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American Politics

"What is Trumpism"

"Building a wall and keeping brown people out "

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Ummm, actually it's trying to stop illegal immigrants flooding over the border to the detriment of American society.

If I dry-back it in the US and het caught, I'll get my @r5e deported, and I'm a whitefella.

Joe Walsh is an idiot.
It sounds as though the immigration situation is about to also follow the Trump era lead.
President Biden's time in the White House has been marked by shifting views on immigration. Biden has revoked rules that would hinder immigrants from becoming citizens, and also proposed reforms to crack down on illegal immigration. Reports suggest the president is considering reinstating the controversial practice of detaining migrant families. Where, exactly, does he stand on the issue?
 
The primaries will be super interesting also, from both sides.

The Dems have nothing but useless Muppets.

If DeSantis has any brains, he will stay out of any affray with the God Emperor. Haley and Pence have no chance.

I personally think DeSantis will make a fine president, but its not his time yet.
I don't follow any of U.S politics, I only had an interest in Trump due to the fact he stopped poncing on like most politicians do and actually tried to do something about the slow slide of the Wests living standards.
By introducing tariffs on Chinese gear, giving the EU a kick up the butt for having a selfish self centered attitude and demanding refugees use the correct channels to enter the country.
The problem with most of that, it was exactly opposite to what big business wanted, they wanted to manufacture in third world countries to maximise profits, the EU which also is a big business conglomerate were having a beano spending all their money on vehicle production and industrial manufacturing also in third world countries and exporting them to the U.S why would they want to divert money to the U.S for arms, when the U.S can just come and save their ar$e like every other time, then you have the illegals working for nothing for fear of deportation keeping wages down.
Trump had to go. ?
The only problem is, all the issues Trump said would become a problem have come to fruition.
China is much more confident now Trump has gone.
The EU is begging the US to bail them and the Ukraine out, which Trump inferred was the issue with being captive to Russia's gas.
The immigration issue is becoming a massive problem for them.
Add to that North Korea who Trump told Kim to pull his head in, or he would blow it off, Kim hadn't fired ICBM's for several years after the Trump confrontation, he is now throwing them around with gay abandon.
Yep things look a lot more stable post Trump.:roflmao:
I'm definitely not saying Trump didn't have self interest, of course he did most politicians do to varying degrees.
But Trump from memory is into the leisure industry, so the more affluent Americans are, the more money they have to spend in his businesses.
So actually returning manufacturing to the U.S would have helped Trump, but it would have been to the detriment of margins for manufacturing businesses, so who pays the media? advertising, who advertises the most? :xyxthumbs
 
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I don't follow any of U.S politics, I only had an interest in Trump due to the fact he stopped poncing on like most politicians do and actually tried to do something about the slow slide of the Wests living standards.
By introducing tariffs on Chinese gear, giving the EU a kick up the butt for having a selfish self centered attitude and demanding refugees use the correct channels to enter the country.
The problem with most of that, it was exactly opposite to what big business wanted, they wanted to manufacture in third world countries to maximise profits, the EU which also is a big business conglomerate were having a beano spending all their money on vehicle production also in third world countries and exporting them to the U.S why would they want to divert money to the U.S for arms, when the U.S can just come and save their ar$e like every other time, then you have the illegals working for nothing for fear of deportation keeping wages down.
Trump had to go. ?
The only problem is, all the issues Trump said would become a problem have come to fruition.
China is much more confident now Trump has gone.
The EU is begging the US to bail them and the Ukraine out, which Trump inferred was the issue with being captive to Russia's gas.
The immigration issue is becoming a massive problem for them.
Add to that North Korea who Trump told Kim to pull his head in, or he would blow it off, Kim hadn't fired ICBM's for several years after the Trump confrontation, he is now throwing them around with gay abandon.
Yep things look a lot more stable post Trump.:roflmao:
Bingo, absolutely!
 
I don't follow any of U.S politics, I only had an interest in Trump due to the fact he stopped poncing on like most politicians do and actually tried to do something about the slow slide of the Wests living standards.
By introducing tariffs on Chinese gear, giving the EU a kick up the butt for having a selfish self centered attitude and demanding refugees use the correct channels to enter the country.
The problem with most of that, it was exactly opposite to what big business wanted, they wanted to manufacture in third world countries to maximise profits, the EU which also is a big business conglomerate were having a beano spending all their money on vehicle production and industrial manufacturing also in third world countries and exporting them to the U.S why would they want to divert money to the U.S for arms, when the U.S can just come and save their ar$e like every other time, then you have the illegals working for nothing for fear of deportation keeping wages down.
Trump had to go. ?
The only problem is, all the issues Trump said would become a problem have come to fruition.
China is much more confident now Trump has gone.
The EU is begging the US to bail them and the Ukraine out, which Trump inferred was the issue with being captive to Russia's gas.
The immigration issue is becoming a massive problem for them.
Add to that North Korea who Trump told Kim to pull his head in, or he would blow it off, Kim hadn't fired ICBM's for several years after the Trump confrontation, he is now throwing them around with gay abandon.
Yep things look a lot more stable post Trump.:roflmao:
I'm definitely not saying Trump didn't have self interest, of course he did most politicians do to varying degrees.
But Trump from memory is into the leisure industry, so the more affluent Americans are, the more money they have to spend in his businesses.
So actually returning manufacturing to the U.S would have helped Trump, but it would have been to the detriment of margins for manufacturing businesses, so who pays the media? advertising, who advertises the most? :xyxthumbs

Yeah...nah Trump was a useful idiot for the Republican religious right to run their agenda nothing else, evidence the Supreme Court.
 
Yeah...nah Trump was a useful idiot for the Republican religious right to run their agenda nothing else, evidence the Supreme Court.
What he's religious, that's hard to believe, but then again knowing the religious people I've met, maybe not. Lol

Like I said, I don't get down to the nitty gritty, try to keep it at the big picture level, as I thought my post presented.

Maybe I should adopt the little target mantra, which is very popular these days, where short negative answers are the accepted norm, funny how many people who use them now, criticised Abbott for that trait.

It's nice to see it become popular again, saves having to come up with anything concrete or factual. ?

Yeah...nah, questions answered or nullified, move on.:roflmao:
 
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Yeah...nah Trump was a useful idiot for the Republican religious right to run their agenda nothing else, evidence the Supreme Court.
So in summary, what evidence in the Supreme Court negated the points I made, as listed:
China trade tariffs.
EU underspending as a percentage of GDP on military equipment and technology.
Supressing Kim jong-un, missile testing.
Enforcing tighter border control measures, to name a few.

The other obvious point in your short succinct sentence, that probably requires addressing is the "hate speech" (useful idiot), I thought that was a right wing loony affliction, hated and despised by the left?
Obviously not, if it falls under the umbrella of an acceptable target, that is probably going to be the undoing of all this nonsense IMO.
Interesting times on many fronts, the rich championing the poor has to end badly, the middle class carry all the load and receive the least reward. :xyxthumbs
 
So in summary, what evidence in the Supreme Court negated the points I made, as listed:
China trade tariffs.
EU underspending as a percentage of GDP on military equipment and technology.
Supressing Kim jong-un, missile testing.
Enforcing tighter border control measures, to name a few.

The other obvious point in your short succinct sentence, that probably requires addressing is the "hate speech" (useful idiot), I thought that was a right wing loony affliction, hated and despised by the left?
Obviously not, if it falls under the umbrella of an acceptable target, that is probably going to be the undoing of all this nonsense IMO.
Interesting times on many fronts, the rich championing the poor has to end badly, the middle class carry all the load and receive the least reward. :xyxthumbs

Donald Trumps achievements ? I won't argue with your identifying a number of points you either agree with or believe Donald Trump was on the right path. What I'm saying is what is not on the list and in my mind far more more concerning.

1) Deliberate undermining of peoples confidence in the US electoral process. He went into the 2020 election repeatedly saying he would have to win unless there was electoral fraud

2) Declaring he did win the 2020 election because the counted results were fraudulent. All the criticial election result were scoured. There was no evidence of election fraud that would in any way change the results. His lawyers took 60 actions to courts and in no case could show electoral fraud. His AG investigated the results and said there was no fraud.

3) Despite this reality he organised a rally on January 6th outside the capitol building to "Stop the steal". The rally was an attempt to intimidate or force Congress not to complete the counting of votes that would formalise President Biden as new President. The rally turned into a march on Congress and the thousands of supporters forced their way into he building intent on capturing/stopping /hanging ? the politicians who were going to vote.

4) He watched the assault on TV and did nothing for 2 hours. As Congress was being invaded and police fought with insurrectionists Donald Trump sat and watched. Officials were pleading for action as a President to condemn this behaviour and reinforce the police. He waited for over two hours before asking his people to "stand down".

5) He continues to insist the election was stolen and demands anyone who wants his support strongly agree. This is the element of the cult. Donald Trump has effectively purged the Republician Party of anyone who acknowledges the last election was fairly run and fairly lost. They have been replaced with strident Congress members who echo his lying electoral fraud claims. The remainder of the Republican Party just accept his claims to stay in power. The Republician party is now in his control and the only people who can be heard are those like De Santis who effectively mimic his language and behaviour.

"Trumpism" is an authoritarian government model that is non democratic and will not willingly go out of office to another party. We have authoritarian governments in Hungary, Turkey, Russia, China to name a few. Hitlers Germany, Mussolinis Italy were authoritarian governments.

Ex -conservative Republician Joe Walsh highlights the reality of Trumps goal in 5 minutes. That was why I posted it.
 
Donald Trumps achievements ? I won't argue with your identifying a number of points you either agree with or believe Donald Trump was on the right path. What I'm saying is what is not on the list and in my mind far more more concerning.

1) Deliberate undermining of peoples confidence in the US electoral process. He went into the 2020 election repeatedly saying he would have to win unless there was electoral fraud

2) Declaring he did win the 2020 election because the counted results were fraudulent. All the criticial election result were scoured. There was no evidence of election fraud that would in any way change the results. His lawyers took 60 actions to courts and in no case could show electoral fraud. His AG investigated the results and said there was no fraud.

3) Despite this reality he organised a rally on January 6th outside the capitol building to "Stop the steal". The rally was an attempt to intimidate or force Congress not to complete the counting of votes that would formalise President Biden as new President. The rally turned into a march on Congress and the thousands of supporters forced their way into he building intent on capturing/stopping /hanging ? the politicians who were going to vote.

4) He watched the assault on TV and did nothing for 2 hours. As Congress was being invaded and police fought with insurrectionists Donald Trump sat and watched. Officials were pleading for action as a President to condemn this behaviour and reinforce the police. He waited for over two hours before asking his people to "stand down".

5) He continues to insist the election was stolen and demands anyone who wants his support strongly agree. This is the element of the cult. Donald Trump has effectively purged the Republician Party of anyone who acknowledges the last election was fairly run and fairly lost. They have been replaced with strident Congress members who echo his lying electoral fraud claims. The remainder of the Republican Party just accept his claims to stay in power. The Republician party is now in his control and the only people who can be heard are those like De Santis who effectively mimic his language and behaviour.

"Trumpism" is an authoritarian government model that is non democratic and will not willingly go out of office to another party. We have authoritarian governments in Hungary, Turkey, Russia, China to name a few. Hitlers Germany, Mussolinis Italy were authoritarian governments.

Ex -conservative Republician Joe Walsh highlights the reality of Trumps goal in 5 minutes. That was why I posted it.
Absolutely agree, but from a political and economic perspective, the points you raise are just the result of a very unpleasant personality, which I've never disagreed with. All your examples are personality based, which is what I've been pointing out.
Having said that, if the choice is between an unpleasant personality and a World heading in the right direction, as opposed to a lovely personality and the world falling into chaos I would choose the former.
Putin, XI and Kim where very cautious with Trump, because of those very unattractive personality traits you mention, now they see a supposed super power being run from a nursing home annex, it is the obvious time to apply pressure while the opposition is in a headless chook state.
Running things isn't always about having a nice person in charge, as I've mentioned before, the current socially driven narrative in the West, will indeed be its downfall IMO.
Which is very sad, because in the context of human history, never have those most needy received so much help.
If the current trend continues our society will fail, we will run out of people prepared to put the garbage out and another group of invaders will move in.
All the examples you gave above, re authoritarian governments, were all republics which is exactly the way the narrative that you so strongly support is pushing us. So I do wonder why you are so concerned, when that is the end game in play as we speak.
Just my opinion, but when that happens, we will be the ones asking for a voice to Government. ?
 
Absolutely agree, but from a political and economic perspective, the points you raise are just the result of a very unpleasant personality, which I've never disagreed with. All your examples are personality based, which is what I've been pointing out.

OK SP you say Trump has an " unpleasant personality".

Generally that label would be applied to crashing loud mouthed bores. You could add overall BS artists who boast and boost themselves at every opportunity. Go a step further and you could suggest a determinedly ruthless person who does anything he can get away with to get his way. That is a conventionally unpleasant personality. It's fair to say that is how Trump could have been viewed in the past. But Trump pot 2016 goes way, way past this label.

What Trump does is what counts.
He actively destroys public confidence in the entire US political system by claiming he was robbed . He pressured everyone from Pence to the A-G to State election officials to follow his line and make up evidence to support his claim. That is beyond "unpleasant personality" . It is pure sociopath.

His demand that people in the Republician Party support his claim of electoral robbery is the stuff of CULTS. Whether it is the cult of Hitler, Stalin, Putin or any contemporary Authoritarian leader the results are similar. Trump and Trumpism will run a government without boundaries ruled by the dictates of one person who uses fear and muscle to keep everyone in their place. The law is now subjugated to the will of the leader. There is no political opposition because once the leader has spoken any contradiction is practically treasonous. The only press that is allowed supports the Leader or is totally "tame".

Donald Trump has repeatedly made these demands. This is not guessing what he would do.

Of course that doesn't mean one can't live in an authoritarian regime. You just have to keep your head down, never criticize the leader or his policies/police and make the right noises. If that is the society people want there are plenty of other places they could explore before wanting to impose it on Oz or the United States
 
OK SP you say Trump has an " unpleasant personality".

Generally that label would be applied to crashing loud mouthed bores. You could add overall BS artists who boast and boost themselves at every opportunity. Go a step further and you could suggest a determinedly ruthless person who does anything he can get away with to get his way. That is a conventionally unpleasant personality. It's fair to say that is how Trump could have been viewed in the past. But Trump pot 2016 goes way, way past this label.

What Trump does is what counts.
He actively destroys public confidence in the entire US political system by claiming he was robbed . He pressured everyone from Pence to the A-G to State election officials to follow his line and make up evidence to support his claim. That is beyond "unpleasant personality" . It is pure sociopath.

His demand that people in the Republician Party support his claim of electoral robbery is the stuff of CULTS. Whether it is the cult of Hitler, Stalin, Putin or any contemporary Authoritarian leader the results are similar. Trump and Trumpism will run a government without boundaries ruled by the dictates of one person who uses fear and muscle to keep everyone in their place. The law is now subjugated to the will of the leader. There is no political opposition because once the leader has spoken any contradiction is practically treasonous. The only press that is allowed supports the Leader or is totally "tame".

Donald Trump has repeatedly made these demands. This is not guessing what he would do.

Of course that doesn't mean one can't live in an authoritarian regime. You just have to keep your head down, never criticize the leader or his policies/police and make the right noises. If that is the society people want there are plenty of other places they could explore before wanting to impose it on Oz or the United States
It actually doesn't matter, what he said post losing the election, he is then a disenfranchised megalomaniac. He is no longer the President, there will be those who still follow him, but the next election will show how much traction he has gained.
What Presidents and leaders in general should be mainly measured on, is what they achieved for the country when in office, not if they have a fanatic fan club.
This is the problem with a totally disfunctional media, that has to generate 24/7 news, they have to generate their own content. The issue isn't Trump it is those overly fixated on Trump, if the media shut up about Trump for 6 months, you wouldn't be talking about him and he would be forgotten, but then the media would have to come up with something else to get you engaged in and looking at their websites.
 
What he's religious, that's hard to believe, but then again knowing the religious people I've met, maybe not. Lol

The supreme court appointments by the Republicans under Trump will rule over the US for 20 to 50 years running a religious right agenda, the result is marginalization of many groups within the US and on face cementing gerrymander and voting restrictions favoring Republicans.

None of it will be fair or progressive but regressive old testament BS.

The things you attribute to Trump are highly debatable some commentary out side of political bias I have seen really doesn't paint a pretty picture of Trump.

A good gauge of Trump is find a great Republican president (actually leader) then compare to Trump his deliberate aggressive divisive manner and policy rule him out IMHO.
 
It actually doesn't matter, what he said post losing the election, he is then a disenfranchised megalomaniac
No he isn't SP. According to him and the 40 million followers who believe everything he says... he should still be President and only lost office because of a corrupt electoral system.

Because he still has immense personal control of this voting base he also controls the Republician Party and demands that they in general and in particular agree he wrongfully lost the election.

You say it is the media that are keeping Trump alive ? Trump made the decision post Nov 5th to not allow a peaceful Presidential transition. Every single thing he has done since then has been built on the lie of wrongful election loss. It has created on ongoing rift in US society. On one hand we have a significant core of people who swear by his every word coupled with a Republican Party that is effectovely controlled by Trumps followers. And then there is the remainder of the US which acknowldges there is a legitimate current President. That is a serious split.
 
No he isn't SP. According to him and the 40 million followers who believe everything he says... he should still be President and only lost office because of a corrupt electoral system.

Because he still has immense personal control of this voting base he also controls the Republician Party and demands that they in general and in particular agree he wrongfully lost the election.

You say it is the media that are keeping Trump alive ? Trump made the decision post Nov 5th to not allow a peaceful Presidential transition. Every single thing he has done since then has been built on the lie of wrongful election loss. It has created on ongoing rift in US society. On one hand we have a significant core of people who swear by his every word coupled with a Republican Party that is effectovely controlled by Trumps followers. And then there is the remainder of the US which acknowldges there is a legitimate current President. That is a serious split.
And? It takes all kinds of personalities to be in office to suit the times, as I've said before Winston Churchill was legendary during the war, but apparently a very unattractive pompous person and didn't last in peacefull times.
Getting caught up on the personality of the person, is why the wrong people end up in office at the wrong times, Chamberlain was flipped for Churchill, yet Chamberlain was trying to broker a deal with Hitler.
These days the loony left would have cheered Chamberlain on and lambasted Churchill as a war monger, history repeats, Trump had Xi, Putin and Kim bluffed.
Now you have Biden, who seems harmless and guess what, so does Putin, Xi and Kim.
 
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Orange man bad, Dementia and gender dysphoric patients good. Give me the rude bastid any day
 
The Domonion - Fox news libel case is almost here. We have already heard from pre trial releases the depth of Fox News duplicity in their coverage of Trumps Big Election Lies. They knew it was all BS.

Fox News to defend its on-air lies as blockbuster Dominion trial to kick off

Voting equipment company is suing the network for $1.6bn in trial seen as strongest chance to hold Fox News and Rupert Murdoch accountable

The fight for democracy is supported by
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About this content
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Sam Levine in New York
Sun 16 Apr 2023 06.00 EDTLast modified on Sun 16 Apr 2023 14.34 ED


After Joe Biden was declared the winner of the 2020 presidential election, several hosts at Fox News, the powerful network that feeds the pulse of America’s conservatives, aired outlandish and false claims about the vote. Many of them had to do with Dominion, a voting equipment company founded in 2003 that most Americans had never heard of.

Over and over again, the network aired the lie that Dominion machines rigged the election and were flipping votes. It aired the lie that the company was founded in Venezuela to rig elections for dictator Hugo Chávez. And it aired the lie that Dominion had bribed government officials to use its machines.

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Fox News-Dominion case heats up as Giuliani audio emerges and trial nears
Read more
None of those claims were true and Fox hosts, producers and top executives knew it. A stunning trove of internal communications obtained by Dominion shows there was widespread disbelief at the company; everyone from Fox’s CEO, Rupert Murdoch, to top hosts such as Sean Hannity and Tucker Carlson knew the claims were untrue, even as the network continued to air them to millions of Americans.

Those messages and the claims are now at the center of a blockbuster six-week jury trial set to begin on Monday in Wilmington, Delaware, where Fox is incorporated. Dominion is suing Fox News and its parent company Fox Corporation for defamation, seeking at least $1.6bn it says it is due to cover the reputational damage it suffered as a result of Fox’s lies. The jury could also choose to impose additional punitive damages.

The trial is seen as one of the strongest opportunities for holding Fox and Murdoch, accused for years of distorting the truth to rile up conservative viewers, accountable for its lies.

 
Dominion agrees to pay Fox News $787 million, Fox News reports

fox-news-dominion-1.jpg

Proclaiming that it would never lie to its audience, Fox News has told viewers that Dominion Voting Systems has dropped its defamation case, issued an apology and agreed to pay the news network $787.5 million.

“Today, Dominion admitted that its claim that we systematically lie to our audience in order to boost ratings, was a complete fabrication,” Fox News host Tucker Carlson told viewers.

“This is an historic win for Fox News, but it is also a win for journalistic standards, and it is a win for you. When you watch Fox News, you know you’re getting the truth – and this decision by Dominion to pay us almost a billion dollars is proof that we never lied to you”.

Carlson said reports from other news networks that claimed it was actually Fox that had agreed to pay the settlement were fake news. “Just stick to watching Fox and you’ll get all the news you need”.


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I was quite disappointed that the trial against Fox News for repeating known lies about the 2020 election was not going ahead.
I'm not surprised because hearing big Fox media names attempting to explain in court why they repeated and promoted Trumps poisonous lies about the 2020 election would have been disastrous for them and the organisation.

However there is still light at the end of the tunnel. The train is still coming.

Fox still faces several legal battles related to its decision to broadcast false claims. Smartmatic, another voting equipment company, is suing the company for $2.7bn. Abby Grossberg, a former Fox employee who worked for Bartiromo and Carlson, is also suing the company, alleging she was coerced into giving misleading testimony.

The network also faces a separate lawsuit from a shareholder who is seeking damages and argues that executives breached their fiduciary duty to the company by causing false claims about the election to be broadcast.

During the press conference, Stephen Shackelford, an attorney who was set to give opening arguments for Dominion on Tuesday, said that the company will continue seeking accountability.

“Money is accountability,” he said. “We got that today from Fox. But we’re not done yet. We’ve got some other people who have some accountability coming for them.”

 
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