Ignore this at your peril: The USA is going down

[Value Collector]

I find it weird that the attorney would think there needs to be racial language, slurs or innuendo to mean race was a motivating factor.

You don't have to be blatantly calling some one a N****r to have actions that are motivated by race, thats what makes the problem so sinister, it is far more subconscious than that, that people don't even realise the race aspects are motivating their behaviour.

The simple fact is that studies have shown that the Darker the skin, the more likely people (including police) are to think that a persons actions are threatening, aggressive and dangerous.

Police need to be trained to over come these bias if we have any hope to stop what is happening.

Check out this simple test, it has been repeated many times and sadly the results are always similar, Some how as a society we have negative bias to black people and positive bias to whites.

The heart breaking part is that even by the age of 5 little black children already have picked up these bias against them selves.

 

[jbocker]

Check out this simple test, it has been repeated many times and sadly the results are always similar, Some how as a society we have negative bias to black people and positive bias to whites.

The heart breaking part is that even by the age of 5 little black children already have picked up these bias against them selves.

That is horrid. I do wonder how much of an influence of being afraid of the dark (night and not well lit places). I wonder what more subtle differences might reveal, like red heads and blonds. Grey hair vs dark hair.
All the same we need to watch how we communicate in front of kids. I am mindful of the lack of aboriginal representation there is in advertising for example.

 

[aus_trader]

I bow to Kevin Rudd. He has started the healing in this country, while many others before him couldn't !

Some made lame excuses like: I didn't do it, so I don't have to apologise. I mean seriously !! Some people have to take a good look at themselves before taking the decision to enter politics. Politics is not about yourself, it's about putting the nation and it's people first. So when you say "Sorry", it's not about you are personally being sorry for all the abuse, all the stolen children and land, but it's about being sorry as a nation for all the injustices that has happened to the indigenous people of our country.

 

[PZ99]

I find it weird that the attorney would think there needs to be racial language, slurs or innuendo to mean race was a motivating factor.

You don't have to be blatantly calling some one a N****r to have actions that are motivated by race, thats what makes the problem so sinister, it is far more subconscious than that, that people don't even realise the race aspects are motivating their behaviour.

The simple fact is that studies have shown that the Darker the skin, the more likely people (including police) are to think that a persons actions are threatening, aggressive and dangerous.

Police need to be trained to over come these bias if we have any hope to stop what is happening.

Sadly - it's this way of thinking that makes the problem worse and harder to solve.

Cop arrests someone with dark skin - therefore cop is racist. It's that faulty logic driven by reverse subconscious racial bias from the masses who are brainwashed by propaganda from activists and the biased media outlets who want more bang for their buck.

Have a look at the ABC headline in post #170

"NSW Police investigate officer filmed kicking, pinning down Indigenous teen during arrest"

Why did they say he was Indigenous? Why didn't they just say:

"NSW Police investigate officer filmed kicking, pinning down teen during arrest" ????

Because the story wouldn't have been worth reporting. They want you to focus on the fact he was Indigenous, or Aboriginal, or dark skinned, or different.

And therefore that cop will now be looked upon as some racist pig. Faulty logic. And that's why these violent reactions will never end. People are far too easily brainwashed. And it's getting worse.

Ignore it at your peril

 

[aus_trader]

Regardless of whether the teen was indigenous or not, the cop did use too much unnecessary force, you said it yourself PZ99:

Gotta admit it was a decent decking

 

[PZ99]

Regardless of whether the teen was indigenous or not, the cop did use too much unnecessary force, you said it yourself PZ99:

No argument there. I just hope he gets done for just that and not the other stuff as discussed.

But the headline suggests a trial by media is likely... and that ain't right.

 

[Bill M]

"NSW Police investigate officer filmed kicking, pinning down Indigenous teen during arrest"

Why did they say he was Indigenous? Why didn't they just say:

"NSW Police investigate officer filmed kicking, pinning down teen during arrest" ????

In that particular case I did not notice the kid was Aboriginal. My wife and I watched it together and we both had the same reaction, the Officer used excessive force for no reason at all. It was reported that the kid was foul mouthing the officer, does that require aggressively walking over to a teenager and deliberately kicking his feet out from under him and making him fall flat on his face sustaining injuries and hospital admittance? Both my wife and I said no way. People have called me a f****ng idiot and much more all my life but I don't around assaulting them for it and putting them in hospital. They are doing the right thing by standing down the Officer pending an internal investigation. But the boys club will let him off without consequences, wait and see.

 

[PZ99]

@Bill M - I agree. However others will say race was a motivating factor in that case.

 

[qldfrog]

In that particular case I did not notice the kid was Aboriginal. My wife and I watched it together and we both had the same reaction, the Officer used excessive force for no reason at all. It was reported that the kid was foul mouthing the officer, does that require aggressively walking over to a teenager and deliberately kicking his feet out from under him and making him fall flat on his face sustaining injuries and hospital admittance? Both my wife and I said no way. People have called me a f****ng idiot and much more all my life but I don't around assaulting them for it and putting them in hospital. They are doing the right thing by standing down the Officer pending an internal investigation. But the boys club will let him off without consequences, wait and see.

Fully agree but using indigenous in the headline is irrelevant and mass brain washing
Cause do you often see stats like:
Aboriginal men are committing xx% of all rape, death etc in Australia..no
So one way only.race/sex/religion factor in a country is bad.it always discriminate and law should be the same
There is no reason aborigines should have any special treatment negative or positive, abstudy etc should be dismantled
A poor white trash kid: i can say that but can not say black trash in a paper... deserve as much help, or asian, arab background whatever.
We should all be citizens
I would even say that this elevation of race above behaviour is the cause of much frustration n law enforcers probably causing more knee jerk reaction.
Justice is not even handed:why would police bother arrest offenders when they are released within hours based on skin colours.
This is true in all the West.

 

[Value Collector]

Sadly - it's this way of thinking that makes the problem worse and harder to solve.

Cop arrests someone with dark skin - therefore cop is racist. It's that faulty logic driven by reverse subconscious racial bias from the masses who are brainwashed by propaganda from activists and the biased media outlets who want more bang for their buck.

Have a look at the ABC headline in post #170

"NSW Police investigate officer filmed kicking, pinning down Indigenous teen during arrest"

Why did they say he was Indigenous? Why didn't they just say:

"NSW Police investigate officer filmed kicking, pinning down teen during arrest" ????

Because the story wouldn't have been worth reporting. They want you to focus on the fact he was Indigenous, or Aboriginal, or dark skinned, or different.

And therefore that cop will now be looked upon as some racist pig. Faulty logic. And that's why these violent reactions will never end. People are far too easily brainwashed. And it's getting worse.

Ignore it at your peril

No one is saying the cops were racist for arresting George Floyd.

Where they made the mistake is completely over estimating how dangerous he was and being far to aggressive with him even as they were slowly killing him.

Do a bit of research mate, you will see study after study that under the exact same conditions research groups are more likely to pull the trigger on a black guy, more likely to convict a black guy, and more likely to give harsher sentence.

 

[PZ99]

No one is saying the cops were racist for arresting George Floyd.

You joking mate ? What is all the protesting about then ? Bad weather ?

Do a bit of research mate, you will see study after study that under the exact same conditions research groups are more likely to pull the trigger on a black guy, more likely to convict a black guy, and more likely to give harsher sentence.

Maybe they are but you can't overlay that on every single case. Attempting to do so reveals a bias in itself - hence the debate in this thread about that video. Bias or prejudism distorts the outcome of any trial and makes the problem worse.

I don't care about research group studies... research groups are frequently motivated or sponsored by third parties with ulterior motives.

 

[rederob]

Sadly - it's this way of thinking that makes the problem worse and harder to solve.

Cop arrests someone with dark skin - therefore cop is racist. It's that faulty logic driven by reverse subconscious racial bias from the masses who are brainwashed by propaganda from activists and the biased media outlets who want more bang for their buck.

Have a look at the ABC headline in post #170

"NSW Police investigate officer filmed kicking, pinning down Indigenous teen during arrest"

Why did they say he was Indigenous? Why didn't they just say:

"NSW Police investigate officer filmed kicking, pinning down teen during arrest" ????

Because the story wouldn't have been worth reporting. They want you to focus on the fact he was Indigenous, or Aboriginal, or dark skinned, or different.

And therefore that cop will now be looked upon as some racist pig. Faulty logic. And that's why these violent reactions will never end. People are far too easily brainwashed. And it's getting worse.

Ignore it at your peril

You have made "excuses" for racism into an artform.
Blacks/aboriginals get profiled - it's a fact of social science!
What you cannot explain, and have not been able to via reasoning skills, is what leads to the police acting unlawfully as they do from the outset. These are people who are supposed to be trained to uphold the law, but instead are choosing to use their badges to do the very opposite.
They have a mentality that people of colour are lesser humans, so kicking, choking or shooting them to death becomes acceptable behaviour in the USA. While in Australia it's more subtle, as we see through the number of deaths in custody.
In your mind it seems people are only racists if they use words to announce their intent, as that's the proof you accept.
In real life the proof plays out every day to people of colour, especially in the USA.
It's now 8 days on and people in the USA are still taking to the streets in tens of thousands to protest the injustice of George Floyd's murder. And despite what we all saw, of the 4 police officers involved, 3 remain to be charged.

 

[rederob]

You joking mate ? What is all the protesting about then ? Bad weather ?

He was arrested for alleged fraud - uttering a $20 note to be precise.
He was then murdered in front of our eyes.
And you think that was for a dodgy $20 note...really?

I don't care about research group studies... research groups are frequently motivated or sponsored by third parties with ulterior motives.

It is abundantly clear that you do not use data, logic or social science to guide your thinking.

 

[PZ99]

He was arrested for alleged fraud - uttering a $20 note to be precise.
He was then murdered in front of our eyes.
And you think that was for a dodgy $20 note...really?

Better take that one up with VC mate...

He says no one is saying the cops were racist for arresting George Floyd.

You have made "excuses" for racism into an artform.
Blacks/aboriginals get profiled - it's a fact of social science!
What you cannot explain, and have not been able to via reasoning skills, is what leads to the police acting unlawfully as they do from the outset. These are people who are supposed to be trained to uphold the law, but instead are choosing to use their badges to do the very opposite.
They have a mentality that people of colour are lesser humans, so kicking, choking or shooting them to death becomes acceptable behaviour in the USA. While in Australia it's more subtle, as we see through the number of deaths in custody.
In your mind it seems people are only racists if they use words to announce their intent, as that's the proof you accept.
In real life the proof plays out every day to people of colour, especially in the USA.
It's now 8 days on and people in the USA are still taking to the streets in tens of thousands to protest the injustice of George Floyd's murder. And despite what we all saw, of the 4 police officers involved, 3 remain to be charged.

It is abundantly clear that it is actually you that didn't use logic to guide your thinking exemplified by stating your totally erroneous view that racism confined to words is accepted by me as proof.

I've noticed with the vast majority of your replies on this subject you spend the first half of your post creating some invention about what I said or think and then spend the second half discrediting your own invention because I hadn't said what you frequently accuse me of saying or thinking.

You also habitually ignore the independent review of the police investigation finding there was no racism.

Until you get your head around that mate, you're merely wasting your time and mine.

 

[rederob]

It is abundantly clear that it is actually you that didn't use logic to guide your thinking exemplified by stating your totally erroneous view that racism confined to words is accepted by me as proof.

I've noticed with the vast majority of your replies on this subject you spend the first half of your post creating some invention about what I said or think and then spend the second half discrediting your own invention because I hadn't said what you frequently accuse me of saying or thinking.

You also habitually ignore the independent review of the police investigation finding there was no racism.

Until you get your head around that mate, you're merely wasting your time and mine.

I was trained in logic so I don't need to argue the toss on that score with you.
We have been over the other matter, and your claim about the independent review is plain and simple false, as per the attribution I quoted from that very review.
Until you can explain what prompts police officers to act unlawfully against people of colour more often than it would occur for whites you remain a sad apologist for unacceptable behaviours.

 

[PZ99]

I was trained in logic so I don't need to argue the toss on that score with you.
We have been over the other matter, and your claim about the independent review is plain and simple false, as per the attribution I quoted from that very review.
Until you can explain what prompts police officers to act unlawfully against people of colour more often than it would occur for whites you remain a sad apologist for unacceptable behaviours.

I suggest you get retrained then because your logic is faulty. Does it come with a warranty?
My claim about the independent review is totally correct despite your attempts to distort it to support your disconnection. I really don't care if you think I'm a sad apologist - it says more about you than it does about me. These days I can't even say G'day to an Aboriginal without the Orwellian doublethink of civil libertarians like yourself accusing me of racism.

 

[Value Collector]

You joking mate ? What is all the protesting about then ? Bad weather ?


Maybe they are but you can't overlay that on every single case. Attempting to do so reveals a bias in itself - hence the debate in this thread about that video. Bias or prejudism distorts the outcome of any trial and makes the problem worse.

I don't care about research group studies... research groups are frequently motivated or sponsored by third parties with ulterior motives.

The protesting is about the cops Murdering a guy after he was arrested.

If the cops hadn’t killed him and instead treated him with basic human respect there would be no protest.

—————-

you know I really think you are not seeing things clearly, if you can’t see what the cops did wrong on this arrest and so many others.

there is clearly racial bias in society, but it could be overcome with proper training, ignoring it does nothing

 

[Value Collector]

Better take that one up with VC mate...

He says no one is saying the cops were racist for arresting George Floyd.


.

you should be arrested for a $20 counterfeit notes, no body disagrees with that.

But you shouldn’t be choked to death.

I really don’t understand why you can’t see that.

I seriously doubt they would have treated a white dude in that way, the thing is without even realizing it there prejudices lead them to over react to the situation.

they felt he was a threat even after he had died, and continued pressing on his neck.

——————
how do you feel about the situation?

 

[sptrawler]

My personal belief is that a lot of the police agression is due to the widespread ownership of firearms.
I know a workmate was sent on a technical course to Fort Worth, he was pulled over by a highway patrol on the way obviously struggling with U.S left hand driving lol, as he went to get out of the car he said the police started screaming at him to get face down on the road.
This was in the 1980s and it scared him $hitless, but it is obvious that when the police are dealing with people that could be quite possibly armed, things dont become tense they are tense before it all starts.
Like Ive said before, dont judge the U.S with an Australian expectation, I bet more police have been killed in these riots, than rioters.

 

[PZ99]

The protesting is about the cops Murdering a guy after he was arrested.

If the cops hadn’t killed him and instead treated him with basic human respect there would be no protest.

—————-

you know I really think you are not seeing things clearly, if you can’t see what the cops did wrong on this arrest and so many others.

there is clearly racial bias in society, but it could be overcome with proper training, ignoring it does nothing

you should be arrested for a $20 counterfeit notes, no body disagrees with that.

But you shouldn’t be choked to death.

I really don’t understand why you can’t see that.

I seriously doubt they would have treated a white dude in that way, the thing is without even realizing it there prejudices lead them to over react to the situation.

they felt he was a threat even after he had died, and continued pressing on his neck.

——————

how do you feel about the situation?

VC... I don't think you should bother asking me how I feel about that situation.

If you are already going to assert that I didn’t understand what the cops did wrong with the George Floyd arrest when I haven't discussed that event then nothing I say will be satisfactory for you.

You have just taken blind prejudism to a level that is irretrievable which is kinda ironic doncha think ?

I'll talk about the George Floyd case when I'm ready.