Resisting Climate Hysteria

Wysiwyg said:

Domestic power consumption is being transformed as you noted but the greater power consumption for medium to large industry and night time is something you have a solution for? No wind periods, no sun periods and night time is when energy storage becomes critical. Might need a few of your bro's mates to crank up their dynamo's for the neighborhood.

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Not at all. Along the higways, byways we see lights burn through the night. The city buildings at all levels we see the lights burning for no one. We do not need them. In the night I use a torch sometimes but often not at all. It lasts many months.

Lights only help the night stalkers and crooks. In fact they use torches too., LOL. SO Get over it, we can move on enormously with very very much less power.

Just go to channel 24 now on the rising waters in Florida.

It is wrong, after starting out as a fireball 5 billion years ago the earth is supposed to be cooling.

Time to start walking to work!!!!!

Wysiwyg said:

Domestic power consumption is being transformed as you noted but the greater power consumption for medium to large industry and night time is something you have a solution for? No wind periods, no sun periods and night time is when energy storage becomes critical. Might need a few of your bro's mates to crank up their dynamo's for the neighborhood.

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Which is the attraction with tidal/ wave power. And it can be used for other things as well.

chops_a_must said:

Which is the attraction with tidal/ wave power. And it can be used for other things as well.

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Yep, but few tick good solutions and ideas.

It seems there would have to be a combination of energy production sources for continuity reasons. Tide intensity varies and at top/bottom is inactive for about half an hour. Wave motion is variable and long lulls occur. Sunlight varies intensity and duration. Of course wind is not gonna blow where and when it is needed.
The ning nongs going crazy about global warming are still using all the stuff mankind creates with the manufacturing industries. I am sure the majority don't understand how much energy is consumed daily by non domestic demand

Peace brother

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Wysiwyg said:

It seems there would have to be a combination of energy production sources for continuity reasons. Tide intensity varies and at top/bottom is inactive for about half an hour. Wave motion is variable and long lulls occur. Sunlight varies intensity and duration. Of course wind is not gonna blow where and when it is needed.

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Wind, rain, sun, waves are all intermittent. But then so is coal in the case of power stations that aren't right next door to a continuously operating coal mine. Train turns up with a load of coal and unloads. That's it, there's your intermittent coal delivery. You don't get another one for a while.

Coal can be easily stored and as such the intermittent deliveries aren't a problem. Same with hydro, oil and biomass. They're all stored quite easily. Gas is also able to be stored, though less common in practice, and gas-fired generation tends to be more prone to sudden shortfalls for that reason. WA, SA, NSW, ACT and Vic have all had major shortfalls in gas supply at some point over the past 20 years and it will almost certainly happen again at some point.

If we're going to use renewables as the major, or only, source of electricity then ultimately it comes down to having (1) diversity of production both in terms of the resource used and geographic dispersion and (2) storage that is capable of being dispatched when needed.

An intermittent supply source + geographic diversity + storage = a reliable supply source that's no less reliable than what we've got now. The constraints are economic and political more than technical. We have the technology now to go predominantly renewable, it's just that economics and politics stands in the way of building it.

Something to remember in all of this is that despite households being primarily powered by electricity, they directly use little oil and virtually no coal, they are in most areas still a minority of electricity consumption and an even smaller minority of total energy consumption. Households are not the issue, they are a sideline to the big loads in business. Households may well go off-grid but the transmission grid is here to stay. We might not need a distribution network in the suburbs at some point, although that assumes we segregate land along strict residential and commercial boundaries with minimal mixed uses, but we're still going to need the other 50 - 80% (depending on location) of the electricity supply that isn't used by households.

In the Australian context the extremes are SA with relatively little heavy industry (only about 20% of total load and far less at the peak) and very high use of cooling devices such that household consumption is a major driver of total electricity load in the state. At the other extreme, in Tasmania households are only about 20% of the average system load. That said, Tas households are still a major driver of system coincident maximum demand and of costs - that's a key point there, 20% of the load drives a very much bigger share of the total cost. Likewise it's fair to say that electricity is expensive in SA and always has been - the relative lack of industrial load and the dominance of residential load being a big factor in that.

If we want renewable energy then we could get most of the way there with wind, solar, hydro, pumped storage (as distinct from hydro as an energy source), biomass and interconnection with PNG. Any geothermal or tidal / wave would be a bonus but isn't essential. All of that technology is available right now, indeed in some cases the preliminary design work for actual projects is already done.

Wysiwyg said:

It seems there would have to be a combination of energy production sources for continuity reasons. Tide intensity varies and at top/bottom is inactive for about half an hour. Wave motion is variable and long lulls occur. Sunlight varies intensity and duration. Of course wind is not gonna blow where and when it is needed.
The ning nongs going crazy about global warming are still using all the stuff mankind creates with the manufacturing industries. I am sure the majority don't understand how much energy is consumed daily by non domestic demand

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And diesel power generation is reliable?

Maybe you should get out and about and live in a remote area and experience how variable "traditional" power generation technologies are.

chops_a_must said:

And diesel power generation is reliable?

Maybe you should get out and about and live in a remote area and experience how variable "traditional" power generation technologies are.

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WTF has diesel generators got to do with reliable renewable energy? If you are gonna reply to my posts stick to the subject and be considerate or don't reply at all.

Wysiwyg said:

WTF has diesel generators got to do with reliable renewable energy? If you are gonna reply to my posts stick to the subject and be considerate or don't reply at all.

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Because that's an obvious example of where renewables will work. And will be more reliable than the existing fossil fuel power generation.

Some of the "ning nongs" don't know where a lot of these technologies are best deployed, first and foremost.

chops_a_must said:

Because that's an obvious example of where renewables will work. And will be more reliable than the existing fossil fuel power generation.

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That's good. Thank you.

With regard to living remote I lived in and helped maintain a remote tourist resort environment with diesel engine generated power, reverse osmosis desalination and anaerobic sewage treatment for four years. The gen. sets ran 24/7 with parallel and backup available. So I have been "out and about".

Well the (American) cavalary has come over the hill at Paris.

Led by Bill Gates,(Microsoft) Richard Branson, (Virgin) Mark Zuckerberg, (Facebook) Jeff Bezos (Amazon) and Co the Breakthrough Energy Coalition has hit teh ground running.

The Breakthrough Energy Coalition, made up of more than 25 investors from 10 countries, launched in Paris on Monday as part of the UN talks where nations are thrashing out an agreement to finally confront the issue of runaway climate change.

The group will mainly invest in early-stage clean energy companies across a range of sectors, such as electricity generation and storage, transportation and agriculture. The initiative has been announced in conjunction with Mission Innovation – an effort from 21 governments, including the US, Britain, Australia, Germany, China and Brazil, to double the amount of public money going into clean energy innovation.

It’s expected this will bolster governmental assistance in renewables such as solar to wind energy to $20bn.

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It will be interesting to see how this rescue effort pans out..

http://www.theguardian.com/environm...ion-mark-zuckerberg-facebook-microsoft-amazon.

basilio said:

Well the (American) cavalary has come over the hill at Paris.

Led by Bill Gates,(Microsoft) Richard Branson, (Virgin) Mark Zuckerberg, (Facebook) Jeff Bezos (Amazon) and Co the Breakthrough Energy Coalition has hit teh ground running.



It will be interesting to see how this rescue effort pans out..

http://www.theguardian.com/environm...ion-mark-zuckerberg-facebook-microsoft-amazon.

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Interesting indeed. I know a company that would benefit from these investments, own a bit of it too

Runaway Global Warming? Where's it running?

wayneL said:

Runaway Global Warming? Where's it running?

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to this site:?

http://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/global-temperature/

Wonder how many corrupt millionaires will be created by the billion(s) dollar climate change slush fund.

We will help create $1 billion worth of them.

dutchie said:

Wonder how many corrupt millionaires will be created by the billion(s) dollar climate change slush fund.

We will help create $1 billion worth of them.

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I suspect it will be one of those cashless programs where the money actually goes into the pay pool of the permanent public servants and nothing gets out into the wider community = net effect of saving $800M of expenditure on overseas aid with climate as the excuse.

On thinking a little more and being as we have an LNP govt; Telstra will probably get some of the pie too. Very strange how Telstra have most favoured status with the Libs...I wonder why that is

Tisme said:

to this site:?

http://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/global-temperature/

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That tells the real story and it doesn't look good.

I wonder where the deniers get their info from ?

I heard the lovely Vanessa say this morning that Sydney just had its second warmest Spring in 150 years.

SirRumpole said:

That tells the real story and it doesn't look good.

I wonder where the deniers get their info from ?

I heard the lovely Vanessa say this morning that Sydney just had its second warmest Spring in 150 years.

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This Spring didn't feel like Spring. I don't go out much but remember there's only a few nice spring days and the rest were either autumn cold or hot summer.

SirRumpole said:

That tells the real story and it doesn't look good.

I wonder where the deniers get their info from ?

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Everybody gets their info from the same place(s). How the data is tortured depends on bias.

For instance you are showing a strong bias in your post by uncritical acceptance of a graph, that the data is negative and by regurgitating the malodourous ad hominem taunt of "denier" for anyone that doesn't share your bias.