Wellington Capital PIF/Octaviar (MFS) PIF

[flatback]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

That is nots Burnts job to do that Thats for your friends a WC to do that //////

great dame you and i have locked horns a few times over the last few months for many and varied reasons( of which i will not retract)but upon this issue you are quite right, it is the responsibility of the RE to inform all unit holders of any changes to payments to us or not, ive said it before, we need you at times to lighten our load with your eloquent prose.cheers Flatback

 

[Burnt]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Burnt to some extent i agree, my answer to you is, yes we may have the unfortunate misrepresentation by WC on this account, but who are you having a go at ,is it WC Rance or me, because the documentation on this forum clearly states that what i had said was quite true, we gain nothing from having people shafting each other without having the proof to back up what we say, what you said was right, at this point in time yes it is trivial to bring this up to a degree , but the point was made to highlight a problem we are having with our RE, for no other reason, so again Rance (you cant see the forest for the trees )Flatback

Hi Flatback,

I am in no way having a go at you (or Rance for that matter).
I think it's great to read your recent posts pointing out the deficiencies in WC's management and communication skills (or lack thereof). We are the ones that suffer as a consequence (I don't care how many tears they pretend to shed).
Just trying to point out another example of deceptive behaviour on the part of WC.
Cheers

 

[seamisty]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Does WC deserve to cop that much flack as a direct result of making a tough decision where they put the ongoing interest of the PIF before their own right to management fees and reputation by liquidating assets in the current financial climate to get access to some quick cash? Or is this not a concern to those that would have taken the risk of receiving 14cents in the dollar and liquidate the fund? I have noticed an absence of units for sale in this price range, the closest being 10,217 @15cents.The former board at MFS who created this mess should be hiring bodyguards do you think? Or are some saving the blame for the current board? Who would want to be on an advisory committee where they had to deal with abuse, ridicule and disbelief from a few other unitholders when they tried to share their information? Until such times as there is what I consider a better alternative to who controls the future of my investment in the PIF, I will continue to support the ONLY option available at the present time. If some of you don't like my posts, put me on ignore please, or would you prefer to slam me every time I share my own ideas/opinions and pass on information?Or do you just take the opportunity to use my posts to further discredit WC and the AG?
Seamisty

 

[seamisty]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

1.4 Investor Advisory Committee
The establishment of a three person Investor Advisory Committee is being proposed by Wellington.
The purpose of the Investor Advisory Committee is to ensure Investor input into the decision making
process of the Fund into the future. The Investor Advisory Committee will meet directly with the
responsible entity through formal meetings and other communications.
The Investor Advisory Committee will comprise three democratically elected Unitholders.
Unitholders wishing to nominate themselves or another Unitholders for election to
the Investor Advisory Committee, should complete the nomination details at the
bottom of the Proxy Form.
Once the nominations are received all Investors will receive information on those
nominated individuals and will be able to vote to elect the three members of the
Investor Advisory Committee later in 2008.

 

[danger danger]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Everyone is so stressed out, and just think, this is merely the beginning of a very long journey to come. I fear that even if WC does get our $1 per unit back in our pockets in the years to come, many unfortunately will not be able to enjoy it as they may have either suffered cardiac arrest or a fatal aneurysm by then!

Take a deep breath, and chill. This is a long ride, so pace yourself now, or you may not reach the finish line.

 

[flatback]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Does WC deserve to cop that much flack as a direct result of making a tough decision where they put the ongoing interest of the PIF before their own right to management fees and reputation by liquidating assets in the current financial climate to get access to some quick cash? Or is this not a concern to those that would have taken the risk of receiving 14cents in the dollar and liquidate the fund? I have noticed an absence of units for sale in this price range, the closest being 10,217 @15cents.The former board at MFS who created this mess should be hiring bodyguards do you think? Or are some saving the blame for the current board? Who would want to be on an advisory committee where they had to deal with abuse, ridicule and disbelief from a few other unitholders when they tried to share their information? Until such times as there is what I consider a better alternative to who controls the future of my investment in the PIF, I will continue to support the ONLY option available at the present time. If some of you don't like my posts, put me on ignore please, or would you prefer to slam me every time I share my own ideas/opinions and pass on information?Or do you just take the opportunity to use my posts to further discredit WC and the AG?
Seamisty

Seamisty again, get this, you were the person who openly put people on your list of ignore, actually skited about it ( i might add to me was degrading as you appeared to put yourself on a pedestal) where your views were better than anybody elses, i hope you have learnt from this, and you realise we are all in the same boat, thank you for your support with some others in regard to the appointment of AG members to WC advisory Committee,
Now we dont know if it will be excepted or not, or what power these people may have, but as i understand it the offer was made and i feel we should appoint the right people for the job ( i really dont care if some on this forum believe it or not ) and by the way get over it Dora was right about computershare Flatback

 

[seamisty]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Seamisty again, get this, you were the person who openly put people on your list of ignore, actually skited about it ( i might add to me was degrading as you appeared to put yourself on a pedestal) where your views were better than anybody elses, i hope you have learnt from this, and you realise we are all in the same boat, thank you for your support with some others in regard to the appointment of AG members to WC advisory Committee,
Now we dont know if it will be excepted or not, or what power these people may have, but as i understand it the offer was made and i feel we should appoint the right people for the job ( i really dont care if some on this forum believe it or not ) and by the way get over it Dora was right about computershare Flatback

Thats right Flatback,rather than respond negatively or abuse some I disagreed with, I chose to ignore some, unlike a few others. The issue regarding computershare was not who was right or wrong but who took the initiative to try and correct the content of the information given, not inflame anti WC sentiment. It is all very well to draw attention to mistakes, but in recognising those mistakes, it is of no advantage to unit holders in the PIF to use it as a tool to discredit our fund. The current economic market does not need help in pushing our assets down by a few disgruntled investors. Get over it. Seamisty

 

[Rance]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

I believe that this "Advisory Committee" is just another stunt to instill confidence in unit holders, when in fact it will be a useless, powerless group of people that will be hand picked by JH to serve themselves.
I know of one unit holder that was personally approached to join this committee. He declined because his belief (as is mine) is that unit holders would be best empowered by having at least two unit holders (elected by unit holders) given positions on the board of directors of WC. Why shouldn't we have this kind of real power. It is our money that these inept people are making decisions about.
!

Well Flatback,
Here it is: from Burnt "...belief (as is mine) is that unit holders would be best empowered by having at least two unit holders (elected by unit holders) given positions on the board of directors of WC."

I see nothing wrong with Burnt's belief (which is obviously your belief as well), in fact i'd support it BUT JH didn't say it and up till now (and probably beyond) doesn't appear to want or support the idea of the Advisory Committee being appointed to the RE Board. Get it!

Thank you Seamisty for quoting 1.4, page 20 of the Explanatory Memorandum issued in connection with the first scheduled (and then cancelled) meeting of PIF unit holders of 18 Sept 2008. I've been out having a meal with my grandchildren at Maccers. My accountant told me today I'll probably be having more meals at Maccers from here on!

Rance

 

[Burnt]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Dear Seamisty,

The only information supplied by WC as to this "Advisory Committee" is that it's purpose "is to ensure investor input into the decision making process of the Fund". By what process is the investor input "assured".
What were the July investor forums about ? JH gave no acknowledgement to the input given by investors at these forums in the choices they were given to vote on.
Again I ask, what is this committees responsibilities, what power will it be given if it opposes anything proposed by the board of WC, what are its liabilities if unit holders object to this committees so called input ?

WC deserves every bit of flack given to it. They made promises and commitments to unit holders designed to get them to vote in favour of the resolutions that only WC put forward and that only WC would benefit by.

On the 15th October, WC knew that the October distributions would not happen, but they still kept promising. If they didn't know at that time that the cash flow would not allow it, then obviously they are extremely incompetent in the role they have been given. (and I mean BEEN GIVEN).

These promises and commitments now all seem to amount to nothing just 2 weeks after the vote. If they cannot foresee any definate possibility of cash distributions (as stated in their Information Memorandum dated 18th Aug.), then it seems very likely that the "buy-back" scheme is another shallow promise made by them to swing votes.

You keep going on about "the only other alternative was liquidation resulting in a 14c/unit payout to unit holders". This is absolutely untrue, in fact a blatant lie. You continue to push the same deceptive and misleading information generated by WC. You are using the same methods of fear and intimidation used by WC - how do you think this might benefit unit holders - telling the same old lies for the purpose of enforcing submission.

Definately agree, previous MFS directors are responsible for placing the PIF in the position it was left in earlier this year - why is the current RE not doing anything about it. An independant administrator or receiver would !

As far as I am concerned, the whole idea of this "advisory committee" should be scrapped because in reality it will be totally useless and powerless, full of people like yourself who will just reinforce the deceptive, non-disclosing, misinformation that underlies all of WC's actions.

You are entitled to give your support to WC if your true beliefs lie there, but don't expect everyone to follow you and don't take personal offence when facts are presented that contradict whatever information has been given to you by WC to pass on. Perhaps you should take a good look at the position you have been put in.

 

[seamisty]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Well Flatback,
Here it is: from Burnt "...belief (as is mine) is that unit holders would be best empowered by having at least two unit holders (elected by unit holders) given positions on the board of directors of WC."

I see nothing wrong with Burnt's belief (which is obviously your belief as well), in fact i'd support it BUT JH didn't say it and up till now (and probably beyond) doesn't appear to want or support the idea of the Advisory Committee being appointed to the RE Board. Get it!

Thank you Seamisty for quoting 1.4, page 20 of the Explanatory Memorandum issued in connection with the first scheduled (and then cancelled) meeting of PIF unit holders of 18 Sept 2008. I've been out having a meal with my grandchildren at Maccers. My accountant told me today I'll probably be having more meals at Maccers from here on!

Rance

Could you please give me the name of your accountant Rance? I met with mine yesterday and he told me that we had done a great job previously in building up our empire, but to continue in the lifestyle we had become accustomed to, I had to sharpen my scissors and my husband had to check and see if his gumboots still fit LOL!!!
Seamisty

 

[flatback]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Well Flatback,
Here it is: from Burnt "...belief (as is mine) is that unit holders would be best empowered by having at least two unit holders (elected by unit holders) given positions on the board of directors of WC."

I see nothing wrong with Burnt's belief (which is obviously your belief as well), in fact i'd support it BUT JH didn't say it and up till now (and probably beyond) doesn't appear to want or support the idea of the Advisory Committee being appointed to the RE Board. Get it!

Thank you Seamisty for quoting 1.4, page 20 of the Explanatory Memorandum issued in connection with the first scheduled (and then cancelled) meeting of PIF unit holders of 18 Sept 2008. I've been out having a meal with my grandchildren at Maccers. My accountant told me today I'll probably be having more meals at Maccers from here on!

Rance

Rance what is the question here, it appears that you agree to disagree, and as for your upherism( get it )if you spent more time trying to look at positives and not eating Maccas which will not help the grey matter at your age, why can you not except that there are people working to fix our problem.Now go and have your icecream. cheers Flatback

 

[Rance]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

"Rance get this and get it from somebody who does not like to be misrepresented by the likes of you or anybody else on this forum"

Sorry about the plagiarism, but I got the "get it" from you (see above)! Get it! Imitation is the highest form of flattery so please feel flatter. Now, I'm off to bed. Goodnight all until tomorrow.

Rance :sleeping:

 

[DoraNBoots]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

The issue regarding computershare was not who was right or wrong but who took the initiative to try and correct the content of the information given, not inflame anti WC sentiment. It is all very well to draw attention to mistakes, but in recognising those mistakes, it is of no advantage to unit holders in the PIF to use it as a tool to discredit our fund. ...

Do tell us Seamisty - Who took the initative to correct the information that ComputerShare had on it's records. It wasn't WC it's wasn't you. If you still don't know then answer keep reading....

...
BTW: Computershare have on their records a Record Date of 17th Oct 2008 for a cash payment due on 31st Oct of 3 cents per share. This they say is "set in stone". I told them WC are thinking this might be late and I don't think it's going to be 3 cents and they said that's very unusual and they don't think that has happened before. Seems like WC have some work to do, do they ever get anything right?
....

ComputerShare are still telling investors this morning there will be a 3 cent per unit payment tomorrow. Why WC wouldn't make it a priority to fix this is beyond me. After referring a ComputerShare manager to the 28th Oct Investor Update he said they would fix this is their system (although it might take a few days). This should have been done by WC!

 

[seamisty]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Do tell us Seamisty - Who took the initative to correct the information that ComputerShare had on it's records. It wasn't WC it's wasn't you. If you still don't know then answer keep reading....

Good work dora, you may have my pedestal and crown! (get yourself a cushion though, it is not very comfortable and I do not want it back)Cheers, Seamisty

 

[DoraNBoots]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

...you may have my pedestal and crown! ...

No thanks, you can keep them. I’m not good with heights and the crown was WAY too big

 

[Rance]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

If computershare aren't in the loop on such an important issue (our 1.5 + 1.5 payments before christmas) then how in gods name are the three representatives from our group ( who are supposedly going to be appointed to WC board to look after our interests) going to do their job Flatback

G'day All
Another day, so back to the fray!

Flatback, I'm not agreeing to disagree with you. I'm pointing out that your statement that the three representatives are (quote) supposedly going to be appointed to the WC board (unquote) is not factual. JH has not suggested they are going to be appointed to the WC board. But your statement could lead some people to believe that she did say that! That's how misinformation and rumours start.

On another matter (not directed at you Flatback), there has been a lot of postings backward and forward to the effect that JH had not informed the NSX that the 3 cent distribution this year has been shelved. But the fact is, she did inform the NSX on Tuesday Oct 28 in an official notification. The fact that NSX telephone enquiry officers were not aware of this is not her problem. The fact that WC telephone enquiry officers were not aware of it, IS her problem!

Let me make this clear: I am not defending nor opposing JH/WC (Yes, I'm sitting on the fence) although I believe she needs more time to settle matters particularly in the current financial crisis. But I do see red with postings that attribute to her matters that she has not said nor commited to. I'll give give her six months from Nov 1 and judge her by what she has said; what she has commited to; and by what she has achieved to heal our wounds.

Rance

 

[JohnH]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

G'day All
Another day, so back to the fray!


Let me make this clear: I am not defending nor opposing JH/WC (Yes, I'm sitting on the fence) although I believe she needs more time to settle matters particularly in the current financial crisis. But I do see red with postings that attribute to her matters that she has not said nor commited to. I'll give give her six months from Nov 1 and judge her by what she has said; what she has commited to; and by what she has achieved to heal our wounds.

Rance

Thanks Rance. Nice to see a bit of balance for a change.:thankyou:

 

[DoraNBoots]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

...
On another matter (not directed at you Flatback), there has been a lot of postings backward and forward to the effect that JH had not informed the NSX that the 3 cent distribution this year has been shelved. But the fact is, she did inform the NSX on Tuesday Oct 28 in an official notification. The fact that NSX telephone enquiry officers were not aware of this is not her problem. The fact that WC telephone enquiry officers were not aware of it, IS her problem!
...

None one has said the NSX were not aware of the Oct 28 announcement. What was said was the NSX were not notified that any payments were to be made, which to me says WC were never sure enough of being about to make the payment. A payment can't be made if WC do not notify the NSX of the x div or Record Date.

In the future if there is to be a payment the NSX must be notified first. It is against the law for WC to tell people like Seamisty before telling the NSX.

 

[seamisty]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

None one has said the NSX were not aware of the Oct 28 announcement. What was said was the NSX were not notified that any payments were to be made, which to me says WC were never sure enough of being about to make the payment. A payment can't be made if WC do not notify the NSX of the x div or Record Date.

In the future if there is to be a payment the NSX must be notified first. It is against the law for WC to tell people like Seamisty before telling the NSX.

I was notified AFTER the announcement was posted on the NSX Dora, I was reading the announcement when I received the phone call. Seamisty

 

[DoraNBoots]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

I was notified AFTER the announcement was posted on the NSX Dora, I was reading the announcement when I received the phone call. Seamisty

Yes, I'm aware you thought there would be a payment right up till Oct 28. What I'm saying is if WC are telling people now any details of a future payment then they are breaking the law. Any info of this kind which would influence the market must go to the NSX first were everyone can be notified at the same time (too bad for the majority of unit holders who aren't on the Internet).

It will be good once WC grasp the concept of disclosure. It will cut down on so much of the misinformation coming out of that company (and on to this forum.)