Australian Defence Discussion

[Sean K]

Re: Defending Australia

Morning kennas,

There's a discussion here that has become more general than the topic heading.

You may want to link them.

Cheers

https://www.aussiestockforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9924&highlight=defence+white

Thanks Sam, made it more general now. I don't think there's enough topics to keep them separate. Cheers!

 

[Sean K]

Sad news, but surprised we haven't lost more soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan. Especially Afghanistan where our diggers are constantly in the fight.

Aussie soldier killed in Afghanistan
Staff Reporter
April 28, 2008 - 7:57AM

An Australian special forces soldier has been killed and four others wounded during a firefight with the Taliban in Afghanistan.

Father-of-two Lance Corporal Jason Marks of the Sydney-based 4RAR (Commando) unit, was named as the dead soldier by Defence chief Angus Houston at a media briefing this morning.

Lance Corporal Marks's unit was preparing for a deliberate assault 25 kilometres south-east of the Australian base Tarin Kowt when they were attacked by the Taliban, Air Chief Marshal Houston said.

He said there was a heavy exchange of small arms fire and rocket propelled grenades between the Australian troops and the Taliban, he said.

"The body of the deceased soldier and the other Australian casualties were moved by helicopter to a coalition medical facility at Tarin Kowt," Air Chief Marshal Houston told reporters.

 

[sam76]

Very sad indeed.

Condolences to his family.

 

[sam76]

Looks like the JSF has been confirmed; extracts from article below.

Patrick Walters, National security editor | April 28, 2008

THE F-35 joint strike fighter will be confirmed as the best choice to become the RAAF's frontline combat aircraft in a classified review to be presented to Defence Minister Joel Fitzgibbon later this week.

The final report of the high-level review commissioned by Mr Fitzgibbon in February is also expected to rule out the much more expensive US-made F-22 Raptor fighter as an alternative buy to the F-35 JSF.

Mr Fitzgibbon ordered the review into Australia's future air combat capability as concerns have risen about the development cost and production schedules of the JSF, as well as the capability choices facing Australia as the RAAF moves to replace its long-serving F-111 bombers and the frontline F/A-18 fighters after 2010.


The RAAF plans to acquire up to 100 F-35s from 2013 at a projected cost of $16billion, making the aircraft easily Australia's largest-ever defence buy.

The air combat capability review, led by senior defence bureaucrat Neil Orme, considered the case for and against acquiring the Raptor as well as trends in Asia-Pacific air power up to 2045.

Sources familiar with the review say it emphasises that Australia faces a far more challenging strategic environment over the next 30 years as regional air forces move to buy more sophisticated combat aircraft as well as ships and submarines.

While Australia can expect to retain a technology edge over its immediate neighbours in Southeast Asia, China will acquire 500 to 600 advanced fighter bombers over the next 30 years and is likely to surpass the US as the leading air power in East Asia.

Defence has judged that the F-35's all-round capability is still the best and most affordable platform for the RAAF's longer-term needs compared with the single-role F-22. But Mr Fitzgibbon has been keen to explore with the US Government the chances of acquiring the F-22, which at present is not for sale to overseas customers. Defence experts argue that even if Australia were allowed to buy the F-22, the RAAF could not buy enough to guarantee Australia's frontline air defence. While the procurement cost of the F-35 has risen by about 36per cent in real terms since 2002 to $US77 million a plane, the rising Australian dollar means that the RAAF is still confident it can afford the 100-strong fleet it regards as essential.
Mr Orme's findings will fundamentally shape the Government's defence white paper, due to be released at the end of the year, which will provide a clear road map for the future air force.

The first part of the Orme review, completed last month, confirmed the Howard government's plans to retire the F-111 strike force from 2010.

It also confirmed the previous government's controversial $6billion purchase of 24 Super Hornets as a bridging fighter between the retirement of the F-111 and the arrival of the F-35.


Full article can be found here:
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,23607964-31477,00.html

 

[sam76]

Check out this Radar Gun on US 60 Minutes

Apparently feels like boiling water hitting you.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/02/29/60minutes/main3891865.shtml

 

[Sean K]

Cripes, this is dodgy news.

Australia prides itself as having some of the best health support in the world, and normally abides by very strict rules in regard to medical evactuation times. Obviously there will be operational considerations, but reaching resuscitation within one hour is critical to saving life. To wait two, is obviously, in this case, life threatening.

Going to be some ramifications on this one, even if just on the ground. Someone should have their @rse in a sling at least.

Soldier died after 'bungled' medivac
July 26, 2008

A WOUNDED Australian soldier died in Afghanistan after his evacuation to hospital was delayed by a communications bungle, a senior Dutch military doctor has claimed.

 

[Tysonboss1]

Cripes, this is dodgy news.

Australia prides itself as having some of the best health support in the world, and normally abides by very strict rules in regard to medical evactuation times. Obviously there will be operational considerations, but reaching resuscitation within one hour is critical to saving life. To wait two, is obviously, in this case, life threatening.

Going to be some ramifications on this one, even if just on the ground. Someone should have their @rse in a sling at least.

Soldier died after 'bungled' medivac
July 26, 2008

A WOUNDED Australian soldier died in Afghanistan after his evacuation to hospital was delayed by a communications bungle, a senior Dutch military doctor has claimed.

One of my mates recently returned from Afganistan where he was involved in 2 instances where vehicles were hit with road side Bombs, 1 x LPV and 1 x Bushmaster.

He said in both cases the was an extremely rapid response, within minutes a med evac chopper was on the ground with 2 x Apache escots circling providing cover, you'll also be happy to know that in both cases ADF killed the guy that detonated the bombs.

I don't know what happened in the case of the recent incident, But there can be a number of things that could have happened to delay the evac, Somthing may have happened that put this case at a lower priority to another, There has also been cases in the past where choppers have been re-routed to avoid areas where there are high threats to the chopper, risking an expensive mission essential chopper and 4 crew is not worth the life of 1 soldier unfortunatly.

 

[Sean K]

I don't know what happened in the case of the recent incident, But there can be a number of things that could have happened to delay the evac, Somthing may have happened that put this case at a lower priority to another, There has also been cases in the past where choppers have been re-routed to avoid areas where there are high threats to the chopper, risking an expensive mission essential chopper and 4 crew is not worth the life of 1 soldier unfortunatly.

From my reading of it, it was because the Apache supposed to be escorting the Medivac was undergoing maintenance and couldn't get off the ground. Seems there was some C2 issues there.

Basically, if you get to a Priority 1 or 2 casualty (basically major life threatening trauma - Pri 3 is a twisted ankle) within 1 hour the chances of survival are significantly increased. A Resuscitation Team (Medical Officer, Nursing Officer, 3 x Medics) then stops bleeding, replaces fluid, maintains an airway and provides drugs, which basically stabilises the casualty and keeps them alive until surgery. It would be rare for a live casualty to reach Resus and not survive. The Australian soldier seems to have been alive for an hour after the incident, so he should have received that care, and maybe survived. Having said that, I've got no idea of his injuries and he may have been unrecoverable.

 

[Tysonboss1]

From my reading of it, it was because the Apache supposed to be escorting the Medivac was undergoing maintenance and couldn't get off the ground. Seems there was some C2 issues there.

It's unfortunate that they couldn't get him to help sooner, it's not as easy as just calling in ambulance when your on long range patrols, I would dare say that they did every thing they could. the first SAS guy that died in afganistan had an american Doctor and a small med team paracuted in to assist but even they couldn't save him, Unfortunatly that Doctor was even killed a parachute jump a few months later trying to get to another victim.

 

[gav]

Cripes, this is dodgy news.

Australia prides itself as having some of the best health support in the world, and normally abides by very strict rules in regard to medical evactuation times. Obviously there will be operational considerations, but reaching resuscitation within one hour is critical to saving life. To wait two, is obviously, in this case, life threatening.

Going to be some ramifications on this one, even if just on the ground. Someone should have their @rse in a sling at least.

Soldier died after 'bungled' medivac
July 26, 2008

A WOUNDED Australian soldier died in Afghanistan after his evacuation to hospital was delayed by a communications bungle, a senior Dutch military doctor has claimed.

I used to be a Sig (communications) in the Army, and know a few ppl over there at the moment. Would be interesting to find out the cause of this 'communications bungle'.

 

[Sean K]

I suppose those who have problems with ANZAC Day and it being a 'celebration' eek will have problems with this too.

I think it's a great idea and would really like to visit the Western Front (on the must do list) and have some infrastructure and information in place to make it a more rewarding experience.

Anyone done a Western Front tour?


Plans for Anzac track through France
August 02, 2008

AN "Anzac trail" through Flanders and the Somme region of northern France is being considered along with an upgrading of memorials to the 46,000 men who died there during World War I.

Howard government plans to build an interpretive centre at Australia's main war memorial at Villers-Bretonneux, site of a pivotal battle on Anzac Day, 1918, may be abandoned as part of the rethink on honouring Australia's dead.

Instead, Veterans Affairs Minister Allan Griffin wants to investigate options involving museums at several battlefields as part of an "Anzac trail".

 

[roland]

Well, what do you guys make of Rudd's comments regarding strengthening our military capabilities?

I spent 9 years in the Airforce and left in 1985 - seems like it has changed a lot since then. My impression was that we were always lacking "hardware" and man power - not to mention funding and apalling pay conditions.

Having said that, we did amazing things with the above limited resources - always had done and seems like we continue to do so.

I know we build warships and APC's and the odd sub, it's a pity we don't build our own military aircraft. Well, we did build the Nomad

 

[Mofra]

I know we build warships and APC's and the odd sub, it's a pity we don't build our own military aircraft. Well, we did build the Nomad

Unfortunately the capital required to build a sophisticated frontline fighter is well beyond our capacity, let alone our technical capability.

... and the Nomad is still quite a handy bit of kit for civvy skydivers

 

[sam76]

Geez I hope we're not purchasing a lemon.

We really need the upper hand in the Air (and Sea)

New Aussie fighter 'clubbed like seal'

The federal opposition has dismissed new doubts about the capacity of the multi-billion dollar Joint Strike Fighter to perform against jets used by Russia and China.

- Jets 'beaten' in simulated dogfights
- Australia likely to pay $16 billion
- War games 'not real life'

The JSF jets, for which Australia is likely to pay $16 billion, were comprehensively beaten in highly classified simulated dogfights against Russian-built Sukhoi fighter aircraft, it has been reported.

The war games, conducted at Hawaii's Hickam airbase last month, were witnessed by at least four RAAF personnel and a member of Australia's peak military spy agency, the Defence Intelligence Organisation, The West Australian said.

Opposition defence spokesman Nick Minchin said he was taking "with a grain of salt" the validity of the report. "This is based on a computer game, computer modelling of the aircraft," he told Sky News.

"This is not real life."

Senator Minchin said he had a classified briefing on the JSF from its US manufacturer Lockheed-Martin which had promoted the aircraft as the most advanced jet fighter ever.

"I can't really say much about it, but this is a phenomenal aircraft.

"As our chief of defence Angus Houston has said this is a most extraordinary aircraft, it is the right aircraft for Australia."

The multi-purpose fighter would be the backbone of the United States military, Senator Minchin said.

"We are fortunate to be in it and the government should move to make the decision to acquire it."

WA Liberal backbencher Dennis Jensen said he had spoken to a third party with knowledge of the final classified test results who had claimed the JSF had been clubbed like baby seals by the simulated Sukhois, The West Australian reported.

He said the government should demand that the US Government sell it the F-22 which was already in operation instead of the JSF.

A response was been sought from the government.

http://www.theage.com.au/national/new-aussie-fighter-clubbed-like-seal-20080911-4e6b.html

 

[refined silver]

I think the problem is that the US decided it was not economically viable to develop a next generation fighter, and a separate bomber or strike aircraft.

Hence as the name and everything about it says, its a multi-purpose plane. By definition it will not be as good a fighter as a specifically developed pure fighter plane.

Could be problems if others buy the Sukhois.

 

[nioka]

Well, we did build the Nomad

And we did build the Victa, it was as reliable as the mower. Flew like a brick. I learnt to fly in one. I think the best we can make now are homemade ultralights.

Maybe Rudd can talk the chinese into selling us one of their latest. Trade them uranium.

 

[sam76]

Watch an F22 refuel 28,000 feet up.

http://www.knoxnews.com/videos/detail/flight-lifetime/

pretty cool stuff.

 

[Sean K]

Thought this guy might have got a gong, but a VC, cripes.

Nice work mate!


Australian digger awarded Victoria Cross for heroic gallantry
Mex Cooper
January 16, 2009 - 11:49AM

An Australian digger serving in Afghanistan has been awarded the Commonwealth's highest military order - the Victoria Cross.

Trooper Mark Donaldson has been awarded Australia's 96th Victoria Cross. The last was awarded 40 years ago.

Trooper Donaldson received the award for "exceptional bravery" after saving the life of a Coalition forces interpreter during an attack in Oruzgan in Afghanistan.

On September 2, last year while under attack from the enemy Trooper Donaldson drew fire from attacking soldiers to allow wounded Australian diggers to be moved to safety.

He then returned alone to save an interpreter who was lying motionless on the ground, crossing 80 metres of exposed ground.

Trooper Donaldson was said to have shown "exceptional courage in circumstances of great peril".

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd said Trooper Donaldson had joined the ranks of Australia's heroes.

"His feat of arms, his feat under fire now becomes the stuff of Australian legend,'' he said.

Governor-General Quentin Bryce presented Trooper Donaldson with the Victoria Cross, which is inscribed with 'For Valour' at Government House in Canberra.

"You have learnt a profound truth about yourself and your capacity. You have cradled life in your arms and opened your heart to its meaning,'' she said.

"You are the finest example and inspiration. Trooper Donaldson, VC, I salute you.''

 

[2BAD4U]

Thought this guy might have got a gong, but a VC, cripes.

Got a shiver down my spine when I heard the news. A VC puts him in very elite company. Well done. A true Hero!!!

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

Thought this guy might have got a gong, but a VC, cripes.

Nice work mate!


Australian digger awarded Victoria Cross for heroic gallantry
Mex Cooper
January 16, 2009 - 11:49AM

An Australian digger serving in Afghanistan has been awarded the Commonwealth's highest military order - the Victoria Cross.

Trooper Mark Donaldson has been awarded Australia's 96th Victoria Cross. The last was awarded 40 years ago.

Trooper Donaldson received the award for "exceptional bravery" after saving the life of a Coalition forces interpreter during an attack in Oruzgan in Afghanistan.

On September 2, last year while under attack from the enemy Trooper Donaldson drew fire from attacking soldiers to allow wounded Australian diggers to be moved to safety.

He then returned alone to save an interpreter who was lying motionless on the ground, crossing 80 metres of exposed ground.

Trooper Donaldson was said to have shown "exceptional courage in circumstances of great peril".

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd said Trooper Donaldson had joined the ranks of Australia's heroes.

"His feat of arms, his feat under fire now becomes the stuff of Australian legend,'' he said.

Governor-General Quentin Bryce presented Trooper Donaldson with the Victoria Cross, which is inscribed with 'For Valour' at Government House in Canberra.

"You have learnt a profound truth about yourself and your capacity. You have cradled life in your arms and opened your heart to its meaning,'' she said.

"You are the finest example and inspiration. Trooper Donaldson, VC, I salute you.''

Congratulations to SAS Trooper Mark Donaldson.

What a brave man.

Why isn't the ministry of defence called the Ministry of Attack?

What a silly name "Defence".

gg