Australian (ASX) Stock Market Forum

The Abbott Government

So what is your definition of team Australia? Is it the same as Abbott's? I've not really heard him describe what it means. Is it just blindly following what the Government says?

Nobody should have to explain to you how a team works Syd......it is pure elementary 'dear Watson', meaning people work together for a winning outcome.

As I stated before, we (and more so the unions) are quick to put out our hands to share the wealth of the nation when things are going well....how often have you heard the Green/Labor socialist left wingers demand a share of the countries wealth from minerals?....But at times, like we are experiencing now, the price of our minerals, and in particular iron ore, has had a dramatic drop in price and now is the time when the unions should be saying, OK we will lend a hand or do they adopt the same socialist mentality of expecting the Government to prop them up with subsidies or industry assistance in order to maintain with high wages..

Sometime ago, somebody in their wisdom decided we should entertain a multicultural society, mainly because we are a large country with a low population...we needed more people to foster growth and to a point it has worked.....The problem is now we have created a monster for ourselves by allowing radical religious immigrants from countries who are not prepared to accept the Australian way of life....they form their own ghettos and refuse to assimilate....they want to their own laws and are not prepared to accept ours....They expect welfare because they are either not skilled or do not understand English.

IN MY BOOK, THAT IS NOT TEAM WORK.

As Bill Crosby says and I go along with what he says, I am tired of it all..





Not new, I’ve seen this before (perhaps the guy found the fountain of youth and is stuck at 83?) but still a refreshing set of thoughts.

Subject: Bill Cosby at 83


Life isn't tied with a bow, but it's still a gift.
And life isn't fair, but it's good!!











I'm 83. Except for brief period in the 50s when I was doing my National Service, I've worked
hard since I was 17. Except for some serious health challenges, I put in 50-hour weeks, and
didn't call in sick in nearly 40 years.

I made a reasonable salary, but I didn't inherit my job or my income, and I worked to get where I am. Given the economy, it looks as though retirement was a bad idea, and I'm tired. Very tired.

I'm tired of being told that I have to "spread the wealth" to people who don't have my work ethic.
I'm tired of being told the government will take the money I earned, by force if necessary, and
give it to people too lazy to earn it.

I'm tired of being told that Islam is a "Religion of Peace," when every day I can read dozens of
stories of Muslim men killing their sisters, wives and daughters for their family "honor"; of Muslims rioting over some slight offence; of Muslims murdering Christian and Jews because they aren't "believers"; of Muslims burning schools for girls; of Muslims stoning teenage rape victims to death
for "adultery"; of Muslims mutilating the genitals of little girls; all in the name of Allah, because
the Qur'an and Sharia law tells them to.

I'm tired of being told that out of "tolerance for other cultures" we must let Saudi Arabia and
other Arab countries use our oil money to fund mosques and madrassa Islamic schools to preach
hate in Australia, New Zealand, UK, America and Canada, while no one from these countries
are allowed to fund a church, synagogue or religious school in Saudi Arabia or any other Arab
country to teach love and tolerance.

I'm tired of being told I must lower my living standard to fight global warming, which no one is
allowed to debate.

I'm tired of being told that drug addicts have a disease, and I must help support and treat them,
and pay for the damage they do. Did a giant germ rush out of a dark alley, grab them, and stuff
white powder up their noses or stick a needle in their arm while they tried to fight It off?

I'm tired of hearing wealthy athletes, entertainers and politicians of all parties talking about
innocent mistakes, stupid mistakes or youthful mistakes, when we all know they think their only
mistake was getting caught.

I'm tired of people with a sense of entitlement, rich or poor.

I'm really tired of people who don't take responsibility for their lives and actions. I'm tired of
hearing them blame the government, or discrimination or big-whatever for their problems.

I'm also tired and fed up with seeing young men and women in their teens and early 20s be-deck themselves in tattoos and face studs, thereby making themselves un-employable and claiming
money from the Government.

Yes, I'm damn tired. But I'm also glad to be 83. Because, mostly, I'm not going to have to see
the world these people are making. I'm just sorry for my granddaughters and their children.
Thank God I'm on the way out and not on the way in.

There is no way this will be widely publicized, unless each of us sends it on!
This is your chance to make a difference.




BILL COSBY




















This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
 
Wow, that was a rant eh noco ?

:D

Well, good on you for working hard all your life, most people do.

A couple of points though

Drug addiction.

A lot of people would take your position until it happens to be their son or daughter or grandchild who is a drug addict, then it turns out to be the fault of the dirty drug pusher who sold them the stuff. Some people make mistakes with drugs, others make a living out of them. The people who make the mistakes can have their lives turned around, but they need help to do it. Don't just write them off.

"People too lazy to work".

I think you underestimate the role of technology in job destruction. Jobs for unskilled youth are disappearing fast because of the "self service" mentality, allied with technology and the internet.

How many kids 30 years ago got jobs pumping petrol, teller staff, sales assistants or bank clerks ? These jobs are being replaced by self service petrol stations, ATMS and internet marketing. The face of the workforce is rapidly changing and there are not enough jobs being created in the unskilled sector to make up for those lost by technology.

Being 83, you probably haven't worked for 20 years or more, so I suggest you may be a bit out of touch with the current situation.

Take care of yourself old chap, and have another cup of Milo and a nap.

Cheers.
:)
 
Wow, that was a rant eh noco ?

:D

Well, good on you for working hard all your life, most people do.

A couple of points though

Drug addiction.

A lot of people would take your position until it happens to be their son or daughter or grandchild who is a drug addict, then it turns out to be the fault of the dirty drug pusher who sold them the stuff. Some people make mistakes with drugs, others make a living out of them. The people who make the mistakes can have their lives turned around, but they need help to do it. Don't just write them off.

"People too lazy to work".

I think you underestimate the role of technology in job destruction. Jobs for unskilled youth are disappearing fast because of the "self service" mentality, allied with technology and the internet.

How many kids 30 years ago got jobs pumping petrol, teller staff, sales assistants or bank clerks ? These jobs are being replaced by self service petrol stations, ATMS and internet marketing. The face of the workforce is rapidly changing and there are not enough jobs being created in the unskilled sector to make up for those lost by technology.

Being 83, you probably haven't worked for 20 years or more, so I suggest you may be a bit out of touch with the current situation.

Take care of yourself old chap, and have another cup of Milo and a nap.

Cheers.
:)


Rumpy, I don't think you read into text of the post......That take was written by Bill Crosby who is 83 ...not me.

So why do you regard it as rant when in fact it is reality....As I have stated before an attack on my character does not worry me.....it was you who stated "LETS KEEP IT CIVIL" .....your rude remarks "have another cup of Milo and a nap."
does not become you.
I only stopped working at the beginning of this year albeit 16 hours per week..

With regards to young people going on drugs, they only have themselves to blame and nobody else......your mind controls your body.....They all know what the affect drugs have on their brain and yet they still get involved and then have to be rehabilitated at the expense of the tax payer.

We live in modern times and not the stone age...we have to adapt to innovation and new technology and one of the reason is the high cost of labour, penalty rates on weekends, longer annual leave, leave loading, long service leave etc.etc. etc.....but given all what you say, unemployment has fallen and 121,000 extra jobs have been created much to the horror of the Green/Labor coalition......you cannot tell me workers are not better off than they were 60 years ago.......I started work when we worked a 40 hour a week, had two weeks annual
leave......no leave loading.....no long service leave after 15 years and what do we have today?......All the extras which all add up to the cost of living...those costs are always passed on.......we are a greedy lot and live in a selfish world....bugger you mate so long as I'm alright......believe me, I am the first to help someone I know who is in need....it is a pity others did not think the same way.
 
Nobody should have to explain to you how a team works Syd......it is pure elementary 'dear Watson', meaning people work together for a winning outcome.

As I stated before, we (and more so the unions) are quick to put out our hands to share the wealth of the nation when things are going well....how often have you heard the Green/Labor socialist left wingers demand a share of the countries wealth from minerals?....But at times, like we are experiencing now, the price of our minerals, and in particular iron ore, has had a dramatic drop in price and now is the time when the unions should be saying, OK we will lend a hand or do they adopt the same socialist mentality of expecting the Government to prop them up with subsidies or industry assistance in order to maintain with high wages..

Sometime ago, somebody in their wisdom decided we should entertain a multicultural society, mainly because we are a large country with a low population...we needed more people to foster growth and to a point it has worked.....The problem is now we have created a monster for ourselves by allowing radical religious immigrants from countries who are not prepared to accept the Australian way of life....they form their own ghettos and refuse to assimilate....they want to their own laws and are not prepared to accept ours....They expect welfare because they are either not skilled or do not understand English.

IN MY BOOK, THAT IS NOT TEAM WORK.

You're political beacon of the light, Howard, said "Australia needs a high level of immigration. I’m a high immigration man. I practiced that in Government." Isn't he therefore part of the problem you believe has occurred?

Is it unions badgering the Govt for industry assistance, or the corporations? CEOs seem to benefit as much, if not more than the workers, from all the handouts the Govt provides. Look at the way companies play off states over pay roll tax exemptions and other incentives to locate their business within their state. Look at how the large global companies play off countries over tax rates and R&D funding and grants and all the other pork they claim is required to make the host country a viable option.

Look at the tax treaties Australia has with other countries and how they're used to siphon off billions from this country. Apple and Google make billions here yet pay hardly any tax. Is that the fault of the unions? Look at Glencore making $15B in revenue from coal exports and paying practically no tax here because they were able to "borrow" from the parent company at 9% interest rates, or sold the coal to related companies. Hundreds of millions in fees ripped out of the local company and sent to related Glencore subsidiaries in low taxing countries. By your standards that's OK because it's capitalism. Seems it's doing more harm than socialism.

My second employer was a large IT support company specialising in the airlines. They had a global reach and were in negotiations with teh NSW Govt for setting up their regional HD here. It had already been decided, but management told us to keep quiet till the negotiations were completed as they anted to ensure they received the greatest level of support. Within 5 years the company had shut down the Sydney centre, moved the HD to Cairo and Rio, with the network support moved to Singapore. That was the beginning of my knowledge of how outsourcing was going to kill off IT jobs in Australia.

Then we have the $17B in subsidies to the resource sector on an annual basis. Once again I'm sure you'll blame the unions for that one.

We have an economy based on rent seeking. Pure and simple. We have the minister of Trade and Investment saying "We are an oligopoly community. We shouldn't fight it. We should make the most of it. It does provide us with the critical mass and the size and innovation and for that ability to compete with overseas countries." How is that compatible with a competitive economy? Seems like we're being told we should be happy to pay higher prices in this country so our local "champions", fat off the local workers, can expand into other countries and sell their products and services at a lower price.

Basically the current Govt you support sees no problems with the path we've followed, nor do they see any problems with the path we're currently walking.
 
Why is Joe Hockey not following the 40 other countries who have signed up for Common Reporting Standard which provides for the automatic exchange of financial account information between banks in different countries. It is designed to make it easier to track how money moves around the world so that governments can ensure companies pay their fair share of tax.

Hockey endorsed the standard earlier in the year at the G20 finance ministers meeting. So why the reluctance to get on board? Surely he doesn't think Australia would be worse from cracking down on the large multinational companies from shifting profits out of the country?

It's even harder to understand his relucatnce considering an extensive period of industry consultation has been completed and he's sat on the finding for the last couple of months.

Australia is the only G20 nation to have not signed up, and we currently hold the G20 chair. What kind of message does that send tot he world?

Earlier in the month Hockey and Abbott were loudly complaining about the profit shifting that has been occuring, yet they're dragging their feet to sign up for what looks to be the best way to work with other countries to stop it from occurring. So what's going on :confused: Why the reluctance to sign up to the Common Reporting Standard :confused:

Could it be that they remember what happened to Labor when they tried to make large companies pay a fairer share of tax in the country?
 
Could it be that they remember what happened to Labor when they tried to make large companies pay a fairer share of tax in the country?

Just supporting their financial backers.

The sooner we have publicly funded political parties with no other sources of revenue, the sooner this type of political largesse will disappear.
 
You're political beacon of the light, Howard, said "Australia needs a high level of immigration. I’m a high immigration man. I practiced that in Government." Isn't he therefore part of the problem you believe has occurred?

Why is Howard part of the problem? ....I am sure he was not responsible for the 50,000 Muslims who illegally entered Australia 2008/2013...Howard had a responsible program of immigration by allowing skilled and professional people into the community

Is it unions badgering the Govt for industry assistance, or the corporations? CEOs seem to benefit as much, if not more than the workers, from all the handouts the Govt provides. Look at the way companies play off states over pay roll tax exemptions and other incentives to locate their business within their state. Look at how the large global companies play off countries over tax rates and R&D funding and grants and all the other pork they claim is required to make the host country a viable option.

In the majority of cases, industry assistance was sought because of the high demands by the unions....many industries have become non competitive for this very reason.....industry assistance is really another term of socialism.....'help me if you can coz I.m feelin' down".....you never hear the unions coming to the party when a company becomes insolvent because they cannot compete.......rarely do you hear them say we will go back to working 40 hours a week, take 2 weeks annual leave instead of 4....remove leave loading and some of the outlandish penalty rates....oh no.....they would rather complain the Government is not doing enough to save their jobs.....well I say, wake up Australia....your country needs you......I would love to see these union heavies and the union members working for themselves.....I am sure they would starve to death if they thought they could make money working 36 hours per week.


Look at the tax treaties Australia has with other countries and how they're used to siphon off billions from this country. Apple and Google make billions here yet pay hardly any tax. Is that the fault of the unions? Look at Glencore making $15B in revenue from coal exports and paying practically no tax here because they were able to "borrow" from the parent company at 9% interest rates, or sold the coal to related companies. Hundreds of millions in fees ripped out of the local company and sent to related Glencore subsidiaries in low taxing countries. By your standards that's OK because it's capitalism. Seems it's doing more harm than socialism.

I am not familiar with these so called tax treaties, perhaps you might like to enlighten me.....I do know they all have to pay royalties on what they take out of the ground and I noticed you avoided stating that point to suit your own argument.

Then we have the $17B in subsidies to the resource sector on an annual basis. Once again I'm sure you'll blame the unions for that one.

Some details or a link on this point would be appreciated.

We have an economy based on rent seeking. Pure and simple. We have the minister of Trade and Investment saying "We are an oligopoly community. We shouldn't fight it. We should make the most of it. It does provide us with the critical mass and the size and innovation and for that ability to compete with overseas countries." How is that compatible with a competitive economy? Seems like we're being told we should be happy to pay higher prices in this country so our local "champions", fat off the local workers, can expand into other countries and sell their products and services at a lower price.

"oligopoly" ????this section of your statement just does not seem to make any sense.

Basically the current Govt you support sees no problems with the path we've followed, nor do they see any problems with the path we're currently walking.

So what path are we following and what path should we be following.....I do not believe you understand that most of the path we have to follow has been laid out by previous Government legislation.
 
Bill Cosby is worth $350 million and he is having a whinge and crying poor!

A minimum of $100,000 for poor old Bill to make a speaking engagement sounds like he is doing it really tough.

http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/celeb/comedian/bill-cosby-net-worth/

How did you decipher that he is crying poor?.....I did not detect any suggestion.

So he has talent as a Comedian...good luck to him......Are you jealous of his success?

So he demands $100,000 to speak at some special engagement......He must be highly regarded to demand that type of money...obviously someone would be making money from his appearance including his government who would most likely take 50% of his $100,000 leaving hm with $50,000.

He has stated a very valid point as to what is going on in the USA and the same thing in Australia and many in Australia think the same thing but remain silent about it for fear of being branded as a racist or a bigot.
 
It is very relevant as far I am concerned because the same thing is happening here and you really cannot deny it.

What are we trying to deny ?

I don't deny there is a drug problem.

I don't deny there is an unemployment problem.

What I do deny is your one eyed view of the people who have these problems and their causes.

As for multiculturalism, I think you have a point. Immigration numbers were high under Howard, and Rudd & Gillard.

The family reunion program should be abolished in favour of a skills based system. Preference should be given to single people or couples without children to ease the burden on schools which are getting overcrowded.
 
I had no intention to offend you noco, but I don't really see why Bill Cosby's opinion is relevant to Australia.
Perhaps simply because his lament applies across many countries, is not confined to the USA by any means, and is possibly a reflection of what many people his age are feeling.

Bill Cosby is worth $350 million and he is having a whinge and crying poor!
Typical misreading. I didn't see him crying poor anywhere. He's perfectly entitled to express his concerns.

Just supporting their financial backers.

The sooner we have publicly funded political parties with no other sources of revenue, the sooner this type of political largesse will disappear.
No thanks. I'd regard it as the ultimate insult to have to fund them.
 
Perhaps simply because his lament applies across many countries, is not confined to the USA by any means, and is possibly a reflection of what many people his age are feeling.


Typical misreading. I didn't see him crying poor anywhere. He's perfectly entitled to express his concerns.

No thanks. I'd regard it as the ultimate insult to have to fund them.

Julia, since there has been reduced support for unions in recent times, the unions contribution to the Labor coffers has also diminished, so I am sure they would welcome funds from the Government to finance their election efforts.....that would probably be more than the funds they could raise themselves.

I would be curious to know if the HSU has the same support from members as they enjoyed several years ago.
 
So what path are we following and what path should we be following.....I do not believe you understand that most of the path we have to follow has been laid out by previous Government legislation.

Are you saying just the previous Labor Government, or all the previous Governments?

Why is Howard part of the problem? ....I am sure he was not responsible for the 50,000 Muslims who illegally entered Australia 2008/2013...Howard had a responsible program of immigration by allowing skilled and professional people into the community

He says he was for high immigration. He actively encouraged it. As for the 50000 illegal Muslims, how many of them are in Australia? You might find the below attached spreadsheet enlightening as to exactly where all the immigrants are arriving from.

In the majority of cases, industry assistance was sought because of the high demands by the unions....many industries have become non competitive for this very reason.....industry assistance is really another term of socialism.....'help me if you can coz I.m feelin' down".....you never hear the unions coming to the party when a company becomes insolvent because they cannot compete.......rarely do you hear them say we will go back to working 40 hours a week, take 2 weeks annual leave instead of 4....remove leave loading and some of the outlandish penalty rates....oh no.....they would rather complain the Government is not doing enough to save their jobs.....well I say, wake up Australia....your country needs you......I would love to see these union heavies and the union members working for themselves.....I am sure they would starve to death if they thought they could make money working 36 hours per week.

So poor management of the companies had no bearing on their hands out for Government assistance. You don't think the restrictive zoning laws in Australia for land use haven't caused rents to be so high as to make a lot of businesses uncompetitive compared to countries that provide stronger rights of use?

You seem to be indicating the only thing holding Australian companies back are unions and wages. Nothing else is relevant?

I'd argue that

  • lowering the currency - it is far to high when compared to the fall in the ToT over the last 12 months
  • ensuring the devaluation is real by keeping a lid on wages growth - growth only due to productivity improvements
  • lifting productivity through myriad reform agendas including high quality infrastructure - all projects to be screened by Infrastructure Australia before funding committed.
  • ensuring robust domestic competition in all markets to deliver the most efficient businesses - not accepting oligopolies as the The minister for Trade would have us.
  • supporting demand though welfare for the vulnerable - so that people accept the painful adjustments that need to occur.

are a better option than trying to get our wages down to the levels in Thailand or Malaysia.

I am not familiar with these so called tax treaties, perhaps you might like to enlighten me.....I do know they all have to pay royalties on what they take out of the ground and I noticed you avoided stating that point to suit your own argument.

http://www.treasury.gov.au/Policy-Topics/Taxation/Tax-Treaties/HTML

Then we have the $17B in subsidies to the resource sector on an annual basis. Once again I'm sure you'll blame the unions for that one.

Some details or a link on this point would be appreciated.


I misread. Was actually $17.6B over 6 years - http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-06-...illions-of-dollars-in-state-subsidies/5545714

http://www.tai.org.au/content/pouring-more-fuel-fire links to the full report.

"oligopoly" ????this section of your statement just does not seem to make any sense.

An oligopoly is a market form in which a market or industry is dominated by a small number of sellers (oligopolists). Oligopolies can result from various forms of collusion which reduce competition and lead to higher prices for consumers.[1]

With few sellers, each oligopolist is likely to be aware of the actions of the others. The decisions of one firm therefore influence and are influenced by the decisions of other firms. Strategic planning by oligopolists needs to take into account the likely responses of the other market participants.

Sounds very much like the Australian economy, though we are often duopolistic rather than oligopoly. 4 main banks with 85%+ of new mortgages since the GFC. 2 airlines. 1 dominant telco with 2 distant wannabees in the mobile space. 2 dominant newspaper conglomerates. 2 Dominant supermarket / liquor chains. How much do these companies abuse their market power to set prices higher than they would be with genuine competition?
 

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How many kids 30 years ago got jobs pumping petrol, teller staff, sales assistants or bank clerks ? These jobs are being replaced by self service petrol stations, ATMS and internet marketing. The face of the workforce is rapidly changing and there are not enough jobs being created in the unskilled sector to make up for those lost by technology.
Even checkout jobs in supermarkets are disappearing in favour of self service now. Fewer jobs but you can be pretty sure that the cost saving won't be passed on in the form of lower prices. No chance of that happening.

I keep hearing that service industries are supposedly the future of employment as manufacturing declines. But all around me I see service jobs disappearing too. Banks, petrol, shops, public transport - all have either drastically cut numbers or done away with entire occupations altogether. No such job as a bus conductor these days.

There's a valid argument that we can use human effort better than via bus conductors and so on certainly. But the unemployment, and more to the point underemployment, statistics suggest that isn't really happening in practice. :2twocents
 
Fair enough, if you want the country run by those with the most money and wanting more, or even more repugnant to you I'm sure, the unions.
Yes, valid point. Both options are equally repugnant.
I'm just a bit fed up with all the corruption attached to donation of funds by business and special interest groups on the one hand and unions extracting money from members for their own political purposes on the other. Don't know what the answer is, to be honest.
 
There's a valid argument that we can use human effort better than via bus conductors and so on certainly. But the unemployment, and more to the point underemployment, statistics suggest that isn't really happening in practice.

Very true, and while few people would make a career out of pumping gas or being a bus conductor, a lot of people used those types of jobs to support them while working their way through uni. What do they do now ? Some may have a partner who is working, or parents that support them but a lot of others just can't afford to go to uni and can't get a job because they have no qualifications.

We are losing generations of workers to technological change, but we still bring in people from overseas in droves. Crazy.
 
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