Wellington Capital PIF/Octaviar (MFS) PIF

[Rocky1]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

I have just spoken to a group manager RE: obtaining a copy of the registrar. She informed me that any request has to be in writing and in accordance with the Corporations Act. She also informed me that they have 45 days to respond to this request and that the cost is approximately $14,000

It also became apparent to me during our conversation that they are aware of this thread. It also became obvious to me that employees are more nervous about talking to investors as I kept hearing "I can't comment on that" and "we only know what the investors know".

 

[seamisty]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

OK Rocky. How many more PIF holders or no of units do you need? I think it would be a good idea if you lliase with breaker 1. I know there was a lot of PIF holders showing interest elsewhere on similar issues who would possibly make contact if you posted your intentions. Tuart could you help us out please. If there is 770 million units in the fund did you or someone else say that we would only need X amount of representation of units themselves rather than 100 investors? Rather than advertising in the papers in my opinion you would get more response from holders via a media release in an article pertaining to our intentions with a mention of share forums for contact details. Quite often other papers will pick up the the momentum if they think there is public interest. Does anyone have any media contacts/connections or there is always TV programmes looking for human interest stories. Other thoughts opinions welcome. Cheers, Seamisty

 

[Rocky1]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Seamisty, Basically as I understand, from what Breaker has posted we need 100 holders or people holding 5% of units (38,500,000), so if we can source some people holding a large number of units we will get the number of unit holders much quicker.

I think a media release of some sort would be a good idea, plus I think we just form a committee, which I am happy to be part of and devote time too and get the ball rolling.

In terms of posting our plan of attack to attract people, others need to start communicating what they would hope to achieve through a committee and the questions they would want answered at a general meeting

I am hoping to talk to breaker personally via phone ASAP to see if we can get the ball rolling. Whilst this thread is good I believe the time has come for some action and personal communication

 

[Tuart]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Seamisty

I have communicated with Javier who is away for a week.

I personally think getting the 100 is an easier road to follow.

You guys need to start the PIF action group, get some press and get your numbers.

Get a plan in terms of keeping RE or finding an alternative.

There was 25 parties interested last time in taking management control so I am sure more than a few will be on your door once you gather some momentum, get an address and committee.

 

[breaker1]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Seamisty

I have communicated with Javier who is away for a week.

I personally think getting the 100 is an easier road to follow.

You guys need to start the PIF action group, get some press and get your numbers.

Get a plan in terms of keeping RE or finding an alternative.

There was 25 parties interested last time in taking management control so I am sure more than a few will be on your door once you gather some momentum, get an address and committee.

Tuart,
Do you know of any specific party, of the "25 parties" you mentioned. My initial concern is, would they be any better than Wellington Capital?

OPIF & WC management should note: this is what happens when you don't accept investors into major decision making processes, keeping investors in the dark till any decision is made - especially when they divert away from our original PDF understandings.

 

[seamisty]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Thanks Tuart,We just need some interested people to respond with numbers and support who are willing to put their hands up and put forth their concerns that they feel need adressing and help correlate 'The Plan'. I have e-mailed a few others I know who are PIF holders. If everyone does the same and with some media coverage, I would think it in the best interest of ALL holders to come foward. Hopefully in the next few days we can get a specific e-mail adress which can be posted on other forums to stir up more support. There is already two adresses on this thread asking for interested people. adam.thorn@optusnet.com.au / and I think breaker1 had one posted as well. Cheers, Seamisty

 

[Tuart]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Breaker

I know of one of the parties and thought their offer and approach was solid and made sense. Their approach was better as they actually have access to bring additional funds in.

From things I have read in the press I would imagine Challenger would have been another party whpo put their hand up given existing OCV debt.

Once you have a committee you can go through that vetting process but the key decision I guess re Wellington Capital is that a few weeks ago they were Chris Scotts advisor in getting him on board OCV.

CS is a major shareholder of OCV and OCV is trying to negotiate through its various demands from creditors including the 50 million guarantee to PIF.

Question will WC be sufficiently independent to do a deal for interests of PIF holders ahead of OCV shareholders when dealing with OCV.

In many ways we are flying blind here in terms of the PIF position and what is required to get all of your money back.

 

[breaker1]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

UPDATE 3

Dear investors,

Just to advise - I now keep the contact details of 12 OPIF investors on a file. I know that doesn't sound like a lot, but we are now enough to be a jury folks. Heh! Heh! But hey! this idea was only started just under 3 weeks ago. I have had several of our group, say they will get onto others they know in the OPIF and get them to contact me. I'd say conservatively that this accounts for possibly more than $3 million in PIF dollar investment.

Those of you, who emailed me, know that I am keeping in contact with you not only via this forum but more personally by email and occasionally by phone. If in any way, those committed are feeling left out or want to do something, let me know.

Rocky1 is going for a small press release in a moderate media outlet shortly - hope it gets printed. we worked out a basic wording, which rocky will edit, refine and add too. Good on ya mate - will speak to you tomorrow.

We agreed that using my contact email: breaker1@aapt.net.au in any article would be best, in order to keep the data base of people putting their hand up to join us, central and not confusing. This will allow group email efficiency and accurate collation. (off course individual emails to those still wishing to remain private, will remain private and clearly marked private).

Any investors reading this forum and haven't joined us - send me an email (as above) or register on aussiestockforums and contribute, preferably both. Now matter how humbly - remember your communication, thoughs, insight, knowledge and encouragement are greatly appreciated. This group is encouraging me, because everyone has put their hand up to do something. If you have an idea you think you can do, that will help, let me know! Everyone, has got different talents on here, thats the first thing I have found out.

Give yourselves a pat on the back folks - were actually getting organised and doing something!

P.S. Is it just me or do you find that this forum freezes occasionally and it stops you from typing for 10 seconds at a time in the reply box - let me know?

 

[Tuart]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Breaker

Javier is away for a week and he will be keen to join. That makes 13.

Did you get a chance to put your email address on hot copper. Dont mention this forum just say you have formed the PIF action group so you dont get pinged for advertising another forum. All those who join list I am sure will find there way here ultimately if interested.

As mentioned before I have a few friends stuck in it so I will track them down and they will contact you direct.

 

[DoraNBoots]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Hi All,

In addition to increasing the action group's numbers to a point where we can demand a general meeting, should we also look at arranging a voluntary meeting with the OPIF responsible entity right now?

If we can find out who these people are (members of the Octaviar Investment Management Board I assume), gather their professional (and personal) contact details then make a concerted effort under the 'PIF Action Group' banner to contact them and get an audience. I think that some general contact details may already exist on this thread however I could not find any reference to the OCVIM board members on the OCV website.

In addition to information on assets within the fund, I think we would want to obtain a copy of the fund's constitution including a history of any ammendments to it. Also, receiving the OPIF responsible entity meeting's agenda (before the meeting) and minutes (after the meeting) are essential for keeping investors informed of any developments or board resolutions. Having this agenda would give us an opportunity for input into proceedings.

Sincerely,

 

[Javier]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Hi all, will be back Saturday, just quickly, Jenny H left me a nsg on my mobile with her direct number. Will be able to contact her Tuesday. Please send me all relevant questions you would like me to ask. Primarily I will stress the need for an immediate address to investors via meetings arranged by WC on the current situation financially of the fund, what plan exists to start distributions, what the dist % will be, what is the plan to start the redemption process, how long it will take to pull out our money and how long it will take and if there is a plan to maximise the fund to realise the maximum value of our assets. Tuart your thoughts and should I mention that there is growing momentum for a possible change in RE. I will talk to you on my return to draft pertinent questions and about the PIF trying to get some sort of holding in LLA. I rep 2 investor ID's and personally know 2 others, so add 4 signatures.

 

[Duped]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Action Group - If they are not already on board, perhaps contact the Hobbs brothers and the adimistrator for the bowls club as mention in breaker1's post #64. There's 1.2M units.

Am pressed for time at the moment, can anyone put together a list of board members of MFS Ltd, LLA, MFSIM, WC and Perpetual Nominees Ltd? If anyone has any IT skills, perhaps we can set up a website and keep this info in one place and up to date.

JH is on the board of WC and MFSIM right? Well that really worries me. She sold PIFs GPM shares sale for 25.5 cents (+ 40% of capital gains thereabove) and they haven't traded under 32 cents since. (I don't hold out any hope for the 40%. Show me the money. What's stopping Trojan selling to a related entity when the share price is down? Goodbye any CG. Its the MFS way.) She's quoted as saying '100 per cent sure history is going to show the judgement was right' (goldcoast.com 16 May 08). Well the evidence is to the contrary for the moment.

Oh and don't forget the planned 2.225c per share distribution planned for the 1/4 ending June 30. Have set up a little reminder to check up on that.

Lets make something very clear JH, you're not paid to be right, your paid to maximise returns to the investors. That is your duty, your obligation.

 

[Tuart]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Javier

I hope you are trying to have some form of holiday but know that when you have stuff going on like this its hard to turn off.

I am trying to understand the OCV guarantee.

Do they guarantee up to $50 million in capital losses and unpaid interest or is it just interest.

An important question is how is the conflict on this to be managed between RE and parent and the added complication of having WC having acted as financial advisor to Chris Scott.

I am sure that WC would be aware of this thread and I see no harm in putting her on notice. I contacted the person who I knew had lodged an Expression of Interest with OCV and have introduced the idea that they back a replacement RE.

THis is why a committee is needed as WC will be selling you on them being the right group for the job, the group I know will be pushing their barrow and I am sure there will be other parties clambering to have the opportunity.

Ultimately the workout and the party chosen for the workout must be the one capable of maximising the return to investors and capable of restoring returns and protecting investors interests.

This decision should be made by investors and all conflicts put on the table.

I think you have the questions covered but would add why given existing OCV staff, Korda Mentha and I am sure RBOS all having the position of the fund pretty well placed does it need WC such a long period to present position.

The number of loans is not huge.

Take an hour per position
- whats the loan
- do they need more funds to finish project
- are they paying interest
- what is exit strategy and estimated timing

Put it all in a spreadsheet and thats are fairly good guide to position.

The staff and KM would be on top of all of this information as RBOS would have been screaming for it.

Question - what was the nature of the mess JH supposedly found and then get the right to get agreement or not with key management staff. It is the lack of transparency that is the issue and you do not want to be fobbed off with the same answers to date.

Cheers

 

[Rocky1]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Should we be concerned that WC will take up it's option to be the RE (its my understanding that they are not yet the RE) before the August??? deadline before we can get enough numbers to force a GM

Media release calling for investor interest in "Action Group" should be tomorrow

 

[Tuart]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Rocky

If you remove the RE the option is meaniless as its major asset the management of the PIF will be gone.

 

[breaker1]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Action Group - If they are not already on board, perhaps contact the Hobbs brothers and the adimistrator for the bowls club as mention in breaker1's post #64. There's 1.2M units.

Already done - spoke to the Hobbs family two days ago and will again tonight!Emailed bowls club days ago - no response as yet!

 

[breaker1]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

The Sydney Morning Herald
CITY PACIFIC has suffered another blow in investor confidence, after the Brisbane property group's development spin-off conceded it was headed for a full-year loss and its largest unlisted mortgage fund delayed the payment of iThe latest update on CP1's troubles is expected to exacerbate worries among the Mortgage Fund's unit holders.

Despite City Pacific announcing on Monday that a deadline on a $240 million loan repayment had been extended to July 31, several unit holders told the Herald yesterday that they were yet to receive their monthly distribution. They said they were informed they would get their monthly distribution by the end of this week, about four days late.

Of the $240 million, the First Mortgage Fund has repaid only $60 million. It is unclear how much of this was funded by the US financial group Fortress's recent $100 million injection into the fund.ts monthly distribution.

Sounds familiar doesn't it. Well your not going to believe this, but my dad and I got our money out of City Pacific, just two weeks before they froze investor funds - pheww!. And look at who is the vulture again, Fortress - I know I'm being conspiratorial, but, are these vultures in collusion. No! No! I'm just being silly.

 

[Rocky1]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Octaviar action group pushes for extraordinary meeting



Anthony Klan | June 05, 2008

INVESTORS in the frozen $770 million Octaviar Premium Income Fund have formed an action group that plans to attack the company's alleged lack of disclosure and could push for the appointment of a new manager to the troubled scheme.

One of the action group's founders, Adam Thorn, who has $250,000 invested in the scheme, said the Octaviar/MFS PIF Action Group would seek to call an extraordinary general meeting to address investor concerns.

"We don't think Octaviar has been completely transparent with investors and there are a lot of questions we want answered," Mr Thorn said yesterday.

He said the action group had been formed by Octaviar PIF investors who had met through Aussie Stock Forums, a share market chat website.

The 11,000 investors in Octaviar PIF -- which lends money to property developers -- have been unable to recover their investments in the fund since January, when the redemption facility was frozen.

Mr Thorn said the group had about a dozen members, who had invested amounts ranging from $10,000 to $2 million with Octaviar PIF. But he expected that number to grow quickly with many investors frustrated with the direction of the struggling company.

"To call an extraordinary general meeting, we need 5 per cent of the unitholders or 100 investors," Mr Thorn said.

He said the group expected to meet that requirement, given the strong response it had received from investors.

Octaviar was known as the MFS Premium Income Fund until March, when the MFS family of companies changed its name to Octaviar following the spectacular debt-related share-price meltdown of the company's listed arms in January.

Mr Thorn said the Octaviar/MFS PIF Action Group was concerned about scheme's poor disclosure and its perceived failure to keep investors fully informed of the state of the group.

"Many people are disgruntled with the fund's disclosure, including its initial failure to disclose $186 million of debt to the Bank of Scotland," he said. "We want to know how they are reducing that debt.

"Is there a risk of a fire sale of our assets?"

Octaviar executives did not return repeated calls from The Australian yesterday.

Mr Thorn said the action group was also concerned about a proposed deal to sell the management rights of Octaviar PIF to Wellington Capital.

The managing director of Wellington Capital is Jennifer Hutson, who was appointed as director of Octaviar investment management -- the manager of Octaviar PIF -- in early May.

Ms Hutson is a close business associate of Octaviar chief executive Chris Scott, with both acting as directors of Gold Coast-based management rights company S8 before it was taken over by MFS in 2006.

Mr Thorn said the investors group could challenge Wellington's move to take control of Octaviar PIF.

 

[seamisty]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Well done Rocky and Breaker!!! Lets hope we get a response. Cheers, Seamisty

 

[akernst]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Hi Rocky1,

I have a large investment in the PIF, and wish to join any group in getting our money ASAP.

Andree Ernst


Anthony Klan | June 05, 2008

INVESTORS in the frozen $770 million Octaviar Premium Income Fund have formed an action group that plans to attack the company's alleged lack of disclosure and could push for the appointment of a new manager to the troubled scheme.

One of the action group's founders, Adam Thorn, who has $250,000 invested in the scheme, said the Octaviar/MFS PIF Action Group would seek to call an extraordinary general meeting to address investor concerns.

"We don't think Octaviar has been completely transparent with investors and there are a lot of questions we want answered," Mr Thorn said yesterday.

He said the action group had been formed by Octaviar PIF investors who had met through Aussie Stock Forums, a share market chat website.

The 11,000 investors in Octaviar PIF -- which lends money to property developers -- have been unable to recover their investments in the fund since January, when the redemption facility was frozen.

Mr Thorn said the group had about a dozen members, who had invested amounts ranging from $10,000 to $2 million with Octaviar PIF. But he expected that number to grow quickly with many investors frustrated with the direction of the struggling company.

"To call an extraordinary general meeting, we need 5 per cent of the unitholders or 100 investors," Mr Thorn said.

He said the group expected to meet that requirement, given the strong response it had received from investors.

Octaviar was known as the MFS Premium Income Fund until March, when the MFS family of companies changed its name to Octaviar following the spectacular debt-related share-price meltdown of the company's listed arms in January.

Mr Thorn said the Octaviar/MFS PIF Action Group was concerned about scheme's poor disclosure and its perceived failure to keep investors fully informed of the state of the group.

"Many people are disgruntled with the fund's disclosure, including its initial failure to disclose $186 million of debt to the Bank of Scotland," he said. "We want to know how they are reducing that debt.

"Is there a risk of a fire sale of our assets?"

Octaviar executives did not return repeated calls from The Australian yesterday.

Mr Thorn said the action group was also concerned about a proposed deal to sell the management rights of Octaviar PIF to Wellington Capital.

The managing director of Wellington Capital is Jennifer Hutson, who was appointed as director of Octaviar investment management -- the manager of Octaviar PIF -- in early May.

Ms Hutson is a close business associate of Octaviar chief executive Chris Scott, with both acting as directors of Gold Coast-based management rights company S8 before it was taken over by MFS in 2006.

Mr Thorn said the investors group could challenge Wellington's move to take control of Octaviar PIF.[/QUOTE]