Our Immigration standards?

[wayneL]

Being an old girl I've seen this all before - yes Italians were hated by some - use the play "The Shifting Heart" by Richard Beynon as a reference. We had the same hysteria when the Vietnamese came in Australia - oh and I remember a place in London called "Kangaroo Valley" - care to consider why?

I understand we are called JAFA's over there.

(Just Another F%$#@!* Aussie)

 

[Smurf1976]

One thing that I think does matter is why migrants come to Australia in the first place.

I haven't spent enough time in Sydney to know what the situation is like there but considering the experience elsewhere I think that migrants, at least in the past, have made a very major contribution.

In my opinion there is a huge difference between those who come willing to work and those who don't. For example, in past decades (especially 1950's and 60's) Tasmania received plenty of migrants who came from numerous countries, many of them non-English speaking, to work for the Hydro etc. They knew full well before they even boarded the ship that they were moving to a new country and were going to be doing hard physical work once they got there. There was a job waiting but it was in the middle of nowhere working in the rain. Tasmania ended up attracting a large number (relative to the state's overall population) of migrants willing to work damn hard. Likewise numerous jobs in everything from paper mills to road construction were filled by migrants. Quite a few the state's business and other non-political leaders have been either those migrants or their Australian born descendents.

Such an experience of hard working migrants in the past is in stark contrast to those who come here looking for a better life and expecting to do nothing in return for their new home.

Right now in most if not all Australian states there are plenty of roads, dams, railways and other such projects which we would all benefit from being built. But the costs of paying for the work to be done, and in many cases actually finding sufficient workers willing to work in these generally remote areas under relatively harsh conditions, is prohibitive and consequently the engineers' plans for such things remain just that, plans.

What would be wrong with increasing the migrant intake and requiring newly arrived migrants to work for, say, 3 years (or until project completion) on such things? It would get the infrastructure built to assist Australia's future prosperity, provide a decent opportunity for migrants and their families seeking to leave whatever problems they are wanting to escape at home and ensure that at least a large portion of Australia's newly arrived migrants are decent, hard working people willing to have a go. In due course they would naturally disperse into the broader Australian community just as the Hydro workers did in Tasmania.

Obviously I don't suggest that properly trained doctors etc be sent out building roads, they're in more urgent need in hospitals, but for many this would seem a sensible approach. Come to Australia, do some hard work for the long term benefit of the country and after a period of time you are automatically an Australian citizen free to live and work as you see fit. They would receive full access to education (including compulsory English language lessons where needed), first rate health care etc from day one in return for their work.

It also ought to ease the problem of migrants being heavily concentrated in Sydney as they would already have a new home in, mostly, other areas before having the chance to move to Sydney. Some would still go there, but it's likely that most would end up staying in the regional areas or moving to the other state capitals.

 

[crackaton]

One thing that I think does matter is why migrants come to Australia in the first place.

I haven't spent enough time in Sydney to know what the situation is like there but considering the experience elsewhere I think that migrants, at least in the past, have made a very major contribution.

In my opinion there is a huge difference between those who come willing to work and those who don't. For example, in past decades (especially 1950's and 60's) Tasmania received plenty of migrants who came from numerous countries, many of them non-English speaking, to work for the Hydro etc. They knew full well before they even boarded the ship that they were moving to a new country and were going to be doing hard physical work once they got there. There was a job waiting but it was in the middle of nowhere working in the rain. Tasmania ended up attracting a large number (relative to the state's overall population) of migrants willing to work damn hard. Likewise numerous jobs in everything from paper mills to road construction were filled by migrants. Quite a few the state's business and other non-political leaders have been either those migrants or their Australian born descendents.

Such an experience of hard working migrants in the past is in stark contrast to those who come here looking for a better life and expecting to do nothing in return for their new home.

Right now in most if not all Australian states there are plenty of roads, dams, railways and other such projects which we would all benefit from being built. But the costs of paying for the work to be done, and in many cases actually finding sufficient workers willing to work in these generally remote areas under relatively harsh conditions, is prohibitive and consequently the engineers' plans for such things remain just that, plans.

What would be wrong with increasing the migrant intake and requiring newly arrived migrants to work for, say, 3 years (or until project completion) on such things? It would get the infrastructure built to assist Australia's future prosperity, provide a decent opportunity for migrants and their families seeking to leave whatever problems they are wanting to escape at home and ensure that at least a large portion of Australia's newly arrived migrants are decent, hard working people willing to have a go. In due course they would naturally disperse into the broader Australian community just as the Hydro workers did in Tasmania.

Obviously I don't suggest that properly trained doctors etc be sent out building roads, they're in more urgent need in hospitals, but for many this would seem a sensible approach. Come to Australia, do some hard work for the long term benefit of the country and after a period of time you are automatically an Australian citizen free to live and work as you see fit. They would receive full access to education (including compulsory English language lessons where needed), first rate health care etc from day one in return for their work.

It also ought to ease the problem of migrants being heavily concentrated in Sydney as they would already have a new home in, mostly, other areas before having the chance to move to Sydney. Some would still go there, but it's likely that most would end up staying in the regional areas or moving to the other state capitals.

I agree 100%. Most immigrants nowdays see it as free entry to an overly democratic society to do their dirty mischief. They come here to deal drugs, rort the social security, and generally cause unrest in society.

They basicially don't give a **** about Australia or or Australian society. Send the dirt back back where they came.

 

[Bloveld]

I agree 100%. Most immigrants nowdays see it as free entry to an overly democratic society to do their dirty mischief. They come here to deal drugs, rort the social security, and generally cause unrest in society.

They basicially don't give a **** about Australia or or Australian society. Send the dirt back back where they came.

Were you born this ignorant or did you have to work at it?

 

[Joe Blow]

Okay, I'm all in favour of discussions on topics such as this as long as they remain rational and there is no hate or vilification thrown around. I think it is important that we can discuss issues that are important to us as a nation and affect our future.

However... this sort of stuff is getting a little close to stepping over the line:

I agree 100%. Most immigrants nowdays see it as free entry to an overly democratic society to do their dirty mischief. They come here to deal drugs, rort the social security, and generally cause unrest in society.

They basicially don't give a **** about Australia or or Australian society. Send the dirt back back where they came.

What I find uncomfortable is not the assertion that there are immigrants involved in illegal activity but that MOST of them are, which clearly is not true.

So lets keep the discussion going but lets leave the generalisations out of it and keep things civilised... and please keep in mind clause 3 of the ASF Code of Conduct:

3. Obscene language and the use of language that is sexist, racist, harassing or threatening is strictly forbidden and will not be tolerated.

Thanks everyone.

 

[TheAnalyst]

Cracka speaks a bit of truth because i am half maltese and half aussie and my fathers maltese side are really racist against Aussies. The comments i had to put up with were just unbearable. Calling my mothers side a bunch of drunks and getting smart to me because my nanna was always pist to the bone...and they did not like the way nanna started drinking from early morning and how my uncle would stop by with the truck at lunch time back in the 70's and 80's and have a drink with her. And all my pops brothers sons would stop by as well and drink with their auntie myrie.

They made sure they didnt play football because my dads brother in law from malta did not like aussies so he made his kids play soccer when they want to play footy. Australia was just a place to use and abuse and burn its flag and humiliate its war dead..they hated the fact that my mums side was from a family that half the war dead on the war memorial were related and went all the way back to Gallipoli and beerasheba and the western front in France. I remember when i enlisted for the navy my dad tried to stop me but i refused. I remember when he dropped me off at the railway station and ready to go to St Kilda road and I jumped on the bus to cerberus for basic training he said dont go let the aussies do this stuff....i just said i am Aussie and so are my family.

 

[Goin' For Broke]

I'm a migrant myself coming from Canada over 20 years ago. I've heard aheck of alot of whinning from Ausies and Canucks over the years, and frankly everybody better get used to it. There are, at a rough guess about 3 billion people just north of this pretty country, and I think we should all be trying to get along! Some of the comments above are not constructive. Like it or not and as lame as it sounds we are going to have to share this small planet. Some people work and some are bluggers...race has little to do with it IMO.
Please seek advice of a financial adviser (probably a recent immigrant).

 

[Smurf1976]

There are, at a rough guess about 3 billion people just north of this pretty country, and I think we should all be trying to get along! Some of the comments above are not constructive. Like it or not and as lame as it sounds we are going to have to share this small planet. Some people work and some are bluggers...race has little to do with it IMO.

You've hit the nail on the head there IMO.

 

[TheAnalyst]

I'm a migrant myself coming from Canada over 20 years ago. I've heard aheck of alot of whinning from Ausies and Canucks over the years, and frankly everybody better get used to it. There are, at a rough guess about 3 billion people just north of this pretty country, and I think we should all be trying to get along! Some of the comments above are not constructive. Like it or not and as lame as it sounds we are going to have to share this small planet. Some people work and some are bluggers...race has little to do with it IMO.
Please seek advice of a financial adviser (probably a recent immigrant).

Nothing to be worried about they will just get nuked. Believe they will...dont for one second believe that Australia does not have a nuclear capacity.

 

[Bobby]

Thanks everyone for your comments,

28 of you had the guts to post & over 400 had a look.

Thats under 10% , hate ! to think how many have a fatuous outlook on this ?.

Bob.

 

[Bobby]

Okay, I'm all in favour of discussions on topics such as this as long as they remain rational and there is no hate or vilification thrown around. I think it is important that we can discuss issues that are important to us as a nation and affect our future.

However... this sort of stuff is getting a little close to stepping over the line:



What I find uncomfortable is not the assertion that there are immigrants involved in illegal activity but that MOST of them are, which clearly is not true.

So lets keep the discussion going but lets leave the generalisations out of it and keep things civilised... and please keep in mind clause 3 of the ASF Code of Conduct:



Thanks everyone.

Hullo Joe ,
Nice to see your running this show , like the way you ameliorate .

Regards Bob.

 

[It's Snake Pliskin]

Thanks everyone for your comments,

28 of you had the guts to post & over 400 had a look.

Thats under 10% , hate ! to think how many have a fatuous outlook on this ?.

Bob.

The political correctness crap is what disturbs me. Everyone apologises for being western or free thinking. We will apologise ourselves out of existence.

 

[Bobby]

The political correctness crap is what disturbs me. Everyone apologises for being western or free thinking. We will apologise ourselves out of existence.

Well said Snake.
When showing the Aussie flag was recently condemmed as insightment? :swear: to some sort of race issue, Now I know what needs to be done ,Re: Our Immigration policy.

Bob.

 

[chromatic]

The majority of these arguments are non-sequitur and part of a worrying trend of xenophobia and bigotry brought to you care of absurdities such as "the war on terror" and media hysteria over events of no consequence to the majority of us. All this flag talk and west vs east, "free thinkers" is jingoism.

Every race and religion has its idiots so why not treat and judge everyone on their own merits rather than lower ourselves to name-calling? It's dissappointing that on a stock forum of all places, one has to be subjected to this kind of rubbish.

The suggestion is that our immigration policy is a drain on the economy because the intake consists of trouble-makers that can't speak English and live on the dole. Aging population etc etc that we need people coming to live in Australia and with the skilled-migrants policy the government is running, I would suggest that the majority of this intake will not end up on the dole. Our tertiary education system gets a large chunk of revenue from overseas students coming here and paying through the nose for non-HECS places that they are only accepted in if they have passed an English proficieny test. Moreover, a quick look around a typical uni campus will also reveal that the majority of students are not the Bruce Ruxton and Australian-flag G-string-wearing types but people of diverse backgrounds.

This whole immigration topic is still-born. The real issue is maintaining mutual tolerance and respect for each others' races and cultures whatever they maybe and remembering that anyone who has an Australian citizenship has just as much right to live in this country and be called an Aussie as yourself.

Apologies for all the schmaltz and now let's get back to talking stocks and derivatives and leave this ugliness behind us.

chromatic

 

[visual]

You realise that this thread is for this exact topic,right
if you want to discuss shares look up the other threads
and by the way maybe you should tell those who would and actively are robbing us of our achivements to learn to live with us.
I`m sure the Danish press and people would appreciate that,once again they are bringing the world to the edge of a cataclism why because of ignorance.In fact the bible also says what the koran says and thats about idolatry not about never having the image of the prophet in print.

 

[happytrader]

Hi everyone

Well I think it would be good if immigration could assess intending applicants cooking skills or willingness to improve them. The place down the road makes an excellent souvlaki and the restaurant round the corner serves a mean yum cha.

Cheers
Happytrader

 

[chromatic]

You realise that this thread is for this exact topic,right
if you want to discuss shares look up the other threads
and by the way maybe you should tell those who would and actively are robbing us of our achivements to learn to live with us.

Okay, I'll relay your (collective) thoughts on that to "them" whoever they are. By the way, who exactly is robbing you of what achievements and who do you speak for when you say "us"? Us Australians? Us white caucasians? Do you realise you sound like a complete bigot with that statement?

I`m sure the Danish press and people would appreciate that,once again they are bringing the world to the edge of a cataclism why because of ignorance.

Some people found the cartoons offensive, they objected to them and others still took it too far. What is your point here? That "they" don't understand freedom of speech as practiced in the englightened west and Europe and are therefore ignorant? I can think of plenty of topics (all perfectly legally debatable in Australia) where satire and ridicule by any media outlet would result in an immediate public outcry and potential shutdown of said outlet. Freedom of expression is not a license to offend and insight racial/religious tension to the full extent permissible under the law.

In fact the bible also says what the koran says and thats about idolatry not about never having the image of the prophet in print.

Irrelevant on both counts.

 

[visual]

chromatic,
one word piss christ
how many public buildings were burned down,help me here I cant remember,oh thats right none!
and when I talk about freedom ,i especially mean women,you know the right to dress as we like,and not having to take responsability for some weak minded little fellow who thinks that a womans body can be attacked if she chooses to show it.And when people of different customs come to the west they should just learn to live with us or else head back instead of expecting us to change to their ignorant ways.How many times has Christ being vandalised in the name of art or whatever yet because we enjoy freedom of speech nothing happens other than lots of paper being wasted ,via newspapers,ect...........

 

[visual]

having re read your post chromatic,
thanks for reverting to name calling,proved my point ,
You want me to explain what i mean by us,westerners,people who have evolved enough to be able to live with other cultures,other religions,other customs,
people who dont have to revert to violence or threaten violence if a little poopy picture they dont like gets printed in newspapers.

 

[rederob]

I see that the concept of terra nullius is alive and well here.
We invade a country a few hundred years ago, populate it with convicts and hey, we own the place!
And we get to make the rules.
What about these immigrants, but!
Like my mum!
Today she would be called one of the "boat people".
Back then she was a refugee from Communist Europe.
I know she is grateful for the freedoms she has enjoyed in Australia (to this day she has never returned as she was afraid she would be jailed for "escaping").
And so this thread has turned from "immigration" to "rights" and "freedoms".
And ultimately to intolerance.
When we become part of the "problem" it is a tall order to expect those we care to rail against become part of the solution.
In recent years my personal view is that as a nation we have not had the leadership that was necessary "to bring us together". We are spending excessively on a mysterious war on terror - my 3" paper cutting scissors were confiscated at the airport, along with my partner's nail file, so we now see ourselves as a possible threat to this nation's security!