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Resisting Climate Hysteria

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noco said:
Thanks Rumpy...A very interesting article with a lot of "MAYBES" and with some uncertainties....I read the hold post and looked at all 27 photos of Greenland and #9 attracted my attention.

July 30, 2013 Icebergs float by the home of potato and sheep farmer Otto Nielsen in Qaqortoq. Nielsen said that even though this summer has not been as warm as last year, the climate change has extended the crop growing season. Joe Raedle/Getty Images

But that article does not detract from the fact that it all happened 1000 years ago and it may be happening again now.....CLIMATE CHANGE ????????...YES...man made NO.

So why can't you and other alarmists accept my POV?.....Is that an embarrassment for you?
Click to expand...

But you are only looking (convenientlt) at one small part of tge globe, and there is a bit in southern end of south America. You are nitpicking to hold your argument.

Elswhere, heat, floods and unseasonale storms are breaking out everywhere. Just noted a piece on TV on large parts of India on shortage of water. Deeper bore water causing huge health problems. Farmers here at Bendigo have not seen it so dry and normal autumn rains nowhere to be seen. Some say that it looks like it is not going to rain again. The concerns of climate change is a growing topic on the streets.

Time for you to sell those coal shares noco and join us in trying to find alternatives. :2twocents
 
explod said:
But you are only looking (convenient) at one small part of the globe, and there is a bit in southern end of south America. You are nitpicking to hold your argument.

Elsewhere, heat, floods and unseasonable storms are breaking out everywhere. Just noted a piece on TV on large parts of India on shortage of water. Deeper bore water causing huge health problems. Farmers here at Bendigo have not seen it so dry and normal autumn rains nowhere to be seen. Some say that it looks like it is not going to rain again. The concerns of climate change is a growing topic on the streets.

Time for you to sell those coal shares noco and join us in trying to find alternatives. :2twocents
Click to expand...

What has the southern end of South America or India got to do with topic of conversation in Greenland?

Coal???? ...there is a new coal mine about to open up in Queensland with the approval of the state Labor Government....The biggest coal mine in the history of the state.

Yeah....Flim Flam Tim Flannery said Brisbane , Sydney and Melbourne would never ever see enough rain to fill the dams again.
 
Did you know ?
A global coalition mapping and motivating decarbonization

A coalition of governments, oil companies, and other key parties works for climate action and carbon pricing
Diplomats, business leaders, World Bank staff, and strategic partners gather just before the inaugural High-Level Assembly of the Carbon Pricing Leadership Coalition.

Joseph Robertson

Monday 25 April 2016 20.00 AEST
Last modified on Monday 25 April 2016 20.02 AEST


Would it surprise you to learn that governments, oil companies, NGOs and major investors are coming together to map””and to motivate””the decarbonization of the global economy?

The Carbon Pricing Leadership Coalition (CPLC) is a policy-focused alliance of national and subnational governments, intergovernmental agencies, businesses and institutional investors, nonprofits and stakeholder networks. It was launched on the first day of the Paris climate negotiations, and its mission is simple: to collaborate across borders, across sectors, sharing information, know-how and capacity, to build the most economically efficient tools for decarbonization into every nation’s climate plan as soon as possible.

The Paris Agreement calls for non-state support for national climate action. The 17th Sustainable Development Goal is devoted to partnerships that build capacity and speed implementation. At the CPLC table, all of the partners are peers, and this takes the project well beyond the the conventions of global governance: honest and capable support for success is the shared focus, so governments and leading businesses work with intellectuals and policy advocates, to ensure no good thinking is left off the menu.

......Some approaches focus on covering one or more sectors of the economy””power generation, transport, agriculture. Others prioritize rewarding early actors while limiting emissions overall. But a simple fee applied to carbon-emitting fuels at the source with revenues recycled back into the economy can cover all sectors while adding day to day economic value at the human scale. https://geoversiv.net/2014/06/12/remi/
Click to expand...
http://www.theguardian.com/environm...lition-mapping-and-motivating-decarbonization
 
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2016/04/25/inconvenient-study-co2-fertilization-greening-the-earth/

From BOSTON UNIVERSITY:

BOSTON ”” An international team of 32 authors from 24 institutions in eight countries has just published a study titled “Greening of the Earth and its Drivers” in the journal Nature Climate Change showing significant greening of a quarter to one-half of the Earth’s vegetated lands using data from the NASA-MODIS and NOAA-AVHRR satellite sensors of the past 33 years. The greening represents an increase in leaves on plants and trees. Green leaves produce sugars using energy in the sunlight to mix carbon dioxide (CO2) drawn in from the air with water and nutrients pumped in from the ground. These sugars are the source of food, fiber and fuel for life on Earth. More sugars are produced when there is more CO2 in the air, and this is called CO2 fertilization.

“We were able to tie the greening largely to the fertilizing effect of rising atmospheric CO2 concentration by tasking several computer models to mimic plant growth observed in the satellite data,” says co-author Prof. Ranga Myneni of the Department of Earth and Environment at Boston University, USA. Burning oil, gas, coal and wood for energy releases CO2 in to the air. The amount of CO2 in the air has been increasing since the industrial age and currently stands at a level not seen in at least half-a-million years. It is the chief culprit of climate change.

About 85% of the Earth’s ice-free lands is covered by vegetation. The area of all green leaves on Earth is equal to, on average, 32% of the Earth’s total surface area – oceans, lands and permanent icesheets combined. “The greening over the past 33 years reported in this study is equivalent to adding a green continent about two-times the size of mainland USA (18 million km²), and has the ability to fundamentally change the cycling of water and carbon in the climate system,” says lead author Dr. Zaichun Zhu, a researcher from Peking University, China, who did the first-half of this study as a Visiting Scholar in the Department of Earth and Environment at Boston University, USA, together with Prof. Myneni.

Every year, about one-half of the 10 billion tons of carbon emitted in to the atmosphere from human activities remains temporarily stored, in about equal parts, in the oceans and plants. “While our study did not address the connection between greening and carbon storage in plants, other studies have reported an increasing carbon sink on land since the 1980s, which is entirely consistent with the idea of a greening Earth,” says coauthor Prof. Shilong Piao of the Chinese Academy of Sciences Center for Excellence in Tibetan Plateau Earth Science, Beijing, China.

The beneficial aspect of CO2 fertilization in promoting plant growth has been used by contrarians, notably Lord Ridley (hereditary peer in the UK House of Lords) and Mr. Rupert Murdoch (owner of several news outlets), to argue against cuts in carbon emissions to mitigate climate change, similar to those agreed at the 21st Conference of Parties (COP) meeting in Paris last year under the UN Framework on Climate Change (UNFCCC). “The fallacy of the contrarian argument is two-fold. First, the many negative aspects of climate change, namely global warming, rising sea levels, melting glaciers and sea ice, more severe tropical storms, etc. are not acknowledged. Second, studies have shown that plants acclimatize, or adjust, to rising CO2 concentration and the fertilization effect diminishes over time,” says co-author Dr. Philippe Ciais, Associate Director of the Laboratory of Climate and Environmental Sciences, Gif-suvYvette, France and Contributing Lead Author of the Carbon Chapter for the recent IPCC Assessment Report 5.

CO2 fertilization is only one, albeit a predominant, reason why the Earth is greening. The study also identified climate change, nitrogen fertilization and land management as other important reasons. “While the detection of greening is based on measurements, the attribution to various drivers is based on models, and these models have known deficiencies. Future works will undoubtedly question and refine our results,” says coauthor Dr. Josep Canadell of the CSIRO Oceans and Atmosphere Division in Canberra, Australia and leader of the Global Carbon Project.

###
 
wayneL said:
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2016/04/25/inconvenient-study-co2-fertilization-greening-the-earth/



“ The amount of CO2 in the air has been increasing since the industrial age and currently stands at a level not seen in at least half-a-million years. It is the chief culprit of climate change.

###
Click to expand...

That's a bit disappointing; greening is obviously not keeping pace with the incipient carbon dioxide poising we must all be suffering, could explain some behavioural challenges....might just be plants and bugs left in the end. I'm also guessing that all that new green is soaking rainwater instead of recycling its way back into the increasingly salty rivers, aquafers, fisheries, etc?
 
wayneL said:
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2016/04/25/inconvenient-study-co2-fertilization-greening-the-earth/

From BOSTON UNIVERSITY:

BOSTON ”” An international team of 32 authors from 24 institutions in eight countries has just published a study titled “Greening of the Earth and its Drivers” in the journal Nature Climate Change showing significant greening of a quarter to one-half of the Earth’s vegetated lands using data from the NASA-MODIS and NOAA-AVHRR satellite sensors of the past 33 years. The greening represents an increase in leaves on plants and trees. Green leaves produce sugars using energy in the sunlight to mix carbon dioxide (CO2) drawn in from the air with water and nutrients pumped in from the ground. These sugars are the source of food, fiber and fuel for life on Earth. More sugars are produced when there is more CO2 in the air, and this is called CO2 fertilization.

“We were able to tie the greening largely to the fertilizing effect of rising atmospheric CO2 concentration by tasking several computer models to mimic plant growth observed in the satellite data,” says co-author Prof. Ranga Myneni of the Department of Earth and Environment at Boston University, USA. Burning oil, gas, coal and wood for energy releases CO2 in to the air. The amount of CO2 in the air has been increasing since the industrial age and currently stands at a level not seen in at least half-a-million years. It is the chief culprit of climate change.

About 85% of the Earth’s ice-free lands is covered by vegetation. The area of all green leaves on Earth is equal to, on average, 32% of the Earth’s total surface area – oceans, lands and permanent icesheets combined. “The greening over the past 33 years reported in this study is equivalent to adding a green continent about two-times the size of mainland USA (18 million km²), and has the ability to fundamentally change the cycling of water and carbon in the climate system,” says lead author Dr. Zaichun Zhu, a researcher from Peking University, China, who did the first-half of this study as a Visiting Scholar in the Department of Earth and Environment at Boston University, USA, together with Prof. Myneni.

Every year, about one-half of the 10 billion tons of carbon emitted in to the atmosphere from human activities remains temporarily stored, in about equal parts, in the oceans and plants. “While our study did not address the connection between greening and carbon storage in plants, other studies have reported an increasing carbon sink on land since the 1980s, which is entirely consistent with the idea of a greening Earth,” says coauthor Prof. Shilong Piao of the Chinese Academy of Sciences Center for Excellence in Tibetan Plateau Earth Science, Beijing, China.

The beneficial aspect of CO2 fertilization in promoting plant growth has been used by contrarians, notably Lord Ridley (hereditary peer in the UK House of Lords) and Mr. Rupert Murdoch (owner of several news outlets), to argue against cuts in carbon emissions to mitigate climate change, similar to those agreed at the 21st Conference of Parties (COP) meeting in Paris last year under the UN Framework on Climate Change (UNFCCC). “The fallacy of the contrarian argument is two-fold. First, the many negative aspects of climate change, namely global warming, rising sea levels, melting glaciers and sea ice, more severe tropical storms, etc. are not acknowledged. Second, studies have shown that plants acclimatize, or adjust, to rising CO2 concentration and the fertilization effect diminishes over time,” says co-author Dr. Philippe Ciais, Associate Director of the Laboratory of Climate and Environmental Sciences, Gif-suvYvette, France and Contributing Lead Author of the Carbon Chapter for the recent IPCC Assessment Report 5.

CO2 fertilization is only one, albeit a predominant, reason why the Earth is greening. The study also identified climate change, nitrogen fertilization and land management as other important reasons. “While the detection of greening is based on measurements, the attribution to various drivers is based on models, and these models have known deficiencies. Future works will undoubtedly question and refine our results,” says coauthor Dr. Josep Canadell of the CSIRO Oceans and Atmosphere Division in Canberra, Australia and leader of the Global Carbon Project.

###
Click to expand...

Nice work Wayne.......The Green Alarmist won't like your post one bit because it all goes against their grain of this Global Warming BS....The biggest farce and scam the World has ever known.

No matter what you throw up at these scaremongers, they will come back at you every time with more manipulated BS, propaganda and lies.

A typical case recently is the Greenland incident whereby they were shot down in flames of something happening today that happened 1000 years ago when it was warmer then than it is today but the naive still don't want to believe it.

97% of all scientist say Global Warming is real according to Luutzu but he can't tell you how many that 97% represents.......One shows that 31,478 scientists signed a petition stating the opposite that Global warming is not man made but that makes very little difference to their brains....They are completely brain washed and anyone Else's POV must be disregarded....They still cannot follow that this whole scam is a UN plot for World Government.

The Great Barrier Reef, according to these scaremongers, is all but gone....The reef has been stressed before with coral bleaching and has always recovered.

Wayne, be prepared for a blast today....:banghead:
 
noco said:
Nice work Wayne.......The Green Alarmist won't like your post one bit because it all goes against their grain of this Global Warming BS....The biggest farce and scam the World has ever known.

No matter what you throw up at these scaremongers, they will come back at you every time with more manipulated BS, propaganda and lies.

A typical case recently is the Greenland incident whereby they were shot down in flames of something happening today that happened 1000 years ago when it was warmer then than it is today but the naive still don't want to believe it.

97% of all scientist say Global Warming is real according to Luutzu but he can't tell you how many that 97% represents.......One shows that 31,478 scientists signed a petition stating the opposite that Global warming is not man made but that makes very little difference to their brains....They are completely brain washed and anyone Else's POV must be disregarded....They still cannot follow that this whole scam is a UN plot for World Government.

The Great Barrier Reef, according to these scaremongers, is all but gone....The reef has been stressed before with coral bleaching and has always recovered.

Wayne, be prepared for a blast today....:banghead:
Click to expand...

Thanks for the laugh mate.

:D:xyxthumbs
 
noco said:
Is that the best you can do Rumpy?

That sort of response proves you don't have the answers...You are totally brainwashed with the Green manipulated propaganda..
Click to expand...

I give you scientific studies like the one on Greenland which you simply dismiss as "propaganda", so there is no point continuing a discussion with someone so one eyed.

Have a nice day.
 
SirRumpole said:
I give you scientific studies like the one on Greenland which you simply dismiss as "propaganda", so there is no point continuing a discussion with someone so one eyed.

Have a nice day.
Click to expand...

You are WRONG...WRONG..WRONG again.

You just don't get it do you?

I am not denying what is happening on Greenland today as you try to make out.

What I am denying is that this event is not man made...How could it be when the same thing happened 1000 years ago and yet you still keep coming back.

You and your Greenie mates have had a set back and you don't like it and that is why you want to end the debate......You have been beaten left, right and center....Shot down in flames.
 
noco said:
What I am denying is that this event is not man made...How could it be when the same thing happened 1000 years ago
Click to expand...

Nobody would seriously dispute that natural cycles exist and that man does not fully understand them.

The question is whether or not recent events are "in step" with such cycles or are they "out of step"?

If the temperature is going up whilst natural cycles are such that it shouldn't be then that would suggest a man-made influence. Obviously that's not the case if the temperature is rising in accordance with natural cycles.

It's the same with anything. A child should become progressively taller and stronger at least until they're an adult. Something's seriously wrong if a 15 year old is weaker and shorter than they were 3 years earlier.

A car should slow down when you apply the brakes. It's a certain indication that you've got a big problem if it speeds up when the brakes are applied.

And so on. If anything is out of step with what it should be doing then that's always an indication that something's wrong. :2twocents
 
noco said:
You are WRONG...WRONG..WRONG again.

You just don't get it do you?

I am not denying what is happening on Greenland today as you try to make out.

What I am denying is that this event is not man made...How could it be when the same thing happened 1000 years ago and yet you still keep coming back.

You and your Greenie mates have had a set back and you don't like it and that is why you want to end the debate......You have been beaten left, right and center....Shot down in flames.
Click to expand...

Noco, you have failed to convince me of what happenned 1000 years ago in Greenland, a link that does not work and no actual explanation from exactly what occurred with supporting scientific evidence. And there were certainly no scientist around then. So please clearly clarify.

And to say anyone is "WRONG WRONG WRONG" :banghead: is plainly wrong till you can convince us that your, mostly wild rantingis are right.

So try to be sensible Champ
 
explod said:
Noco, you have failed to convince me of what happenned 1000 years ago in Greenland, a link that does not work and no actual explanation from exactly what occurred with supporting scientific evidence. And there were certainly no scientist around then. So please clearly clarify.

And to say anyone is "WRONG WRONG WRONG" :banghead: is plainly wrong till you can convince us that your, mostly wild rantingis are right.

So try to be sensible Champ
Click to expand...

How many times do you want me to give it to you?

Here it is again...If you cannot follow it this time then I will feel sorry for you.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Greenland

Green·land (grēn′lənd, -lănd′)
An island in the northern Atlantic Ocean off northeast Canada. It is the largest island in the world and lies mostly within the Arctic Circle. Settled by the Norse between the 10th and the 15th century and by the Inuit beginning around the 10th century, Greenland became a Danish colony in the 18th century and was granted home rule in 1979. Nuuk (Godthåb) is the capital.
Green·land′ic (-lăn′dĭk) adj.
Word History: How did a glacier-covered island get the name Greenland? In Icelandic sagas written in the 12th century and later, it is told that Eric the Red explored the southeast and southwest coasts of Greenland in ad 983-986. He thought his fellow Icelanders would be more likely to go there if it had an attractive name, and he therefore called it Grænland, Icelandic for "Greenland." This was not exactly a case of false advertising. Greenland was warmer in the 10th century than it is now. There were many islands teeming with birds off its western coast, the sea was excellent for fishing, and the coast of Greenland itself had many fjords where anchorage was good. Moreover, at the head of the fjords there were enormous meadows full of grass, willows, junipers, birch, and wild berries. Icelanders set up colonies in Greenland that thrived for much of the next three hundred years. In the middle of the 14th century, however, the North Atlantic area began to cool significantly. The colonies began to die out, and they finally disappeared at the very beginning of the 15th century. Only the Inuit continued to live on the island as the climate grew progressively colder and the formerly green valleys of Greenland were covered by ice.
American Heritage ® Dictionary of the English Language, Fifth Edition. Copyright © 2011 by Houghton Mifflin Harcourt Publishing Company. Published by Houghton Mifflin Harcourt Publishing Company. All rights reserved.
Greenland (ˈɡriːnlənd)
n
(Placename) a large island, lying mostly within the Arctic Circle off the NE coast of North America: first settled by Icelanders in 986; resettled by Danes from 1721 onwards; integral part of Denmark (1953–79); granted internal autonomy 1979; mostly covered by an icecap up to 3300 m (11 000 ft) thick, with ice-free coastal strips and coastal mountains; the population is largely Inuit, with a European minority; fishing, hunting, and mining. Capital: Nuuk (GodthÃ¥b). Pop: 57 714 (2013 est). Area: 175 600 sq km (840 000 sq miles). Danish name: Grønland Greenlandic name: Kalaallit Nunaat
Collins English Dictionary – Complete and Unabridged, 12th Edition 2014 © HarperCollins Publishers 1991, 1994, 1998, 2000, 2003, 2006, 2007, 2009, 2011, 2014
Green•land (ˈgrin lənd, -ˌlænd)

n.
a self-governing island belonging to Denmark located NE of North America: the largest island in the world. 58,203; ab. 840,000 sq. mi. (2,175,600 sq. km); over 700,000 sq. mi. (1,800,000 sq. km) icecapped. Cap.: Godthåb.
Green′land•er, n.
Random House Kernerman Webster's College Dictionary, © 2010 K Dictionaries Ltd. Copyright 2005, 1997, 1991 by Random House, Inc. All rights reserved.
ThesaurusAntonymsRelated WordsSynonymsLegend:
 
noco said:
How many times do you want me to give it to you?

Here it is again...If you cannot follow it this time then I will feel sorry for you.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Greenland

Green·land (grēn′lənd, -lănd′)
An island in the northern Atlantic Ocean off northeast Canada. It is the largest island in the world and lies mostly within the Arctic Circle. Settled by the Norse between the 10th and the 15th century and by the Inuit beginning around the 10th century, Greenland became a Danish colony in the 18th century and was granted home rule in 1979. Nuuk (Godthåb) is the capital.
Green·land′ic (-lăn′dĭk) adj.
Word History: How did a glacier-covered island get the name Greenland? In Icelandic sagas written in the 12th century and later, it is told that Eric the Red explored the southeast and southwest coasts of Greenland in ad 983-986. He thought his fellow Icelanders would be more likely to go there if it had an attractive name, and he therefore called it Grænland, Icelandic for "Greenland." This was not exactly a case of false advertising. Greenland was warmer in the 10th century than it is now. There were many islands teeming with birds off its western coast, the sea was excellent for fishing, and the coast of Greenland itself had many fjords where anchorage was good. Moreover, at the head of the fjords there were enormous meadows full of grass, willows, junipers, birch, and wild berries. Icelanders set up colonies in Greenland that thrived for much of the next three hundred years. In the middle of the 14th century, however, the North Atlantic area began to cool significantly. The colonies began to die out, and they finally disappeared at the very beginning of the 15th century. Only the Inuit continued to live on the island as the climate grew progressively colder and the formerly green valleys of Greenland were covered by ice.
American Heritage ® Dictionary of the English Language, Fifth Edition. Copyright © 2011 by Houghton Mifflin Harcourt Publishing Company. Published by Houghton Mifflin Harcourt Publishing Company. All rights reserved.
Greenland (ˈɡriːnlənd)
n
(Placename) a large island, lying mostly within the Arctic Circle off the NE coast of North America: first settled by Icelanders in 986; resettled by Danes from 1721 onwards; integral part of Denmark (1953–79); granted internal autonomy 1979; mostly covered by an icecap up to 3300 m (11 000 ft) thick, with ice-free coastal strips and coastal mountains; the population is largely Inuit, with a European minority; fishing, hunting, and mining. Capital: Nuuk (GodthÃ¥b). Pop: 57 714 (2013 est). Area: 175 600 sq km (840 000 sq miles). Danish name: Grønland Greenlandic name: Kalaallit Nunaat
Collins English Dictionary – Complete and Unabridged, 12th Edition 2014 © HarperCollins Publishers 1991, 1994, 1998, 2000, 2003, 2006, 2007, 2009, 2011, 2014
Green•land (ˈgrin lənd, -ˌlænd)

n.
a self-governing island belonging to Denmark located NE of North America: the largest island in the world. 58,203; ab. 840,000 sq. mi. (2,175,600 sq. km); over 700,000 sq. mi. (1,800,000 sq. km) icecapped. Cap.: Godthåb.
Green′land•er, n.
Random House Kernerman Webster's College Dictionary, © 2010 K Dictionaries Ltd. Copyright 2005, 1997, 1991 by Random House, Inc. All rights reserved.
ThesaurusAntonymsRelated WordsSynonymsLegend:
Click to expand...

Thanks for posting up noco.

The issue here is time. It looks like at the latest 1991, some 25 years ago. An awful lot has changed since then with rising temperatures and the increasing melt has gained huge momentum in Greenland of late. Having said that it is one of tge cooler places atm due to weather stream changes from the changing conditions of warming in other adjacent areas.

Your statement is not conclusive, few of us really know. But if we look at most other areas of the planet it is clear we have an extreme problem.
 
wayneL said:
CSIRO has busted the "river on fire" alarmism in no less a rag than Pravda itself:

http://www.theguardian.com/environm...-mps-video-is-natural-not-fracking-says-csiro

As usual, The Watermelons are more interested in politicking about environmental matters than actual science.:banghead:
Click to expand...

Wow you are now quoting The Guardian on the reporting on environmental issues ! Is that just cos you approve of the story (but still reserve the right to reject any story you don't like )?

Nah you couldn't be that simplistic could you ? :D
 
basilio said:
Wow you are now quoting The Guardian on the reporting on environmental issues ! Is that just cos you approve of the story (but still reserve the right to reject any story you don't like )?

Nah you couldn't be that simplistic could you ? :D
Click to expand...

Is the Guardian a socialistic rag?
 

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