Where is/can Donald Trump take US (sic)?

[basilio]

Maybe,that will be shown to have been very astute of him, at a later date.
If there is shown to be a residual component, that remains dormant until the immune system is compromised, then surfaces and causes major health issues for those previously infected.
We have mulled that issue since the outbreak began.
But lets just grab the headline.
Let's not think past the headline.
The headline is god.
Let's take the other route, if there is a residual component and it is suspected, then Trump says anyone who gets this, cops a death sentence, later in life. How would that work out.

I don't understand where you are coming from here SP.

Trump was told and accepted on Jan 28th that the COVID 19 virus was very dangerous and very contagious. 10 days later he passes on that view to Bob Woodward. And then he spends the next weeks and months saying "it's a hoax", "it's no worse than the flu", "it will just go away."

He undermined the efforts to prepare the community. He undermined the CDC capacity to respond to the rapid increase in infections and hospitalizations. As a direct consequence of his failure to prepare and respond to this epidemic the US has one of the highest rates of death and infections in the world.

And right now, with the knowledge he has of how dangerous and contagious this disease is, he holds huge public rallies with tens of thousands of people in close contact and few masks.

And this is just one incredibly damning indictment of Trumps Presidency. Rage explores far more than a single headline.

 

[sptrawler]

Sorry, but there is a difference between not wanting to create panic and telling the public the truth so they can take proper precautions.

The virus got away in the US because people thought it was nothing to worry about and therefore didn't change their behaviour to avoid getting it or spreading it.

Another one of Trump's attempts to rewrite his history I'm afraid.

Oh well I guess that is it then.
There are still a hell of a lot of the people in the U.S behaving badly because they still don't believe it, wouldn't it be nice if everyone did as Trump said, then we could stop everyone taking drugs and stop smoking. Just get Trump to make a general announcement, problems solved.

 

[basilio]

Woodward book: Trump says he knew coronavirus was ‘deadly’ and worse than the flu while intentionally misleading Americans

President Trump’s head popped up during his top-secret intelligence briefing in the Oval Office on Jan. 28 when the discussion turned to the coronavirus outbreak in China.

“This will be the biggest national security threat you face in your presidency,” national security adviser Robert C. O’Brien told Trump, according to a new book by Washington Post associate editor Bob Woodward. “This is going to be the roughest thing you face.”

Matthew Pottinger, the deputy national security adviser, agreed. He told the president that after reaching contacts in China, it was evident that the world faced a health emergency on par with the flu pandemic of 1918, which killed an estimated 50 million people worldwide.

Ten days later, Trump called Woodward and revealed that he thought the situation was far more dire than what he had been saying publicly.

“You just breathe the air and that’s how it’s passed,” Trump said in a Feb. 7 call. “And so that’s a very tricky one. That’s a very delicate one. It’s also more deadly than even your strenuous flus.”

“This is deadly stuff,” the president repeated for emphasis.

0:00/0:58
Listen: In a Feb. 7 interview, when asked what Chinese President Xi Jinping told him about the virus, Trump says, “This is deadly stuff.”
At that time, Trump was telling the nation that the virus was no worse than a seasonal flu, predicting it would soon disappear and insisting that the U.S. government had it totally under control. It would be several weeks before he would publicly acknowledge that the virus was no ordinary flu and that it could be transmitted through the air.

Trump and Kim Jong Un

‘We fell in love’: Trump and Kim shower praise, stroke egos on path to nuclear negotiations

Kim welcomed Trump’s overtures with over-the-top prose in letters. Kim wrote that he wanted “another historic meeting between myself and Your Excellency reminiscent of a scene from a fantasy film.” And he said his meetings with Trump were a “precious memory” that underscored how the “deep and special friendship between us will work as a magical force.”

In another letter, Kim wrote to Trump, “I feel pleased to have formed good ties with such a powerful and preeminent statesman as Your Excellency.” And in yet another, Kim reflected on “that moment of history when I firmly held Your Excellency’s hand at the beautiful and sacred location as the whole world watched with great interest and hope to relive the honor of that day.”

Trump and North Korean leader Kim Jong Un in Singapore during their first summit, on June 12, 2018. (Evan Vucci/AP)
Trump was taken with Kim’s flattery, Woodward writes, telling the author pridefully that Kim had addressed him as “Excellency.” Trump remarked that he was awestruck meeting Kim for the first time in 2018 in Singapore, thinking to himself, “Holy ****,” and finding Kim to be “far beyond smart.” Trump also boasted to Woodward that Kim “tells me everything,” including a graphic account of Kim having his uncle killed.

Trump did not share his letters to Kim — “Those are so top secret,” the president said — but Woodward obtained them independently. He writes that Trump sent Kim a copy of the New York Times featuring a picture of the two men on the front page. “Chairman, great picture of you, big time,” Trump wrote on the paper in marker. (Trump falsely boasted to Woodward: “He never smiled before. I’m the only one he smiles with.”)

Trump reflected on his relationships with authoritarian leaders generally, including Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan. “It’s funny, the relationships I have, the tougher and meaner they are, the better I get along with them,” he told Woodward. “You know? Explain that to me someday, okay?”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...Q.LgMt16athn15Ya-8SVycwAGd7goTzF1EZue6iaehqUc

 

[sptrawler]

I don't understand where you are coming from here SP.

Trump was told and accepted on Jan 28th that the COVID 19 virus was very dangerous and very contagious. 10 days later he passes on that view to Bob Woodward. And then he spends the next weeks and months saying "it's a hoax", "it's no worse than the flu", "it will just go away."
.

If you don't understand where I was coming from in my previous post, I will try another approach.

There are a hell of a lot of people who believe that it is no worse than a bad flu and statistically that is right, also the mortality rate is extremely low, so in reality does that make him right or wrong?
Most of the World's leaders have IMO played down the severity of the virus, even our own leaders, the BLM rallies were not banned by our governments at the height of the pandemic, so why isn't that being thrashed to death.
If anything the media is pushing the fact the BLM didn't cause a problem, so how can social contact now be a big issue if it is downplayed when it involved a good cause? How can anybody have any faith in what is spewed forth in the media.

Just trying to put a different viewpoint, to the media's tunnel vision approach.

 

[SirRumpole]

There are still a hell of a lot of the people in the U.S behaving badly because they still don't believe it,

That's exactly the point.

 

[SirRumpole]

If anything the media is pushing the fact the BLM didn't cause a problem,

They are and they are wrong.

The ABC relentlessly bashed McCormack for saying on Q&A that there was a problem with the protests. He eventually backed off under pressure but if people can't have friends over to their house they shouldn't be allowed to gather at protests either.

 

[sptrawler]

That's exactly the point.

So Trump is to blame for them still not behaving badly, after all the media coverage?
Who is responsible for those still breaking the rules in Australia? Trump

 

[SirRumpole]

So Trump is to blame for them still not behaving badly, after all the media coverage?

I would say that the majority of people who think covid is rubbish would be Trump supporters.

Disagree ?

 

[sptrawler]

They are and they are wrong.

The ABC relentlessly bashed McCormack for saying on Q&A that there was a problem with the protests. He eventually backed off under pressure but if people can't have friends over to their house they shouldn't be allowed to gather at protests either.

That is what I'm saying, people have to make decisions for their own conduct, always trying to find someone else to be responsible for your bad decisions, is the way of the World today.
Which is my point regards the BLM rally, if the government didn't take it seriously when at the height of the first shutdown, how can they now expect people to take them seriously with curfews, severe secondary lockdowns etc.
Meanwhile the media, as you say bash someone for saying the rally was wrong, that is mixed messages and completely shooting down any credibility.

 

[sptrawler]

I would say that the majority of people who think covid is rubbish would be Trump supporters.

Disagree ?

I wouldn't have a clue.
I personally really don't want to get it, because I tend to think of the worst and hope for the best, so it wouldn't matter to me what a politician said.

 

[SirRumpole]

That is what I'm saying, people have to make decisions for their own conduct, always trying to find someone else to be responsible for your bad decisions, is the way of the World today.
Which is my point regards the BLM rally, if the government didn't take it seriously then at the height of the first shutdown, how can they now expect people to take them seriously with curfews, severe secondary lockdowns etc.
Meanwhile the media, as you say bash someone for saying the rally was wrong, that is mixed messages and completely shooting down any credibility.

Well I think that the governments did take these rallies seriously. The police ministers, Premiers and police chiefs were out there saying " don't go", but the Lefties ignored it. Here is Andrews saying "don't go".

https://www.sbs.com.au/news/worried...-victorians-to-avoid-black-lives-matter-rally

 

[sptrawler]

Well I think that the governments did take these rallies seriously. The police ministers, Premiers and police chiefs were out there saying " don't go", but the Lefties ignored it. Here is Andrews saying "don't go".

https://www.sbs.com.au/news/worried...-victorians-to-avoid-black-lives-matter-rally

They should have said anyone who goes will be arrested and fined, it was creating a public danger, nuisance and exposing innocent people to the risk of infection, what about the general public going about their rightful business? It was outside the Flinders street station wasn't it?

If it was o.k to do it then, why not now, apparently it didn't cause a problem then and only some were wearing masks?
So who is misleading the public? the press or the politicians?

 

[basilio]

Donald Trump was saying in one breath how deadly and dangerous COVID is (remembering China was in total lockdown to stop its spread at that stage) and then going out and undermining his health officials capacity to deal with an out of control epidemic by saying it was just a flu and people shouldn't be too worried..

As a direct result of this lie tens of thousands of people needlessly lost their lives. The resultant economic fallout has caused trillions of dollars of economic loss and the end is still nowhere in sight.

Social distancing a week earlier could have saved 36,000 American lives, study says

21st May 2020
New research from Columbia University epidemiologists offered one possible answer on Wednesday. If the same kind of social distancing had been in place seven days earlier, their study found, the United States could have prevented 36,000 deaths through early May — about 40 percent of fatalities reported to date.

“If you don’t take steps to fight the growth rate aggressively, you get much worse consequences,” Jeffrey Shaman, an environmental health sciences professor who led the study, told The Washington Post.

His team’s analysis used infectious-disease modeling to examine the spread of the virus from March 15, when many people nationwide began staying home, until May 3. The researchers examined transmissions within each county, movement between counties and deaths to chart how the virus spread — and killed — over seven weeks.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nati...0.Atv8g_QTyhpQ_zYLREHgSikW943VbLQpzMO5k_CaIBU

 

[basilio]

Still more examples of an administration that creates its own alternative facts to back up a President who only likes his reality.

Trump loyalists interfered to downplay Russia election threat – whistleblower
Brian Murphy claims he was demoted for refusing to accept fabrication of intelligence to match Donald Trump’s rhetoric

Trump in February with Chad Wolf, the acting homeland security chief. Wolf reportedly told Murphy his Russia assessment should be ‘held … [because it] made the president look bad’. Photograph: Kevin Lamarque/Reuters
Julian Borger in Washington
Wed 9 Sep 2020 17.31 EDT

Last modified on Wed 9 Sep 2020 21.48 EDT


535
Trump loyalists running the Department of Homeland Security manipulated intelligence reports to play down the threat of Russian election interference and white supremacists and exaggerate the threat of antifa and anarchist groups, according to the department’s former top intelligence official.

The official, Brian Murphy, said he was demoted in August from his position running the department’s office of intelligence and analysis because of his refusal to go along with the fabrication of intelligence to match Donald Trump’s rhetoric, and for making formal complaints about the political pressure. He filed a whistleblower reprisal complaint on Tuesday.

Murphy was transferred to a DHS management position after his team was found to have collected information on reporters and protesters in Portland, Oregon. In his complaint, he claims the office “never knowingly or deliberately collected information on journalists, at least as far as Mr Murphy is aware or ever authorized”, and he described the reporting as “significantly flawed”.

He insists the real reason for his transfer was his refusal to manipulate vital intelligence on national security.

Murphy alleges that the efforts to falsify DHS intelligence date back to 2018, when the then homeland security secretary, Kirstjen Nielsen, asked his office to inflate the numbers of known or suspected terrorists crossing the border with Mexico, in support of Trump’s demand for a border wall.

Murphy says the intelligence identified three such terrorist cases. In December 2018, Nielsen told the House judiciary committee there were 3,755.

According to Murphy’s testimony, Nielsen and her successor, Chad Wolf, continued to exaggerate the terrorist threat at the border in 2019, while being aware of the real figures.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/sep/09/trump-whistleblower-russia-election-threat

 

[IFocus]

If any other leader in the western world acted or failed to act like Trump re COVID they would be gone, its simply the mess of US politics and failure / cowardice of the Republicans to deal with the issue.

 

[moXJO]

If any other leader in the western world acted or failed to act like Trump re COVID they would be gone, its simply the mess of US politics and failure / cowardice of the Republicans to deal with the issue.

Umm perhaps you just weren't really paying attention to other world leaders then.

Obama failed so hard that Russia and China pulled ahead. Bush and Obama caused wars and untold deaths and were constantly disregarding other countries rights. Bush, Obama, and Clinton setup and mishandled the gfc with more lies and lost money.
Where do you stop with any past President, let alone world leader. Their failures would be to long to list.

Trump farts and you know about it. He has been the most scrutinised leader ever.

This week its " Trump and coronavirus".
Trump talking smack about the military fell apart after lightly picking at it.

 

[sptrawler]

If any other leader in the western world acted or failed to act like Trump re COVID they would be gone, its simply the mess of US politics and failure / cowardice of the Republicans to deal with the issue.

Funny at a local macro level Barnett was $hat on for the Fiona Stanley hospital, the Victoria Quay, the new Princess Margaret hospital, the Joondalup health campus, the Midland health campus, the Northern Hwy link to Muchea, the Optus Stadium, the failed James Price Point gas hub, criticised for objecting to the gst distribution formulae.
In hind sight he wasnt that silly, as you have agreed, I think Trump is under the very same media pressure Barney was, just a 100 times bigger media gorilla.
Just my opinion, I think they could convince everyone Jesus banged in his own nails IMO.

 

[IFocus]

Gents.....read the post again

"If any other leader in the western world acted or failed to act like Trump re COVID they would be gone, its simply the mess of US politics and failure / cowardice of the Republicans to deal with the issue."

If the Australia PM carried on like Trump he would be gone, look at Abbott no where near Trumps level but still heading that way, 2 years gone.

Seriously only place in the world that would vote for Trump the leader you cannot afford in a crisis is the US and the place is either dying, burning or shooting each other what a mess......oh hang on Hillary would have been worse

 

[sptrawler]

Gents.....read the post again

"If any other leader in the western world acted or failed to act like Trump re COVID they would be gone, its simply the mess of US politics and failure / cowardice of the Republicans to deal with the issue."

If the Australia PM carried on like Trump he would be gone, look at Abbott no where near Trumps level but still heading that way, 2 years gone.

Seriously only place in the world that would vote for Trump the leader you cannot afford in a crisis is the US and the place is either dying, burning or shooting each other what a mess......oh hang on Hillary would have been worse

Well that was delusional, Abbott called out the sad state of welfare, was slaged off at by a media seeking lawyer and given a forum by a lunatic media.
But yes it did work, he is still carrying the scars, as was proven last week and the attention seeker is still riding the wave.
But who cares as long as it wins.
I guess you have to take the wins, when you get them, there isnt many.
Look at Bill, media behind him bookies paying out before the election, then boom both feet gone.

 

[moXJO]

Gents.....read the post again

"If any other leader in the western world acted or failed to act like Trump re COVID they would be gone, its simply the mess of US politics and failure / cowardice of the Republicans to deal with the issue."

If the Australia PM carried on like Trump he would be gone, look at Abbott no where near Trumps level but still heading that way, 2 years gone.

Seriously only place in the world that would vote for Trump the leader you cannot afford in a crisis is the US and the place is either dying, burning or shooting each other what a mess......oh hang on Hillary would have been worse

Made up media stories don't really count.
US is 11th on the list for deaths per million. I'm yet to hear any of you whinge about the other ten.

Considering its democrat cities burning, then yes Hillary would have been worse. The stain of the Democrats was smeared across to many agencies and departments.

Its been a couple of years of "gotchya" moments that never came.