National Broadband Network

[Julia]

Is it true that it will cost between $3000 and $5000 to get it from yer gate, to your living room?

What a bloody con, if it is.

gg

That's so silly is almost a 'push polling' type post...when you post rubbish like that, without any substance to back it up, it really makes you look like a liberal stooge.

That's just unreasonable, So Cynical. I read the same thing in "The Weekend Australian". gg is not just making it up, as you seem to be suggesting.
The quote comes from the CEO of The National Electrical and Communications Association.

No wonder the government has been so reluctant to talk costs to consumers.

 

[Calliope]

That's just unreasonable, So Cynical. I read the same thing in "The Weekend Australian". gg is not just making it up, as you seem to be suggesting.
The quote comes from the CEO of The National Electrical and Communications Association.

No wonder the government has been so reluctant to talk costs to consumers.

Yes Julia, I have just read it. Is it pink bats all over again?

The National Electrical and Communications Association confirmed it was likely residents and some businesses would have to pay if they needed new wiring and outlets to take full advantage of the NBN.

Association chief executive James Tinslay said that once the NBN had installed fibre-optic cables, residents would still need to equip their homes with new cables and devices.

"Residents will need to consider what technology they wish to embrace when the NBN reaches their front gate, and it is very likely that many households will need to be retrofitted with new cables, wiring and outlets to access new services."

Mr Tinslay said a standard retrofit could cost up to $3000.

"However, the big unknown at this stage is what the cost will be for getting fibre-optic cables from your front gate into your living room," he said.

Mr Tinslay also raised concerns about the safety of workers installing the NBN, saying there were still no training standards or cost estimates for a scheme to prepare thousands of people for dangerous work near powerlines connecting homes to the fibre-optic network.
"Our main concern is letting government know that there are dangers here and they need to make sure that there are no safety issues along the way, because they will cop it from everybody if they do," Mr Tinslay said.

Some of the major safety concerns included eye injuries caused by tiny glass filaments and high-energy light pulses capable of destroying sight in milliseconds.

(My bolds)

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...ds-an-extra-3000/story-fn59niix-1225908005122

 

[So_Cynical]

Sorry Cynical, but this country had to put up with much worse rubbish yesterday with a certain female voice droning on and scare mongering about work choices. She should know that changes to work choices would have to get past the senate and that's a near impossibility. No substance, IMO.

How can you trust this government to know what it's doing with NBN when
(a) it's track record at managing anything is dismal
(b) it lowers itself to scaremongering on something that is obvious won't happen - especially this Monday...

The thing is with work (no) choices, we all know that's what they really want, the shadow IR guy said so on Lateline last week..just added that they would seek a mandate at some time in the future to do it.

The green dominated (post election) Senate wont pass it, that's true..but it don't change the fact that IR reform is at the core of Liberal/National thinking.

Its a bit like saying that some crazy guy wont hurt you as long as he's on his medication...or this aircraft is perfectly safe to fly in due to all the back up safety systems, aircrew training and advanced technology...however we all know crazy guys can still kill you and aircraft fall outa the sky all the time.

 

[overhang]

Yes Julia, I have just read it. Is it pink bats all over again?


(My bolds)

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...ds-an-extra-3000/story-fn59niix-1225908005122

Absolute scaremongering at its best, the article tries to imply that it will be a prerequisite to connecting to the NBN. For most users an existing wireless N router that achieves speeds of 50-90 mbps will be sufficient. The NTU that the NBN provide emulates ADSL so you can still use your same setup until you feel the need to upgrade.

 

[Calliope]

Absolute scaremongering at its best.

I seem to remember Gillard and Rudd saying similar things about home insulation and the BER.

 

[IFocus]

Absolute scaremongering at its best, the article tries to imply that it will be a prerequisite to connecting to the NBN. For most users an existing wireless N router that achieves speeds of 50-90 mbps will be sufficient. The NTU that the NBN provide emulates ADSL so you can still use your same setup until you feel the need to upgrade.

Agree the claim is bizarre and extraordinary as once NBN is connected to the location options on distribution is endless depending on the needs the problem is most punters are not tech savvy and believe this rubbish

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

Is it true that it will cost between $3000 and $5000 to get it from yer gate, to your living room?

What a bloody con, if it is.

gg

That's so silly is almost a 'push polling' type post...when you post rubbish like that, without any substance to back it up, it really makes you look like a liberal stooge.

Actually SC, I got it in pillow talk from a lady last night who works for the NBN.

As I am a gentleman, I am unable to provide absolute proof, but I believe, as Julia has said, it is now in the Press.

You are a rotter, as a former Foreign Minister would say, and for the record I am an Australian first, then an Anarchist and Political Opportunist.

I support no party, just good politics with a smattering of graft, double dealing and mayhem.

My friendships range from the NSW Right, through the Liberals to the National Party and there are many good folk in all parties. I have never met a Green.

If I hadn't promised Joe that I would be good today I'd ask you outside to settle this once and for all with some bare knuckle persuasion.

gg

 

[overhang]

I seem to remember Gillard and Rudd saying similar things about home insulation and the BER.

Labor could tell you black is black and you'd still argue otherwise, judge the policy not the party and stop treating the coalition like there your football team.

 

[overhang]

Actually SC, I got it in pillow talk from a lady last night who works for the NBN.

As I am a gentleman, I am unable to provide absolute proof, but I believe, as Julia has said, it is now in the Press.

You are a rotter, as a former Foreign Minister would say, and for the record I am an Australian first, then an Anarchist and Political Opportunist.

I support no party, just good politics with a smattering of graft, double dealing and mayhem.

My friendships range from the NSW Right, through the Liberals to the National Party and there are many good folk in all parties. I have never met a Green.

If I hadn't promised Joe that I would be good today I'd ask you outside to settle this once and for all with some bare knuckle persuasion.

gg

The janitor doesn't count gg

 

[bellenuit]

Absolute scaremongering at its best, the article tries to imply that it will be a prerequisite to connecting to the NBN. For most users an existing wireless N router that achieves speeds of 50-90 mbps will be sufficient. The NTU that the NBN provide emulates ADSL so you can still use your same setup until you feel the need to upgrade.

Actually, the article doesn't imply that at all, if this is the one you are referring to:

The National Electrical and Communications Association confirmed it was likely residents and some businesses would have to pay if they needed new wiring and outlets to take full advantage of the NBN.

Association chief executive James Tinslay said that once the NBN had installed fibre-optic cables, residents would still need to equip their homes with new cables and devices.

"Residents will need to consider what technology they wish to embrace when the NBN reaches their front gate, and it is very likely that many households will need to be retrofitted with new cables, wiring and outlets to access new services."

If you are talking about new services like HD internet TV, then your existing home wireless network simply won't cut it. How many homes have wireless N routers? I am building some townhouses and have been looking at what is required to make them Foxtel and NBN ready. For the latter I am using the instructions from Telstra for its fibre rollout (called Telstra Velocity) to greenfields estates, as I haven't seen any wiring guidelines from NBN. The recommendation is that you run at least two Cat 5e (or better) ethernet cables from a central hub in the house to each room that needs access. Foxtel suggests two Cat 5e and 2 coax to each room, Velocity suggests 2 Cat5e and 1 Coax to each room, but 2 coax to the "entertainment centre".

This is a link to the Telstra Velocity document.

http://www.telstra.com.au/smartcommunity/assets/cableentryforvelocity_0509.pdf

I think it highly dishonest of Labor not to discuss some of the other costs involved with the rollout. As I mentioned in a previous post, you have to look at the complete end to end solution, not just the network in between, when they start touting the services that will be available. Although Wireless N routers will simplify wiring for many customers, it may not support all of the services suggested (after all they have recently touting speeds of 1Gb/sec), and it does come at some cost. Not everyone is capable of setting up a wireless network without some assistance.

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

The janitor doesn't count gg

They do if they earn $180,000 pa.

gg

 

[So_Cynical]

Actually SC, I got it in pillow talk from a lady last night who works for the NBN.

As I am a gentleman,blah blah blah

gg

You posted a deliberate mis truth in order to further your right wing agenda, anyone with a basic understanding of English and networking could understand form the article that the 3K figure is a crock of ****....but instead of looking into it and giving some sort of realistic commentary you came here and posted with the intention of spreading fear and misinformation.

That's a cheap low act.

 

[trainspotter]

You posted a deliberate mis truth in order to further your right wing agenda, anyone with a basic understanding of English and networking could understand form the article that the 3K figure is a crock of ****....but instead of looking into it and giving some sort of realistic commentary you came here and posted with the intention of spreading fear and misinformation.

That's a cheap low act.

Got a link to the article So_Cyclical? I haven't read it yet.

 

[So_Cynical]

Got a link to the article So_Cyclical? I haven't read it yet.

lol sure you haven't...you should of got a link in your inbox, same as calliope...probably in your election spin folder.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...ds-an-extra-3000/story-fn59niix-1225908005122

----------------------------------------------------

A major Aussie ISP has connected its first School to the NBN.

Internode has connected its first school, Circular Head Christian School, to Tasmania's NBN Stage One program with a 100 megabit-per-second fibre-optic broadband service.Since Internode connected it to the NBN last month, the evangelical Christian school at Smithton has seen massive increases in its Internet access speeds. This improved performance opens up the potential for students to use videoconferencing as well as the introduction of "virtual classroom" technology.

http://www.internode.on.net/news/2010/08/192.php

 

[Julia]

Absolute scaremongering at its best, the article tries to imply that it will be a prerequisite to connecting to the NBN. For most users an existing wireless N router that achieves speeds of 50-90 mbps will be sufficient. The NTU that the NBN provide emulates ADSL so you can still use your same setup until you feel the need to upgrade.

Agree the claim is bizarre and extraordinary as once NBN is connected to the location options on distribution is endless depending on the needs the problem is most punters are not tech savvy and believe this rubbish

You posted a deliberate mis truth in order to further your right wing agenda, anyone with a basic understanding of English and networking could understand form the article that the 3K figure is a crock of ****....but instead of looking into it and giving some sort of realistic commentary you came here and posted with the intention of spreading fear and misinformation.

That's a cheap low act.

Really? Those of us who have mentioned the $3000 figure have done so from a direct quote from the CEO of the National Electronics and Communications Association.
So you are actually accusing not just us, but this person of all of the above.

Perhaps you can explain why the CEO of such an organisation would do this?

It's way out of line for you, So Cynical, to be accusing gg of deliberately posting a mistruth.
You are so besotted with your beloved Labor Party that you have zero capacity to be objective, even to the point of realistically considering a statement from what would seem absolutely to be a disinterested party.

 

[So_Cynical]

Really? Those of us who have mentioned the $3000 figure have done so from a direct quote from the CEO of the National Electronics and Communications Association.
So you are actually accusing not just us, but this person of all of the above.

Perhaps you can explain why the CEO of such an organisation would do this?

It's way out of line for you, So Cynical, to be accusing gg of deliberately posting a mistruth.
You are so besotted with your beloved Labor Party that you have zero capacity to be objective, even to the point of realistically considering a statement from what would seem absolutely to be a disinterested party.

To be truly objective you have to be honest..now the 3k figure comes from an industry nutter, as it could only be arrived at by actually re-wiring/wiring the entire house, as in fibre to every room...since the vast majority of homes have 1 phone line and perhaps 1 extension, the 3 K is a bullsh!t figure arrived at for what could only be political or personal reasons.

How many phone lines do you have Julia?...do you need fibre to every room? or would you prefer a more realistic wireless router/switch at the end of your fibre connection to your home....since the vast majority of homes would settle for a wireless router/switch with VOIP, cost today of less than $400.

-------------------------------------

GG's post was quiet deliberate in its lack of information and implication...NBN = $3000 out of your pocket...and that's a total un-truth, and he knew that when he posted it, he's not an idiot he's a Liberal!...what's needed here from a few more members is a little more objectivity and alot more realism.

 

[trainspotter]

lol sure you haven't...you should of got a link in your inbox, same as calliope...probably in your election spin folder.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...ds-an-extra-3000/story-fn59niix-1225908005122

----------------------------------------------------

A major Aussie ISP has connected its first School to the NBN.

http://www.internode.on.net/news/2010/08/192.php

Thanks So_Cyclical ... I read this from the link you provided.

Mr Tinslay said a standard retrofit could cost up to $3000.

"However, the big unknown at this stage is what the cost will be for getting fibre-optic cables from your front gate into your living room," he said.

Mr Tinslay also raised concerns about the safety of workers installing the NBN, saying there were still no training standards or cost estimates for a scheme to prepare thousands of people for dangerous work near powerlines connecting homes to the fibre-optic network

and this also ...

Mr Fletcher said if customers did not upgrade their home wiring they could use wireless technology to connect all the rooms to the network. But he said that would not deliver high-speed internet, video and telemedical services simultaneously to multiple devices throughout the home.

Sounds a bit like the Pink Batt fiasco all over again to me. Don't care about Libs or Labs on this one So_Cyclical. Care more about the uneccesary cost to the country.

But but but you reckon for $400 I can get a wireless service that will do ALL OF this.

Hmmmmm .... your story is starting to unravel there old chap.

 

[So_Cynical]

Thanks So_Cyclical ... I read this from the link you provided.

Mr Tinslay said a standard retrofit could cost up to $3000.

"However, the big unknown at this stage is what the cost will be for getting fibre-optic cables from your front gate into your living room," he said.

Mr Tinslay also raised concerns about the safety of workers installing the NBN, saying there were still no training standards or cost estimates for a scheme to prepare thousands of people for dangerous work near powerlines connecting homes to the fibre-optic network

and this also ...

Mr Fletcher said if customers did not upgrade their home wiring they could use wireless technology to connect all the rooms to the network. But he said that would not deliver high-speed internet, video and telemedical services simultaneously to multiple devices throughout the home.

Sounds a bit like the Pink Batt fiasco all over again to me. Don't care about Libs or Labs on this one So_Cyclical. Care more about the uneccesary cost to the country.

But but but you reckon for $400 I can get a wireless service that will do ALL OF this.

Hmmmmm .... your story is starting to unravel there old chap.

Tranny your story is in utter tatters, and is dependent on scare tactics, apathy and mis information.

I installed Foxtel satellite for 2 years and worked with lots of guys who used to do cable (seriously considering a return to the industry to take advantage of the NBN money)....situation is this, cost to get fibre from the pole out the front of your house to the front of your house (basic install, standard house) in real terms is about $300>$400, in reality its free because the service providers cant sell you anything if your not connected, so will connect you for nothing on a 2 year contract....as happens with Foxtel, NBN and ADSL2 NOW.

The NBN is going to replace the Telstra copper network over time, its a infrastructure monopoly providing wholesale telephony and internet to the masses....what don't you people understand about this?

As for training..and i know this will come as a bit of a shock but, when i did satellite (2000 > 2002) nothing was required, you just had to have a the balls to do it..Austar used to require a 'cable pulling' ticket of some kind, but in reality its a joke.

Fact is you put 10000 people on 100000 roofs and a certain percentage will fall off...same as 10000 people into 100000 roofs doing insulation installation, a certain percentage will get electrocuted /die of heat exhaustion etc, training will reduce the losses but wont stop them...you cant force people not to be stupid.

------------------

BoBTM will do everything fibre related for under $400 http://www.iinet.net.au/fibre/what-do-i-need.html

 

[trainspotter]

Not my story So_Cyclical ... taken from your link to The Australian article.

Like I have said previoulsy ... I WANT THE NBN .... but not YET. Put forward a business plan and some finite costings based on actual outcome based solutions and NOT a shiny bauble for the people to goo and gaa over.

Let's fix what we have first, like constant generation of electricity without blackout and power spikes blowing up my HD TV's for crying out loud. Fix the pot holes in the streets and give me a decent road system first. blah blah blah yadda yadda yadda fill in the blanks.

THEN give me a NBN on a fully costed basis with a specific roll out plan to the densley populated areas that need it. Not that hard really.

STOP all the bovine excreta about "It's gonna cost $3,000 to install into my home" ... Julia Gillard was asked this question and she deflected it like a Shao Lin monk deflects a flying knee kick.

GIVE ME SOME FACTS ... not just build it and they will connect to it !!

As for training..and i know this will come as a bit of a shock but, when i did satellite (2000 > 2002) nothing was required, you just had to have a the balls to do it..Austar used to require a 'cable pulling' ticket of some kind, but in reality its a joke.

This just scares me as it sounds EXACTLY like what happened with the insulation installation programme. DOH !

 

[bellenuit]

The NBN could very well be the deciding factor on who gets to form government. It seems all the independents like the NBN plan, because of the way it targets rural Australia.