The Voice

[IFocus]

I really like that article Ifocus. Stan Grant nails it and I think he had Lydia Thorpe in mind when he wrote it.

He may have but I have seen it within communities fairly often SP would have likely to have also.


Not many if anyone has lived a life like Stan Grant and has had the reporting / writing experience to his level so his insights are interesting IMHO.

 

[mullokintyre]

its interesting that someone like Stan Grant gets kudos for his writings, but Jacinta Price does not.
Grant lived in Asia for 14 years, now lives and moves in the academic circles in Victoria and NSW.
Jacinta Price has lived all her life in NT, particularly Alice Springs.
It probably makes her less qualified to report on the international relations between Australia and South East Asia, but probably a little more qualified to speak on the trials and tribulations on the NT locals living on country.
Mick

 

[Knobby22]

its interesting that someone like Stan Grant gets kudos for his writings, but Jacinta Price does not.
Grant lived in Asia for 14 years, now lives and moves in the academic circles in Victoria and NSW.
Jacinta Price has lived all her life in NT, particularly Alice Springs.
It probably makes her less qualified to report on the international relations between Australia and South East Asia, but probably a little more qualified to speak on the trials and tribulations on the NT locals living on country.
Mick

Post what she wrote.

 

[wayneL]

Post what she wrote.

I've posted a couple of her writings further up in the thread. She gets called names that no indigenous person on the left ever has to tolerate.

 

[wayneL]

Jacinta's latest message:

Week one and the ‘yes’ campaign is off to a rocky start.

Marcia Langton, high-profile activist and boss of the committee that invented the Voice, accidentally let slip the part they’ve all worked so hard to keep hidden.

They want the Voice to have the right to take the government to the High Court of Australia if it’s not listened to.

Get a load of this as reported by the Fair Australia campaign:

Langton was asked if she thought there were legitimate concerns that if the government made a decision without listening to the Voice, it “could be challenged in the High Court and potentially stopped from being implemented until the Voice had been heard”.

Langton’s response?

“That’s a possibility. And why wouldn’t we want that to be the case,” she said.

“The Voice has to be able to give advice. If nothing that the Voice says is subject to the ordinary laws of Australia, in other words, it’s completely gutted and has no safe standing, if you like, then the government can ignore all of the Voice’s decisions with impunity.”

She said the quiet part out loud.

They don’t want the Voice to be just another “advisory body”.

It won’t be just another symbolic, “modest” gesture to give Indigenous Australians a Voice.

Make no mistake about what this is, it’s a dangerous threat designed to undermine your democracy.

It’s an exclusive, race-based body holding the government ransom as it says “listen to us … or we’ll see you in court”.

It’s another Canberra gravy train for activist elites like Langton, with a huge cost to the Australian taxpayer.

A Voice to Parliament with teeth, capable of bringing government to a standstill if it doesn’t get its way.

“And why wouldn’t we want that to be the case?” says Langton.

This isn’t modest, symbolic or right.

It’s dangerous, divisive and expensive.

It’s not fair, it’s not Australian, it's not on.

It’s a ‘NO!’ from me.

 

[mullokintyre]

Post what she wrote.

Well, perhaps her Maiden Speech to Parliament , or perhaps her Spectator Essay, perhaps her article in the Quarterly magazine Meanjin
or maybe the foreword she wrote in the book Beyond Belief .
I will let anyone interested acess and read them.
I will refrain from posting excerpts, some of them are too long.
Mick

 

[Knobby22]

Well, perhaps her Maiden Speech to Parliament , or perhaps her Spectator Essay, perhaps her article in the Quarterly magazine Meanjin
or maybe the foreword she wrote in the book Beyond Belief .
I will let anyone interested acess and read them.
I will refrain from posting excerpts, some of them are too long.
Mick

I read the Spectator essay as I expect that she would want to have a cogent argument.
Besides the bit where she keeps her audience happy by bagging Labor PMs ( but Hawke does OK interestingly and no Libs are mentioned) she makes some good points.

The Voice doesn't go far enough.
Recognition is more about virtue signalling and making the left feel good.
The Voice should be legislation not enshrined in the Constitution as it creates two classes of people and should be tested to see if it works.
The Voice could lead to a pointless beauracracy.

Good arguments.

 

[Logique2]

He may have but I have seen it within communities fairly often SP would have likely to have also.

Not many if anyone has lived a life like Stan Grant and has had the reporting / writing experience to his level so his insights are interesting IMHO.

Still waiting on Stan's live cross from Alice Springs, Ceduna, Townsville or Fitzroy Crossing.

 

[Logique2]

If the Voice is such a good idea, then why doesn't the ALP/Greens government just legislate it tomorrow? They have the parliamentary numbers.

Answer, they want it in the Constitution, because the next step will be..

..Red and IF need to tell us, what is the going rate on a Treaty, i.e.
- what levied rental on farmers to farm their land ..this cost would passed on to supermarket shoppers
- what percentage of taxpayers gross earnings, will be mandatory as reparations ..1% ?

Lidia Thorpe has given the game away. Little wonder the Greens Party gave her the boot. At least she is honest.

 

[Sean K]

Still waiting on Stan's live cross from Alice Springs, Ceduna, Townsville or Fitzroy Crossing.

Has anyone noticed that Stan Grant has got much browner over the years? Would love to see a real picture of him 20 years ago compared to today.

Maybe these photos are doctored.

 

[sptrawler]

The great thing I am finding about this thread is, the issues the aboriginals face are being debated and it seriously is a huge issue.
Intergenerational abject poverty is unacceptable in a country as affluent as Australia, the reality is that throwing morsels of political humility and money at the problem wont fix it IMO.
Many things have been tried and all have failed, it isn't a money issue, it is a lack of a structure, that gives the aboriginal kids a reason to not just stay as welfare recipients for life.
They have to be given a formal structure of education that leads to active meaningful work, that contributes to an improvement in their and their communities welfare.
That IMO doesn't mean enshrining anything, it means focusing the children's whole education and upbringing in these communities, so that they are more focused on hands on skills, rather than academic skills.
Teach the kids something that they can go home and improve the quality of life of those who live in the house, then as their skills and sense of achievement improve, their sense of worth does and the attraction of sniffing, drinking and drugs is reduced.
Those in Canberra are too busy trying to make aboriginals special and not understanding they aren't, we are so busy trying to mould them like us when they may not want to be, so when we fail the next best thing is to apologies louder and label them as special.
Meanwhile there are others that can see a buck to be made, so they are making the cause look like a money grab, which to some it no doubt is.
It's time PC was replaced by honest appraisal IMO.
Maybe Albo, Dutton, Bant could actually allocate maybe two weeks every three months, to spend an extended time in one of the trouble areas and experience life there, then tell everyone how to suck eggs.
If you sent Albo to Wiluna for two weeks, then next two weeks send Adam to Kununurra, then next two weeks send Dutton to Carnarvon for two weeks, they might have a modicum of understanding.
It isn't as though we miss any of them when they are jetting all over the flckn world talking $hit for weeks on end, maybe spending a reasonable amount of time in some of Australia's problem spots, might actually help those who pay their wages rather than give them a photo shoot for the look at me scrap book. ? ? ?

 

[Knobby22]

Jacinta's latest message:

Week one and the ‘yes’ campaign is off to a rocky start.

Marcia Langton, high-profile activist and boss of the committee that invented the Voice, accidentally let slip the part they’ve all worked so hard to keep hidden.

They want the Voice to have the right to take the government to the High Court of Australia if it’s not listened to.

Get a load of this as reported by the Fair Australia campaign:

Langton was asked if she thought there were legitimate concerns that if the government made a decision without listening to the Voice, it “could be challenged in the High Court and potentially stopped from being implemented until the Voice had been heard”.

Langton’s response?

“That’s a possibility. And why wouldn’t we want that to be the case,” she said.

“The Voice has to be able to give advice. If nothing that the Voice says is subject to the ordinary laws of Australia, in other words, it’s completely gutted and has no safe standing, if you like, then the government can ignore all of the Voice’s decisions with impunity.”

She said the quiet part out loud.

They don’t want the Voice to be just another “advisory body”.

It won’t be just another symbolic, “modest” gesture to give Indigenous Australians a Voice.

Make no mistake about what this is, it’s a dangerous threat designed to undermine your democracy.

It’s an exclusive, race-based body holding the government ransom as it says “listen to us … or we’ll see you in court”.

It’s another Canberra gravy train for activist elites like Langton, with a huge cost to the Australian taxpayer.

A Voice to Parliament with teeth, capable of bringing government to a standstill if it doesn’t get its way.

“And why wouldn’t we want that to be the case?” says Langton.

This isn’t modest, symbolic or right.

It’s dangerous, divisive and expensive.

It’s not fair, it’s not Australian, it's not on.

It’s a ‘NO!’ from me.

What she wants isn't what she will get.
It's going to be clear. It is only a chance to put a point of view.Marcia and others are radicals which is why they will be against the final wording of the voice. The Government has made it abundantly clear.

 

[wayneL]

What she wants isn't what she will get.
It's going to be clear. It is only a chance to put a point of view. Jacinta is a radical.

WTF? Radical? She is among the most milk toast in the Aboriginal community. How can we have a discussion about Lidia Thorpe above and then say Price is radical?

You want to reexamine what that word actually means

 

[Knobby22]

WTF? Radical? She is among the most milk toast in the Aboriginal community. How can we have a discussion about Lidia Thorpe above and then say Price is radical?

You want to reexamine what that word actually means

Corrected it. I realised straight away.

 

[Knobby22]

Corrected it. I realised straight away.

Anyway as Thorpe etc. will not get their way they will attempt to blow it up. If it doesn't happen then it will probably be the end of everything else they want.
Cutting your nose off to spite your face. Politics is about compromise.

....which is why Stan Grant's article was so well written. If it's about hate then....

 

[Sean K]

The great thing I am finding about this thread is, the issues the aboriginals face are being debated and it seriously is a huge issue.
Intergenerational abject poverty is unacceptable in a country as affluent as Australia, the reality is that throwing morsels of political humility and money at the problem wont fix it IMO.
Many things have been tried and all have failed, it isn't a money issue, it is a lack of a structure, that gives the aboriginal kids a reason to not just stay as welfare recipients for life.
They have to be given a formal structure of education that leads to active meaningful work, that contributes to an improvement in their and their communities welfare.
That IMO doesn't mean enshrining anything, it means focusing the children's whole education and upbringing in these communities, so that they are more focused on hands on skills, rather than academic skills.
Teach the kids something that they can go home and improve the quality of life of those who live in the house, then as their skills and sense of achievement improve, their sense of worth does and the attraction of sniffing, drinking and drugs is reduced.
Those in Canberra are too busy trying to make aboriginals special and not understanding they aren't, we are so busy trying to mould them like us when they may not want to be, so when we fail the next best thing is to apologies louder and label them as special.
Meanwhile there are others that can see a buck to be made, so they are making the cause look like a money grab, which to some it no doubt is.
It's time PC was replaced by honest appraisal IMO.
Maybe Albo, Dutton, Bant could actually allocate maybe two weeks every three months, to spend an extended time in one of the trouble areas and experience life there, then tell everyone how to suck eggs.
If you sent Albo to Wiluna for two weeks, then next two weeks send Adam to Kununurra, then next two weeks send Dutton to Carnarvon for two weeks, they might have a modicum of understanding.
It isn't as though we miss any of them when they are jetting all over the flckn world talking $hit for weeks on end, maybe spending a reasonable amount of time in some of Australia's problem spots, might actually help those who pay their wages rather than give them a photo shoot for the look at me scrap book. ? ? ?

Nice rant sp.

We have failed in accelerating the transition from cave dweller to city hippy.

 

[sptrawler]

Nice rant sp.

We have failed in accelerating the transition from cave dweller to city hippy.

There is no way that will ever happen, why would anyone want to get into the hamster wheel, if they can live a relaxed and enjoyable life in the outback.
The only ones who want to get in the hamster wheel are all the stressed up honkies, wanting to get a bigger house and flasher car than their neighbour, but are trying not to get the ulcer, the stress related hives and the wife that is constantly pizzed that he is always angry and wondering why she is with him. ?

 

[IFocus]

Geeezuss not feeling the love here for Stand Grant.

Thorpe is an activist, Price a right wing politician, Grant long time journalist as a Aboriginal in white fella world and spent time in Asia.

I would put it that Thorpe and Price have agendas' Grant is an observer.

BTW does it really matter how dark Grants skin FFS...really?

 

[Sean K]

BTW does it really matter how dark Grants skin FFS...really?

Yes. Especially if he's been painting himself. Really, that's not a problem? FFS!

 

[mullokintyre]

Yes. Especially if he's been painting himself. Really, that's not a problem? FFS!

My Daughtersand her friends spent years painting themselves.
Spray tans, eyeliner, lipstick, foundation cream, blush, hair colouring.
Some of them at least grew out of it.
Mick