bullet proof vests."

If all Americans wore bullet proof vests all the time there would be less deaths.

International Disability Day too

 

[Wysiwyg]

Perpetrators are dead so any reason should come to light. Coz they can, maybe.

 

[McLovin]

There is of course a simple solution to all these deaths. It will require an addition to the Constitution.

"All American citizens have the right to bare bullet proof vests."

If all Americans wore bullet proof vests all the time there would be less deaths.

They have that right. Imagine trying to get your hands on an AR-15 and body armour. There is zero chance the police or ASIO wouldn't know about it. In America, you just roll down to Walmart.