Asylum immigrants - Green Light

[dutchie]

Wasn't it one for eight?

one for five

we give them 800 they give us 4,000

 

[sptrawler]

one for five

we give them 800 they give us 4,000

I stand corrected on the maths, but didn't take it into consideration when making the post. Thought it was superfluous to the core issue. I will go and find a calculator next time. LOL

 

[dutchie]

From Phillip Coorey - SMH

"There is little dispute that Rudd's abolition of Howard government policies has led to the situation now whereby the boats arrive regularly, filling detention centres to the point community detention is now required.

This system of onshore processing is the very situation for which the Greens and refugee groups have argued and the numbers arriving are even higher than the experts warned.

When the inevitable tragedy strikes, the Greens and others have nothing to offer, other than some utopian vision of a regional solution, something Gillard tried to start - and was burnt.

Last year, the High Court ruled Labor's Malaysia plan illegal and the government needs the opposition's help to legislate around that decision."

(My bolds)

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/polit...wo-years-on-20120624-20wb0.html#ixzz1ykuNMxYm

 

[drsmith]

From Phillip Coorey - SMH

When the inevitable tragedy strikes, the Greens and others have nothing to offer, other than some utopian vision of a regional solution, something Gillard tried to start - and was burnt.

(My bolds)

The Greens offer more of their usual rubbish.

Following the deaths of up to 90 asylum-seekers last week, Greens leader Christine Milne today said her party wanted a “humanitarian solution” to the current border protection impasse.

She said increasing Australia's refugee intake from 14,000 to 25,000 a year would deter asylum-seekers from making the dangerous boat journey and prevent lives being lost at sea.

How will that stop the boats ?

This is a party that shares the power of government, yet the best it can do is continue to pedal this feel-good nosnense. It's around their feet that the bodies of the dead are piling.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...um-seeker-crisis/story-fn9hm1gu-1226407380094

 

[drsmith]

Well Doc, both parties will have to give and take if there is ever to be a solution. To hell with the Greens. They are not needed in this case.

I too would like to say to hell with the Greens, but the electorate can't say that until the next election. Till then, they share the power of government with Labor and with that power comes responsibility.

 

[Calliope]

The solution according to Christine Milne. The flaw in her "reasoning" is that allowing more legitimate migrants who are in the queue, will somehow reduce the numbers of illegals from Iran and Afghanistan and Sri Lanka who are queue jumpers.

OPENING Australia's doors to 11,000 more refugees a year will solve the nation's people-smuggling crisis, the Greens have declared.

Following the deaths of up to 90 asylum-seekers last week, Greens leader Christine Milne today said her party wanted a “humanitarian solution” to the current border protection impasse.

She said increasing Australia's refugee intake from 14,000 to 25,000 a year would deter asylum-seekers from making the dangerous boat journey and prevent lives being lost at sea.

“We want a humanitarian approach, consistent with international law that also prioritises the safety of life at sea,” Senator Milne told Sky News.

Senator Milne said the Greens would not support the reinstatement of offshore processing under any circumstances, despite Tony Abbott saying Labor should call on its partnership with the Greens to resolve the current impasse over asylum-seeker policy.

“There is no way the Greens will support Australia abandoning international law and offshore processing is outside Australia's obligation to international law,” she said.

“The problem with Nauru and Malaysia is they undermine Australia's capacity to get a real regional solution.”

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...um-seeker-crisis/story-fn9hm1gu-1226407380094

 

[sptrawler]

Actually, can someone tell me anything this government has got right?

 

[dutchie]

Actually, can someone tell me anything this government has got right?

Easy - Rudds apology.

and then there's..........Rudds apology

and then there's..........................................

 

[Calliope]

Easy - Rudds apology.

and then there's..........Rudds apology

and then there's..........................................

Which one?

Stolen Generation?

Forgotten people?

The homeless?

The Flght Attendant?

Pink Bats Insulation deaths?

My favourite is his apology to the survivors of the 1984 Wallaby team whose reputations have been tarnished by association with the current crop of Australian rugby tourists in Dublin in Nov 2009.

“I mean fair suck of the old savaloy sausage roll,” Rudd said. “Fairy dinkum, these drongbats don’t deserve to stand in the shade of Ella or Campo. I mean if you want to run with the big dogs you’ve got to piss in the long grass.”

 

[Julia]

I mean fair suck of the old savaloy sausage roll,” Rudd said. “Fairy dinkum, these drongbats don’t deserve to stand in the shade of Ella or Campo. I mean if you want to run with the big dogs you’ve got to piss in the long grass.”

Is that an apocryphal story or did he actually say that? Surely not!

 

[Calliope]

Is that an apocryphal story or did he actually say that? Surely not!

I know it sounds hard to believe Julia, that he would spout such nonsense. It's just his pretence that he is "one of the boys."


http://www.theroar.com.au/2009/11/17/kevin-rudd-apologises-for-wallaby-performance/

This is another apology.



I will probably be reprimanded for :topic

 

[IFocus]

From Phillip Coorey - SMH

"There is little dispute that Rudd's abolition of Howard government policies has led to the situation now whereby the boats arrive regularly, filling detention centres to the point community detention is now required.

This system of onshore processing is the very situation for which the Greens and refugee groups have argued and the numbers arriving are even higher than the experts warned.

When the inevitable tragedy strikes, the Greens and others have nothing to offer, other than some utopian vision of a regional solution, something Gillard tried to start - and was burnt.

Last year, the High Court ruled Labor's Malaysia plan illegal and the government needs the opposition's help to legislate around that decision."

(My bolds)

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/polit...wo-years-on-20120624-20wb0.html#ixzz1ykuNMxYm

You missed a bit or two (my bolds)

Abbott wants people to believe that what worked last time will work again. Detention and processing on Nauru, temporary protection visas, and turning boats around when safe to do so.

Abbott received the same briefing from the then secretary of the Immigration Department Andrew Metcalfe, as did the media. Metcalfe told Abbott his policies - of which Metcalfe was a principal architect - would not work again. Nauru would be no more a deterrent than Christmas Island because people now knew that once processed they would most likely be sent to Australia.

Temporary protection visas were not considered a deterrent and as for turning the boats back, the Indonesians would not permit it. Last time it was tried, it proved the most effective measure of all until the people smugglers started scuttling the boats when intercepted, endangering everybody.

As for the proposed policy of refusing refugee status to those who destroy their identification, to just where would you return them?

Abbott has been told not just by Metcalfe, but the Liberals' godfather of border protection, Philip Ruddock, that he should provide the numbers to allow Labor to adopt the Malaysia solution. Metcalfe called it ''virtual tow back''. Return 800 people to Malaysia and it would be like towing the boats back

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/polit...wo-years-on-20120624-20wb0.html#ixzz1ynHdjIE1

 

[sptrawler]

You missed a bit or two (my bolds)


Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/polit...wo-years-on-20120624-20wb0.html#ixzz1ynHdjIE1

Well then IFocus, the answer is easy for Gillard, all she needs do is say "In frustration I will adopt Abbotts recomendation, however I have great reservations as to the outcome".
It can't go wrong, that is unless the measures suggested actually work, even then she could make footage out of the fact she was prepared to compromise.
However reality is she doesn't listen to anyone and is more arrogant than Rudd, which in itself is pretty hard to believe.
There really is no out on this one, it is lose, lose for labor.

 

[drsmith]

emporary protection visas were not considered a deterrent and as for turning the boats back, the Indonesians would not permit it. Last time it was tried, it proved the most effective measure of all until the people smugglers started scuttling the boats when intercepted, endangering everybody.

The problem with this is that boat arrivals surged only after Labor took office.

A solution of the Malaysia type has the potential to be a lasting deterrent, but it needs to be open ended and an even bargain for both countries involved (one for one).

 

[StumpyPhantom]

The problem with this is that boat arrivals surged only after Labor took office.

A solution of the Malaysia type has the potential to be a lasting deterrent, but it needs to be open ended and an even bargain for both countries involved (one for one).

This is a perfect storm brought on by Labor. The scale of the boat arrivals now suggests that the genie is out of the bottle.

Labor's fumbling over the last 5 years, the ill-fated Malaysia solution which brought on the High Court challenge, the political stalemate, leading to the Greens inspired agenda now reigning supreme.

But let's not forget Labor's culpability in the situation we now find ourselves in. In dismantling the Pacific Solution in 2008, they employed a 'scorched earth' policy so that there was no return to Nauru. It was Labor who publicly disseminated the statistics as to why Nauru, in their view, didn't work.

But we now all agree that it DID work. Compared to the current situation, it was a brilliant success.

This was a government big on rhetoric, but nothing else. So the Apology to the Stolen Generation, with the greatest of respect, was rhetoric. Signing the Kyoto Protocol also arguably was.

The problem was when you apply that soaring rhetoric to asylum-seekers, a real issue with practical implications, then you have the disaster you currently see.

 

[noco]

As I understand it, 800 illegals who were to be sent to Malayasia was a capped number. What happens to the excess after the first 800 arrivals?

The other point that concerns me is if Gillard did relent and accept the Nauru proposal, how will it be administered? Will Labor go out of it's way to make it fail by inciting riots thorugh a contributing factor of say inadequate food or some other means.

Labor has stuffed up so much in the past, it would be very easy for them to do the same at Nauru. I just do not trust them. Labor will try to politicize it just to discredit the Coaltition.

 

[sptrawler]

This is a perfect storm brought on by Labor. The scale of the boat arrivals now suggests that the genie is out of the bottle.

Labor's fumbling over the last 5 years, the ill-fated Malaysia solution which brought on the High Court challenge, the political stalemate, leading to the Greens inspired agenda now reigning supreme.

But let's not forget Labor's culpability in the situation we now find ourselves in. In dismantling the Pacific Solution in 2008, they employed a 'scorched earth' policy so that there was no return to Nauru. It was Labor who publicly disseminated the statistics as to why Nauru, in their view, didn't work.

But we now all agree that it DID work. Compared to the current situation, it was a brilliant success.

This was a government big on rhetoric, but nothing else. So the Apology to the Stolen Generation, with the greatest of respect, was rhetoric. Signing the Kyoto Protocol also arguably was.

The problem was when you apply that soaring rhetoric to asylum-seekers, a real issue with practical implications, then you have the disaster you currently see.

When this government is long gone and the dust has settled, there will be a comedy made of this time in our political history.
There may be a series made, it would be a melding of yes minister and Fawly Towers, there is endless material.
It will be brilliant the actual stuff ups are better than fiction.

 

[drsmith]

On 2GB (Steve Price's show with Andrew Bolt), Scott Morrison has declared that the Coalition would support the Malaysian solution if it was a signatory to the refugee convention.

 

[sptrawler]

On 2GB (Steve Price's show with Andrew Bolt), Scott Morrison has declared that the Coalition would support the Malaysian solution if it was a signatory to the refugee convention.

Well that would put a whole new bent on the impasse. Also will test Gillard and Carr on their diplomacy skills.

 

[drsmith]

Well that would put a whole new bent on the impasse. Also will test Gillard and Carr on their diplomacy skills.

Bolt and Price really pushed him to get that response.

Andrew Bolt has allready replied to a post on his website while he's still on air with Steve Price.

Andrew stop badgering Scott Morrison. I understand what he was trying to say. How can you guarantee how any other sovereign country was going to treat the asylum we sent them? All it would take is for 4 corners to send a crew 1 year down the line to track down someone we sent back who has been beaten and locked up to say it was Abbott Abbott Abbott

CSC (Reply)
Mon 25 Jun 12 (08:23pm)

I got that. I prefaced the question by assuming all the necessary protections. I just wanted to know if any deal at all was possible. That’s all.

Andrew Bolt
Mon 25 Jun 12 (08:32pm)

http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andrewbolt/index.php/heraldsun/comments/on_2gb8/#commentsmore