Resisting Climate Hysteria

[moXJO]

I just don't know how you can say that Moxjo. Certainly there are other points of view expressed. But what makes the site stand out is the way it takes each anti global warming argument and compares it against the peer reviewed research and scientific principles. It is at stage that the overwhelming nature of the evidence comes through.

The site is also particularly effective at dissecting the statements of Monchton, Carter, Plimer etc and showing where they have misrepresented papers, made up facts and ignored evidence.

It is all in bite sized chunks as well and written at at least 2 levels so people can read the information at appropriate levels.

It's obviously not true to say we know everything about climate change. But what is understood and so far proven at the moment says we have a critical problem to deal with.

I was talking about some of the comments on that site that argued against some of the evidence.
http://www.skepticalscience.com/news.php?p=2&t=82&&n=18
GMB argues in the comments below and is then demonised by other posters after asking for evidence.

I'm all with climate change and while this has nothing to do with that site.

In 2005, Flannery predicted Sydney's dams could be dry in as little as two years because global warming was drying up the rains, leaving the city "facing extreme difficulties with water".

Check Sydney's dam levels today: 73 per cent. Hmm. Not a good start.

In 2008, Flannery said: "The water problem is so severe for Adelaide that it may run out of water by early 2009."

Check Adelaide's water storage levels today: 77 per cent.

In 2007, Flannery predicted cities such as Brisbane would never again have dam-filling rains, as global warming had caused "a 20 per cent decrease in rainfall in some areas" and made the soil too hot, "so even the rain that falls isn't actually going to fill our dams and river systems ... ".

Check the Murray-Darling system today: in flood. Check Brisbane's dam levels: 100 per cent full.

All this may seem funny, but some politicians, voters and investors have taken this kind of warming alarmism very seriously and made expensive decisions in the belief it was sound.

So let's check on them, too.

In 2007, Flannery predicted global warming would so dry our continent that desalination plants were needed to save three of our biggest cities from disaster.

As he put it: "Over the past 50 years, southern Australia has lost about 20 per cent of its rainfall, and one cause is almost certainly global warming ...

"In Adelaide, Sydney and Brisbane, water supplies are so low they need desalinated water urgently, possibly in as little as 18 months."

straight out BS like this from a government man clouds the issue for many on the severity of Climate change, or even of how predictions will pan out. We have the exact opposite of what he said would happen.

 

[orr]

It's obviously not true to say we know everything about climate change. But what is understood and so far proven at the moment says we have a critical problem to deal with.

Is time here to remind some people of last octobers release of the (conservative)Koch brothers climate science study findings, or is it as unreliable a document as all the others that recommend anything but Business as usual:

The latest global warming results confirm those from earlier, independent studies by scientists at NASA and elsewhere that came under fire from skeptics in an episode known as 'climategate.'
To quote the 'christian science monitor' on the Koch study findings, hardly the bastion of Enviro fasinistas.
Is that the same NASA that Hansen (How are all those Hansen predictions going basilio? ), that Mr wayneL mentions a few posts back.

 

[sails]

This discussion has been a fact free zone for ages now. Wayne and co endlessly repeat untruths in the same way that other groups use when attempting to misguide people. That is what is meant by denier...

Basilio, denier has more to do with the holocaust than the money grab of pricing carbon. Shame on you guys for coining such a derogatory term.

And, no facts? How about this?

LOL - Brisbane has had the coldest summer in TWELVE years.

Read all about it: Brisbane’s coldest summer in 12 years

 

[sails]

And, is carbon tax REALLY about the environment? Not according to Penny Wong:

THE Finance Minister, Penny Wong, has warned that Kevin Rudd's proposal to review the carbon tax after six months with a view to easing the $23-a-tonne starting price could blow a hole in the budget.

Read more: Budget risk in carbon tax review



And this is what Wong USED to say about carbon tax, it makes it look even more that's all about ripping off the workers to pay for wasteful spending:

 

[Knobby22]

Basilio, denier has more to do with the holocaust than the money grab of pricing carbon. Shame on you guys for coining such a derogatory term.

And, no facts? How about this?

LOL - Brisbane has had the coldest summer in TWELVE years.

Read all about it: Brisbane’s coldest summer in 12 years

Sigh, you do know we are in a La Nina weather pattern at present?

 

[explod]

Basilio, denier has more to do with the holocaust than the money grab of pricing carbon. Shame on you guys for coining such a derogatory term.

"Surreal" was the term for a distorted type of painting style, today is is used as "unreal"

"Denier" can be many things but have often noted the denier's love to bring the holocast into the argument.

See all the icebergs stacking up on the banks Macquarie Island on TV last night. The commentator reckoned he had not seen it as bad as that before, but he was just a kid.

 

[Calliope]

LOL - Brisbane has had the coldest summer in TWELVE years.

On the other hand Tasmania is playing its small part in perpetuating the GW myth.

Tasmania had it's third warmest summer on record.

 

[moXJO]

Sigh, you do know we are in a La Nina weather pattern at present?

So why did Climate Change Commissioner Professor Tim Flannery tell us otherwise, didn't he know?
Surely he would have had the latest info from scientific research considering its government funded. Did they all overlook it or was it a scare campaign to get the tax in?

In 2005, Flannery predicted Sydney's dams could be dry in as little as two years because global warming was drying up the rains, leaving the city "facing extreme difficulties with water".

I'm not against the science or even think I know whats going on regarding CC. But it hardly seems an open and shut case that either side makes it out to be.

 

[Julia]

. But it hardly seems an open and shut case that either side makes it out to be.

And this is the fundamental source of all the squabbling. If the case had been presented with less in the way of dire and absolute predictions of the total doom of the world and everyone in it, and a more moderate description of some of the challenges for the future, it's my bet there would have been a more consistently accepting response.

People are rightly distrustful of exaggerated claims.

 

[Calliope]

Sigh, you do know we are in a La Nina weather pattern at present?

Sigh indeed! Why did your political expert on GW say this last year, when he blamed the coal miners for the floods.
The term La Niña refers to the extensive cooling of the central and eastern Pacific.

''There's very little doubt that the burning of fossil fuels is responsible for the hottest oceans we've ever seen off Australia, which in turn the scientists are saying very clearly is responsible for the quite extraordinary and harrowing floods that we've seen,'' Senator Brown said.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/environment/w...er-comments-20110117-19u5f.html#ixzz1nkDEzKHc

 

[Knobby22]

So why did Climate Change Commissioner Professor Tim Flannery tell us otherwise, didn't he know?

I'm not against the science or even think I know whats going on regarding CC. But it hardly seems an open and shut case that either side makes it out to be.

Everyone said he didn't have the right background and they were right, he didn't and so he mucked up.

Its not an open and shut case. There is global warming occurring but also a lot of feedback effects that are slowly being understood. What upsets me is not the doubters or the skeptics, it is the generally paid denialists who operate to a political agenda they have been told to follow to create confusion.

Caliope, one thing that could be expected is greater rainfall in a la nina and we seem to be getting it though scientists will say it is still too early to confirm it. More time is needed. You can't just say there is definitely nothing in it either.

 

[macca]

And this is the fundamental source of all the squabbling. If the case had been presented with less in the way of dire and absolute predictions of the total doom of the world and everyone in it, and a more moderate description of some of the challenges for the future, it's my bet there would have been a more consistently accepting response.

People are rightly distrustful of exaggerated claims.

And the brainwashing of our children, the perpetual pro warming slant of every documentary coming out of BBC and ABC. The fact that unless you make mention of the climate change agenda in your acceptance speech don't expect to be given any award by the govt.

Mention of the climate change in thousands of articles which are absolutely nothing to do with climate or the weather, like water on a rock, it will eventually wear down resistance. Another tactic is spread enough sh** and some of it will stick. Repeat something often enough and eventually the mugs will accept it as fact.

On and on ad nauseum.... disgusting tactic perfected by the communist and totalitarian regimes now being used by the climate change alarmists to refill the trough every week.

 

[wayneL]

This discussion has been a fact free zone for ages now. Wayne and co endlessly repeat untruths in the same way that other groups use when attempting to misguide people. That is what is meant by denier.

It is easy to prove your first two statements are untrue Wayne. Go to any scientific body that researches the whole body evidence around climate change and check it out.

1/ Sorry basilio, I stick by what I say because I look at a broad range of sources of information.

2/ I note you persist with using the offensive term 'denier', to include anyone that does not agree with the worst case 'hypothesis'.

3/ I also note you neatly sidestepped my question re the lifestyle choices of alarmists.

From these three points, one is able to make certain conclusions about you.

 

[explod]

wayneL;687802] I note you persist with using the offensive term 'denier', to include anyone that does not agree with the worst case 'hypothesis'.

Offensive my foot. In public I have been called a pig and scum and I did not bat an eyelid. If you are going to be tough you need to also toughen up

I also note you neatly sidestepped my question re the lifestyle choices of alarmists.

And what have those choices to do with the argument?

From these three points, one is able to make certain conclusions about you.

Conclusions, pray tell, interesting profiling or for the little black book perhaps. Maybe we are going back to the Special Branch days.

 

[MACCA350]

Gee my lawn is loving this global warming, it's never been greener through the last few summers.........oh wait

Cheers

 

[Knobby22]

Gee my lawn is loving this global warming, it's never been greener through the last few summers.........oh wait

Cheers

Yes, I live in Melbourne too, we have had more floods and storms this year than I can remember, you would think we were living in the tropics....oh wait:
cheers

 

[wayneL]

Offensive my foot. In public I have been called a pig and scum and I did not bat an eyelid. If you are going to be tough you need to also toughen up

We are not talking about policing Mr Plod. As a policeman you are also expected to receive abuse and are probably trained for it.

We are talking about a supposedly scientific debate where the goal is to arrive at a considered conclusion. As I have pointed out before, debate in other scientific spheres (eg big bang vs electric universe theory etc) does not attract such loaded labels.

And what have those choices to do with the argument?

Absolutely everything Mr Plod. In the short/medium term, the only way to curb co2 emissions is to curtail our lifestyles.

basilio, along with high profile alarmists all have lifestyles which produce large carbon footprints. I've been preached at about GW by Range Rover driving, stately energy hungry house owning, large family producing, elaborate packaging and consumer society purchasing mamas in what hits you in the face as a gargantuan hypocrisy.

I'm not immune to a bit of environment preaching myself. One of my concerns is the trashing of our oceans by unsustainable fishing practices. Would it be then ok to go and buy some fish harvested by such practices? No! That we make me a tw@t of the highest order.

When Al Bore, Suzuki, Flannery, Hansen et al. turn off the heating, sell their big houses and eschew fossil fueled travel, maybe folks will take them more seriously.

I doubt you live in a paradigm of ecological sustainability from your Mt Martha digs either.

Conclusions, pray tell, interesting profiling or for the little black book perhaps. Maybe we are going back to the Special Branch days.

Oh nice straw man argument there Mr Plod. Is that how you fitted up suspects in your copper days? Pulleeeeze.

Clearly, I am referring to cognitive inconsistencies.

 

[Logique]

Warragamba Dam is expected to fill and spill this week, first time in 14 years. It supplies 80% of Sydney's water supply, and along with the lake it creates, contains 4 times the volume of Sydney Harbour. Largest urban water supply in Australia.

Every megalitre of water from the ($2Bill) Sydney desal plant costs between $700 and $800. A megalitre from Warragamba would be between $100 and $200.

Tim Flannery in 2005:
http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andrewbolt/
ABC Lateline, June 10, 2005:
I’M afraid that the science around climate change is firming up fairly quickly . . . we’ve seen just drought, drought, drought, and particularly regions like Sydney and the Warragamba catchment—if you look at the Warragamba catchment figures, since 98 the water has been in virtual freefall, and they’ve got about two years of supply left . . .

Pic is from The Daily Telegraph:
http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...am-over-the-edge/story-e6freuzi-1226284445265

 

[Knobby22]

In the US

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-03-01/9-killed-in-us-tornadoes/3861352

The deadly storm marks an early start to tornado season in a region still recovering from record-breaking severe weather outbreaks.

Some 545 people were killed by tornadoes in 2011, which was the deadliest tornado season since 1936 and the third-worst on record, according to the National Weather Service.

And in my state

Record rain on the way for Victoria‎

NEWS.com.au - 5 hours ago
RECORD rainfall is forecast for parts of the state as severe weather strikes again - and again. Another 200mm or more could be dumped on Victoria's ...


Go short insurance companies.

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

It is all weather.

Flannery is a fraud.

Even the Sydney Morning Herald cannot deny it is raining.

Where is the Climate Change Drought we were promised.

http://www.smh.com.au/environment/w...d-sends-residents-packing-20120301-1u61h.html

At Cooma, in the Snowy Mountains, almost 1000 people had fled their homes last night. A levee built to only contain a one-in-20-year flood was threatening to burst overnight. A further 600 people had been evacuated in Goulburn (see report page 2) and 100 more in parts of Bega. Water cut roads and isolated 367 people in Towamba near Eden.
By this morning, as much as three-quarters of the state was forecast to be either flooded or isolated by flood.
Cooma was expected to receive a year's worth of rain - about 500 millimetres - inside the first 65 days of this year. The Bureau of Meteorology was forecasting as much as 80 millimetres of rain would fall on metropolitan Sydney in the 12 hours from midnight.


Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/environment/w...nts-packing-20120301-1u61h.html#ixzz1ns8BnslV

And Flannery and his kind are on the public purse.

What a waste of money.

It is all weather.

gg