Trainee prop trading options, prep, credibility in Australia - Outsider Research

[skc]

Amazing that they are actually making an effort to reach out to people then giving the standard BS that alot companies give you.

Still setting up etc

If I wanted to get into prop trading, I would call them up and offer my service for free to help help them set up. Depending on what skills I have, I could help them put website together, take photos, choose IT equipment, connect phones, shift boxes, assemble office furniture, buy coffee and tea etc etc.

See if I can find the opportunity to build some rapport, show my passion for trading etc... I think that might give me a better chance than getting picked out of hundreds of applicants, especially if I have nothing particularly outstanding to offer on the trading front.

 

[CanOz]

WA is a great time zone for Europe. My bet is these guys will be more directional than spreads and they'll be Europe and US product focused, sounds like a different model to the usual Australian model of bums on seats for rebates....

 

[OmegaTrader]

Gezz Omega. You have a prop setting up right on your doorstep which being in WA is a massive bit of luck and you seem about as keen as someone who is about to get root canal work!! From my reading as far as standing out and getting the 1 in 500 position you're lacking any sort of enthusiasm. Weighed up against the rest how do you think that will slide?

Where have I lacked enthusiasm? You have a bias against me and misinterpret my posts and cynical jokes )


I have already applied straight away. I was probably one of the first to actually interview. I am not a genius or incredible in anyway. I am just being realistic and not BS myself and others. I am at a point in my life where commitments will not stop from putting in the hours and lack of income. When I say armchair I mean metaphorical as in armchair investor/commentator and getting off the sidelines. NOT Armchair as in something to do just to pass the time.

3-4 out of 500 odd as you say is not a good probability but I still put in 100%. I know in soccer all the time the guy is faster than me, so I stand back a bit to compensate - if I match him the whole game I will be dead by half time.

I felt being honest is better than I am all passionate and alpha male etc. I thought that would be see through.

If I wanted to get into prop trading, I would call them up and offer my service for free to help help them set up. Depending on what skills I have, I could help them put website together, take photos, choose IT equipment, connect phones, shift boxes, assemble office furniture, buy coffee and tea etc etc.

See if I can find the opportunity to build some rapport, show my passion for trading etc... I think that might give me a better chance than getting picked out of hundreds of applicants, especially if I have nothing particularly outstanding to offer on the trading front.

I thought about that but then I thought it would backfire, like when someone serving you says hi how are you or have a good one. But you can tell they are not genuine. But then again it works for some people.

WA is a great time zone for Europe. My bet is these guys will be more directional than spreads and they'll be Europe and US product focused, sounds like a different model to the usual Australian model of bums on seats for rebates....

The focus will be on Eurex/in Europe, time frame WA would be 2pm-11pm. Then people would branch out from there, that is the plan I heard.

 

[rb250660]

...sounds like a different model to the usual Australian model of bums on seats for rebates....

I thought this is how these places operate. If you're break even or better you're perfect for the job. Ther traders interests and the prop shops interests are very different.

 

[CanOz]

I thought this is how these places operate. If you're break even or better you're perfect for the job. Ther traders interests and the prop shops interests are very different.

My point being the job of being a liquidity provider was taking precedence over developing traders with strategies to generate superior returns....indeed rewarding better for some shops.

 

[Trembling Hand]

Where have I lacked enthusiasm? You have a bias against me and misinterpret my posts and cynical

Ok cool. Have you listen to that chat with traders pod cast?

 

[joselopezde]

Do you know any prop firm that pays a salary to its trainees?

 

[CanOz]

Do you know any prop firm that pays a salary to its trainees?

Unheard of, take up a weekend job.

 

[Rocket130713]

Unheard of, take up a weekend job.

Hello, does anyone know who "Star Beta" prop trading firm use as their "clearing firm" for futures trades? Which clearing firm does Star Beta clear through? I know that Propex and Genesis both clear through ABN Amro bank. Does Star Beta also "clear through" ABN Amro bank, for futures trading? Thanks in advance. Would really appreciate any help on this question. Kind regards, Rocket

 

[CanOz]

Also ABN

 

[OmegaTrader]

Ok cool. Have you listen to that chat with traders pod cast?

Yeah a couple of times. It has just cemented what I have stated. Really really honest. Really applicable to Australia. Really good.

+ Made train rides alot better.

Verbatim Darren reed: "I have just recorded an interview with chat with traders it is a really good resource about traders talking honestly. Look at it etc"

With other interviews ... then looks like a big resource. I have never even heard of it before. Actually once I think.


Again I think to myself do I regret not being more aggressive/alpha. One side yes, one side better to be honest and not get tripped up.

This is the only chance bar going over east or track record later on.

I normally don't mind dental work. The dentist gives me plenty of anaesthetic and I have a good sleep.

Unlike others in the family who refuse it.

ahaha

Do you know any prop firm that pays a salary to its trainees?

Unheard of, take up a weekend job.

lol hahaha

This is what will be doing to fund future trading loses

 

[Trembling Hand]

Omega even if ya don't get a go first time there are other ways in. I imagine after the initial rush there is still plenty of ways to impress. If you get an interview find out what they want to see you do and then do it, stay in contact and have another shot 6 months on.

 

[fiftyeight]

How did I miss this???

Writing my "Stand out from the crowd" application now

 

[OmegaTrader]

Omega even if ya don't get a go first time there are other ways in. I imagine after the initial rush there is still plenty of ways to impress. If you get an interview find out what they want to see you do and then do it, stay in contact and have another shot 6 months on.

Yeah

I think that is the way it will go.

I already had interview. I don't think I got it.

From what I heard-for the training program, they prefer someone who hasn't traded, has no responsibility, can sustain not working for 1-2 years at least and is of competitive nature.

I don't know how many people will work 2pm-11pm. Even in the best case scenario, For a year or so and not have an income. Then another year until profit split becomes economical. At Least.


I think a lot of people just apply without actually thinking about the actual job they are applying for.

 

[Quant]

Yeah

I think that is the way it will go.

I already had interview. I don't think I got it.

From what I heard-for the training program, they prefer someone who hasn't traded, has no responsibility, can sustain not working for 1-2 years at least and is of competitive nature.

I don't know how many people will work 2pm-11pm. Even in the best case scenario, For a year or so and not have an income. Then another year until profit split becomes economical. At Least.


I think a lot of people just apply without actually thinking about the actual job they are applying for.

Seriously who would want this position ?

 

[minwa]

I don't know how many people will work 2pm-11pm. Even in the best case scenario, For a year or so and not have an income. Then another year until profit split becomes economical. At Least.

I think a lot of people just apply without actually thinking about the actual job they are applying for.

Wrong mentality. Learning how to trade is not work or job.

 

[ThingyMajiggy]

I don't know how many people will work 2pm-11pm. Even in the best case scenario, For a year or so and not have an income. Then another year until profit split becomes economical. At Least.

Seriously who would want this position ?

I'm a little surprised by these comments, if you really wanted to trade futures as a professional, you would jump at this chance. I'm basically on night shift so I can trade those hours on purpose, it's all I'm working towards. For the benefits of being in a pretty decent new prop environment(going by how it sounds on his CWT interview and what he wants to achieve) and have them backing you, their guidance and their training, there's nothing better in the trading world.

You either want it or you don't. To achieve anything you want to achieve you have to go through the **** first, as if they're going to pay a trainee prop guy when he's literally not doing anything for the firm, you get paid when you start making them money. You're not doing them a service by sitting there using their resources, you're costing them money to begin with so it makes sense you don't get paid while training.

 

[OmegaTrader]

Wrong mentality. Learning how to trade is not work or job.

What mentality that is the truth.
For people who have commitments they have to be realistic. Dad I'm hungry... Sorry Kids you cant eat because trading is different.

Alot of people would be put off by that aspect and that is exactly what they would think, I am not saying that is my mindset.

Seriously who would want this position ?

someone who hasn't traded, has no responsibility, can sustain not working for 1-2 years at least and is of competitive nature.

You go to uni for 3 years and pay around $30,000. HEX debt -one of the only non bankrupt-able debts. WTF is that worth . FA. Everyone has a degree now but it is socially acceptable.

Of course you have to make sure that if you commit the prop is not just flogging courses or taking advantage of people.

1) How long would it take for a retail trader to be consistently profitable
2)How is it different to what a retail trader would have to do anyway, learning curve will be shorter 99% of the time
3) The capital conundrum. You need money to make money. I have money why work, just retire and take it easy, I don't have money, then trading is not economically viable, might as well work a stable job

 

[OmegaTrader]

I'm a little surprised by these comments, if you really wanted to trade futures as a professional, you would jump at this chance. I'm basically on night shift so I can trade those hours on purpose, it's all I'm working towards. For the benefits of being in a pretty decent new prop environment(going by how it sounds on his CWT interview and what he wants to achieve) and have them backing you, their guidance and their training, there's nothing better in the trading world.

You either want it or you don't. To achieve anything you want to achieve you have to go through the **** first, as if they're going to pay a trainee prop guy when he's literally not doing anything for the firm, you get paid when you start making them money. You're not doing them a service by sitting there using their resources, you're costing them money to begin with so it makes sense you don't get paid while training.

Seriously who would want this position ?

Please Don't lump me in with other people and distort my words.

I reiterate, THAT IS NOT MY OPINION

I am simply presenting what people with commitments would prob think.

I am not one of those people.

 

[Quant]

I'm a little surprised by these comments, if you really wanted to trade futures as a professional, you would jump at this chance

Well survival comes to mind as a con , roof and food isn't free , and the fact they want non traders so the chances of making a return in the short term are remote .

"" From what I heard-for the training program, they prefer someone who hasn't traded, has no responsibility, can sustain not working for 1-2 years at least and is of competitive nature. ""

I don't know the details but I'm assuming the account you start trading will be so small it may as well be demo , id suggest these guys are risking very little to start with and you the " applicant " risks most , I don't see the appeal myself but we are all different . I see prop shops as churn and burn , its all good if you make it but the alternative is'nt very appealling to me . I suppose if you are broke and are in low paying employment its an option . I'd love to know the stats on success% and returns over x periods . My assumptions may well be way of base and I might be the naïve one here . But anyway it's just an opinion and worth what it cost