The state of the economy at the street level

[Value Collector]

True vs systematic ongoing help for city people poors and addicts
And a lot of Aboriginal communities included in rural population or pensioners moving out for cheaper rent
Not the same people as the ones buying in Noosa or Byron hinterland or are Mr Wayne customers in WA?

I think there is a lot of on going systemic help for both Rural and city people alike when it comes human problems like addiction, health, education, unemployment etc. I think its flawed thinking to assume that those sorts of issues only affect the weak little city folk and not the big strong country folk.

But the comment I made was in regards to whether owning a little rural estate can insulate you from the worlds troubles, and its true to some extent it can insulate you against some economic turmoil provided you own it debt free, but so can owning a city property. As I pointed out though while you might enjoy the economic insulation afforded by a rural estate, the Natural disasters might more than offset that. Bushfires and droughts tend to occur more frequently than economic disasters that would cause a stoppage in economic activity that would cause city folk to starve.

 

[Dona Ferentes]

Lack of services . Here there and everywhere.

This town's hospital soon won't have a single doctor, and residents don't know what they're going to do

As yet another Tasmanian community loses its local GP, a group of senior citizens calls for more incentives for young doctors willing to work in rural areas.

www.abc.net.au

 

[Value Collector]

Farmers can actual receive financial support from the government, not many other businesses get that kind of support.

https://www.servicesaustralia.gov.au/farm-household-allowance

 

[Value Collector]

Lack of services . Here there and everywhere.

This town's hospital soon won't have a single doctor, and residents don't know what they're going to do

As yet another Tasmanian community loses its local GP, a group of senior citizens calls for more incentives for young doctors willing to work in rural areas.

www.abc.net.au

Yep, so that is another argument against the rural estate being a great place to shelter from economic disaster, if folks in the rural areas have a heart attack, they rely on a flying doctor to get them to the city. thats quite a bit of cash support in that alone, that might not be there if the city folk doing the fund raising can't afford to support it anymore.

 

[divs4ever]

Yep, so that is another argument against the rural estate being a great place to shelter from economic disaster, if folks in the rural areas have a heart attack, they rely on a flying doctor to get them to the city. thats quite a bit of cash support in that alone, that might not be there if the city folk doing the fund raising can't afford to support it anymore.

just as well i still have my books on herbalism then , maybe i should check for online acupuncture course as well .

hmmm , might have to check the local river ( to the semi-rural property ) for willow-trees as well ( good luck relying on the phone signal down there )

 

[qldfrog]

Farmers can actual receive financial support from the government, not many other businesses get that kind of support.

https://www.servicesaustralia.gov.au/farm-household-allowance

You mean such as Qantas??

 

[Craton]

Yep, so that is another argument against the rural estate being a great place to shelter from economic disaster, if folks in the rural areas have a heart attack, they rely on a flying doctor to get them to the city. thats quite a bit of cash support in that alone, that might not be there if the city folk doing the fund raising can't afford to support it anymore.

That "mantle of safety" called the RFDS has always been my number one charity.
A lot of support comes from the communities the RFDS service plus, from major companies especially those with FIFO crews.

 

[Value Collector]

That "mantle of safety" called the RFDS has always been my number one charity.
A lot of support comes from the communities the RFDS service plus, from major companies especially those with FIFO crews.

Yep, its one of my charities too, along with Ronald McDonald house, I have had family west of the blue mountains rely on both.

 

[Value Collector]

You mean such as Qantas??

The farm household Allowance is a permanent feature, not just a once in a century response to a global pandemic, no such luck if you are a small cafe owner or own any other small or medium business and fall on hard times. Australia seems to have a soft spot for farmers, more so than any other businessmen.

But I mainly brought up the farm household allowance because of the suggestion that living on some agricultural land some how insulated you from economic trouble, which is obviously doesn't unless all these farmers crying poor are taking us for a ride.

 

[Craton]

The farm household Allowance is a permanent feature, not just a once in a century response to a global pandemic, no such luck if you are a small cafe owner or own any other small or medium business and fall on hard times. Australia seems to have a soft spot for farmers, more so than any other businessmen.

But I mainly brought up the farm household allowance because of the suggestion that living on some agricultural land some how insulated you from economic trouble, which is obviously doesn't unless all these farmers crying poor are taking us for a ride.

The allowance mentioned would be to safe guard primary production surely?

 

[wayneL]

Just FYI gents. The wayneL Ponderosa is exactly 27km from the CBD by road, so best of both worlds (even if I do avoid the 'burbs as much as possible)

 

[Value Collector]

The allowance mentioned would be to safe guard primary production surely?

Why single out farmers? why not afford the same protection to the truck drivers? or bakers? or fishermen? green grocers? mechanics? etc etc.

I know we all like to put farmers on a pedestal in Australia, but they fact is they are just one part of a complete system/supply chain of businesses that we all rely on.

In fact the main people that benefit from the farming allowance are the small, under capitalised and inefficient farmers, Allowing them to go bankrupt or move on might be good for the system as their farms will probably be amalgamated into the larger operations that can sustain themselves through the ups and downs.

It seems harsh to say "let them go bankrupt", but we treat all other small businesses like that.

 

[SirRumpole]

Why single out farmers? why not afford the same protection to the truck drivers? or bakers? or fishermen? green grocers? mechanics? etc etc.

I know we all like to put farmers on a pedestal in Australia, but they fact is they are just one part of a complete system/supply chain of businesses that we all rely on.

In fact the main people that benefit from the farming allowance are the small, under capitalised and inefficient farmers, Allowing them to go bankrupt or move on might be good for the system as their farms will probably be amalgamated into the larger operations that can sustain themselves through the ups and downs.

It seems harsh to say "let them go bankrupt", but we treat all other small businesses like that.

Well, people have to eat, and I'd rather a few barristers lose their jobs than the food supply is reduced.

 

[Craton]

Why single out farmers? why not afford the same protection to the truck drivers? or bakers? or fishermen? green grocers? mechanics? etc etc.

I know we all like to put farmers on a pedestal in Australia, but they fact is they are just one part of a complete system/supply chain of businesses that we all rely on.

In fact the main people that benefit from the farming allowance are the small, under capitalised and inefficient farmers, Allowing them to go bankrupt or move on might be good for the system as their farms will probably be amalgamated into the larger operations that can sustain themselves through the ups and downs.

It seems harsh to say "let them go bankrupt", but we treat all other small businesses like that.

I hear what you're saying and understand but without the primary producers there'd be no jobs for a lot us and most would starve.
BTW according to the ATO fishermen are Primary Producers too.

I do see your point though.

 

[Value Collector]

Well, people have to eat,

So they will need Truckers, Bakers, Mechanics, etc etc, as. I said why single out farmers.

Allowing a few small, undercapitalised farming businesses to fail won't affect the food supply, just like letting a few small bakeries go bust won't affect the supply of bread. In fact it might even increase production as the land is passed on to the more efficient well capitalised producers.

 

[Value Collector]

I hear what you're saying and understand but without the primary producers there'd be no jobs for a lot us and most would starve.
BTW according to the ATO fishermen are Primary Producers too.

I do see your point though.

As I said to Rum pole above, There would still be a lot of primary production and farming happening, it just wouldn't be by the little inefficient guys.

Yes fishermen are primary producers as are miners, but neither qualify for the farm household allowance.

 

[Value Collector]

I am sure Dave here is a great guy, and I hope his tomato growing business does well, and he makes some money.




But, if Dave ever ends up getting into the situation where he can only keep his tomato farming running if he gets a fortnightly payment from the government, then I think he should sell his farm to a larger business that can invest the capital required to make a go of it, and employ more people such as the example Below.

Hell Dave can probably even get a job with the corporate farmer he sold out to and recieve a regular stress free pay check with super benefits and holiday pay.

 

[SirRumpole]

So they will need Truckers, Bakers, Mechanics, etc etc, as. I said why single out farmers.

Allowing a few small, undercapitalised farming businesses to fail won't affect the food supply, just like letting a few small bakeries go bust won't affect the supply of bread. In fact it might even increase production as the land is passed on to the more efficient well capitalised producers.

Just because someone is affected by natural disasters doesn't mean they are inefficient, they have probably been producing for decades until a temporary situation catches up with them.

 

[wayneL]

Let's apply the same rules to financial institutions and other "too-big-to-fail" companies.

Seriously I would be in that.

 

[Value Collector]

Just because someone is affected by natural disasters doesn't mean they are inefficient, they have probably been producing for decades until a temporary situation catches up with them.

The farming allowance isn't for natural disasters, there is separate disaster relief payments that farmers get for that which I am not arguing against, all though I believe it should be applied to all businesses that are affected.

Farmers can apply for the farming allowance when ever they find that they are running into financial trouble, it can simply be because the market price of the products they grow drops below their cost of production, or they have to much debt, or any other reason.