The Australian Greens party

Garpal Gumnut · 21 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

noco said:
GG they are green outside and red inside and offer plenty of verbal diarrhoea. They will often cause nausea if you swallow too much of their contents, particualrly relating to too much solar exposure as it can turn the inside quite vile.
Avoid them at all costs if you prefer the better side life.

I believe I came on two of them in a Toyota Pious that had run out of whatever they run on, just off the Strzelecki Track, last year on my way to the Birdsvlle Races.

They were in a shocking state, I couldn't stop, as I was running late for the races and only had enough fuel in the boot for the Arnage.

I am unable to verify their hue on the inside, but the hawks and eagles were quite interested in them, so as they are carnivores, I guess that would be secondary evidence for them being internally red.

They were green though, and quite dry, on the outside, and waved their arms rather feebly as I drove past. I waved back.

gg

Calliope · 21 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

IFocus said:
I would vote for you Smurf nice post

The kiss of death.

Calliope · 21 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

noco said:
GG they are green outside and red inside and offer plenty of verbal diarrhoea. They will often cause nausea if you swallow too much of their contents, particualrly relating to too much solar exposure as it can turn the inside quite vile.
Avoid them at all costs if you prefer the better side life.

Peter Hartcher says in the SMH today;

The Greens are often accused of being a watermelon party - green on the outside but a socialist red in the middle.

Not true. The party's leader showed yesterday that it's actually more like a tomato, red not just on the outside but all the way to the centre.

drsmith · 21 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

Garpal Gumnut said:
I believe I came on two of them in a Toyota Pious that had run out of whatever they run on, just off the Strzelecki Track, last year on my way to the Birdsvlle Races.

They might have been out there surveying the track for a fast train powered by camel dung.

Julia · 21 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

Smurf1976 said:
I am not necessarily advocating gay marriage. What I am against however is the constant use of that particular issue as a form of scare campaign for purely political purposes. A classic case of victimising a minority in order to appeal to the mob.

Nowhere have I seen a truly rational debate on the subject. It simply ends up as a scare campaign - vote for x and they'll legalise gay marriage. The situation is very similar with the asylum seeker and climate change issues which have been dominant themes this election. Very little rational debate, just a lot of dubious claims and a scare campaign.

As for the influence of religion in general, I would agree that it is an unproven point but there are many who suggest that Liberal leader Tony Abbott may indeed be influenced by his religious beliefs should he become PM. I may well be wrong, but indications are that he may turn out to be the stereotypical anti-abortion, anti-gay, no sex before marriage type. Fair enough if he chooses to follow that personally, but it is very clear that a large portion of the Australian population doesn't agree.

In short, I'm simply aginst the incitement of fear and hatred based on race, physical characteristics, gender and the like. The world has seen more than enough of that over the years and it's time to move on.

Calliope said:
The kiss of death.

I also liked Smurf's post. Does this mean I'm also offering the kiss of death along with IFocus?

Calliope · 21 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

Julia said:
I also liked Smurf's post. Does this mean I'm also offering the kiss of death along with IFocus?

Praise from somebody like Mr Focus, like the kiss of Judas is a death warrant.

The kiss of Judas, the origin of the term "Kiss of Death", Judas's betrayal of Jesus with a kiss in the Garden of Gethsemane

lookout · 21 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

I'd like to vote for the party that cares about the country's finances and social fabric. I don't want money wasted on first home buyer grants and most of the various stimulus programmes; I don't want money wasted on desalination plants and pipelines to steal water from other areas of the country, rather than recycling water already used in the cities; I do want money spent on disadvantaged kids and communities so that we don't end up like the USA; I do want money spent on developing renewable energy technology rather than subsidising installation of current innefficient technology.

So who do I vote for? None of the parties have the common sense to pursue both financially responsible and socially equitable policies.

No point picking on the greens alone when the others are just as flawed.

bobert · 22 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

hope Australia lays claim to international waters where the Japanese whale and shut it down.

noco · 22 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

I don't think the Greens are as 'rosy' as the party portrays themselves. They have already broken into three factions (not sure whether they are left, right or mddle) and if they do progress to a larger party, they could find themselves in a similar situation to Labor, that is from moderate to extreme which could spell trouble for the Greens down the track.

The Greens at this stage appear to be more extreme to the left of socialism and don't believe that will benifit this great country of ours.

Calliope · 22 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

noco said:
The Greens at this stage appear to be more extreme to the left of socialism and don't believe that will benifit this great country of ours.

In future years when historians are looking for the tipping point when Australia started to go backwards I think they will agree that it was 21st August 2010. It is dangerous to put control of the country into the hands of special interest minorities, with very narrow agendas.

lookout · 22 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

Calliope said:
In future years when historians are looking for the tipping point when Australia started to go backwards I think they will agree that it was 21st August 2010. It is dangerous to put control of the country into the hands of special interest minorities, with very narrow agendas.

It's been going backwards ever since politicians started promoting the property bubble. All that debt has the country sailing toward an iceberg whenever Europe and the US are forced into submission by their debt ridden economies.

noco · 22 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

Calliope said:
In future years when historians are looking for the tipping point when Australia started to go backwards I think they will agree that it was 21st August 2010. It is dangerous to put control of the country into the hands of special interest minorities, with very narrow agendas.

Calliope, IMHO this is the begining of the end of the Labor Party and they will rue the day they got into bed with the Greens. The Greens have virtually taken away the Labor Party power base.

I can even foresee a Green Labor Party in the future, because they do have similar ideologies, except the Greens are far too extreme to the left which is verging on communism. Communsim has mostly been a failure in the developed world and would be destined to fail in Australia.

wayneL · 22 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

lookout said:
It's been going backwards ever since politicians started promoting the property bubble. All that debt has the country sailing toward an iceberg whenever Europe and the US are forced into submission by their debt ridden economies.

I reckon it started in 1972. Sir John tried to stop the rot in '75, God bless him. But is was already too late.

captain black · 22 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

wayneL said:
I reckon it started in 1972. Sir John tried to stop the rot in '75, God bless him. But is was already too late.

+1

The root of many of today's problems began with the social engineers back in the 60's and 70's.

drsmith · 22 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

From a tax perspective it was the two world wars.

http://taxreview.treasury.gov.au/co...l/publications/papers/report/section_4-01.htm

They are prefect illustrations as to why we should not accept a carbon tax or increased resources taxes wothout equal offsets of other taxes. Otherwise the base level of taxation simply increases.

It would be interesting to know the Greens policy position on tax to GDP ratio.

bellenuit · 22 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

drsmith said:
It would be interesting to know the Greens policy position on tax to GDP ratio.

110%

Smurf1976 · 22 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

Calliope said:
Who is doing the victimising? And what is the "mob"?

What mob is this appealing to?

There is a section of the population that, for resons unknown to me, actually seems quite frightened of all sorts of things. Gays and anyone who isn't a "white" person of European descent seem to top the list, but there are plenty of other things too.

Why this fear I really don't know. But it seems to be based on prejudice and a desire to control others which, unfortunately, some politicians exploit for their own gain.

I have yet to hear any sound arguments that government should control the lives of adults simply due to them preferring a same sex partner or having dark skin. But sadly, it is an underlying theme almost constantly in Australian political debate.

Race is rarely mentioned directly, but take any of these issues and then change the country of origin to "UK" or "USA" and change the race to "White" or "Anglo Saxon" and life status to "Married with children" and all of a sudden the "problems" magically disappear. That's prejudice based on race, origin and personal preferences, something that has caused more than enough strife in the world and which we would be much better off without.

Bob Brown himself is a classic example. Many disagree with him over forests, rivers and all sorts of other things. Sadly, some of them have that view not based on any rational argument, but simply because Bob just happens to be gay.

As for "the mob", I'm referring to those who don't think for themselves. Plenty of them unfortunately.

drsmith · 22 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

How can the Greens call themselves greens when John Deere uses it on their farm machinery (agricultural green) ?

It's the colour of the Nationals.

The ABC has the Nationals and the Greens as different shades of green with the Greens being the more sickly looking shade.

IFocus · 22 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

drsmith said:
From a tax perspective it was the two world wars.

http://taxreview.treasury.gov.au/co...l/publications/papers/report/section_4-01.htm

They are prefect illustrations as to why we should not accept a carbon tax or increased resources taxes wothout equal offsets of other taxes. Otherwise the base level of taxation simply increases.

Out of interest without changing the base how do you increase services i.e. health and education maintain a modern military, expand infrastructure for productivity gains etc.

I see many complain now about health and education but with no commentary on how we pay for it.

Given the resources boom shouldn't there be a dividend paided and I base this on the royalties settings decades ago that don't as a % equate to today's pricing some thing that the Liberals are willing to give away.

drsmith · 22 August 2010

Re: The Greens - The New Radical Socialists

Is ~30% of GDP as tax not enough to provide welfare and government services ?

If not, then what percentage of GDP is appropriate ?

The net tax from resources needs to be reviewed, but obviously not how the ALP did it. This to me more than anything else is what precipitated Kevin Rudd's downfall and the present electoral outcome for the ALP.

The Australian Greens party

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Calliope

Calliope

drsmith

Julia

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Calliope

lookout

bobert

noco

Calliope

lookout

noco

wayneL

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bellenuit

Smurf1976

drsmith

IFocus

You are arguing with a Galah

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