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How do we deal with bushfires in a warming climate?

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Smurf1976 said:
I think we should at least start by abolishing the concept of a "shutdown" over the Christmas - January period. It's an antiquated concept that doesn't really fit with the modern world even without the fires so it's time for it to go.

That doesn't preclude anyone taking a break but it does mean no shutdowns and forced breaks as such, thus meaning fewer people would in practice take holidays at that time.

Logically it should have some economic benefits too with better utilisation of assets in the tourism industry and without the interruption to business in general. :2twocents
Click to expand...
Even without drought, school holidays are always a nightmare here as "kids" come in our popular swimming holes and the risk of fires is ALWAYS much much higher during that time.
This would indeed help
 
Following the science on CC .
How a climate change study from 12 years ago warned of this horror bushfire season
The Green Wattle Creek Fire in December. Source: AAP

In 2008, the Garnaut Climate Change Review said Australia would face a more dangerous fire season by 2020.

As the nation's horror bushfire season shows no sign of abating, a landmark 2008 report that warned of these looming conditions is once again in the spotlight.

Twelve years ago, economist Ross Garnaut led an independent study of the impacts of climate change on the Australian economy.

READ MORE
1x1.jpg

Canberra smoke shuts government agency responsible for emergency management
The Garnaut Climate Change Review's final report said projections of fire weather "suggest that fire seasons will start earlier, end slightly later, and generally be more intense".

"This effect increases over time, but should be directly observable by 2020."

https://www.sbs.com.au/news/how-a-c...ars-ago-warned-of-this-horror-bushfire-season
 
basilio said:
Following the science on CC .
How a climate change study from 12 years ago warned of this horror bushfire season
The Green Wattle Creek Fire in December. Source: AAP

In 2008, the Garnaut Climate Change Review said Australia would face a more dangerous fire season by 2020.

As the nation's horror bushfire season shows no sign of abating, a landmark 2008 report that warned of these looming conditions is once again in the spotlight.

Twelve years ago, economist Ross Garnaut led an independent study of the impacts of climate change on the Australian economy.

READ MORE
1x1.jpg

Canberra smoke shuts government agency responsible for emergency management
The Garnaut Climate Change Review's final report said projections of fire weather "suggest that fire seasons will start earlier, end slightly later, and generally be more intense".

"This effect increases over time, but should be directly observable by 2020."

https://www.sbs.com.au/news/how-a-c...ars-ago-warned-of-this-horror-bushfire-season
Click to expand...

In 2010, the Black Saturday bushfires royal commission recommended Victoria undertake at least 385,000 hectares of planned burning a year. Last year there were 74,000 hectares burned off. This year there were 130,000.

https://www.theage.com.au/politics/...r-hazard-reduction-burns-20200105-p53ozo.htm
 
There’s multiple factors here.

Climate change is one. Inadequate land management is another. Humans doing stupid things starting fires either intentionally or accidentally is another. Inadequate fire fighting resources is another.

The big problem, which will quite likely lead to woefully inadequate measures being implemented to prevent a recurrence, is the tendency for purely political purposes to focus on one cause and ignore the rest.

The whole thing needs to be looked at. It needs to be done independently of politics using a strictly scientific approach to determine what’s required.

Then hand the politicians a single package proposal to vote yes / no on with no ability to amend the details given they’re not even close to being experts on even one relevant factor.
 
Smurf1976 said:
There’s multiple factors here.

Climate change is one. Inadequate land management is another. Humans doing stupid things starting fires either intentionally or accidentally is another. Inadequate fire fighting resources is another.

The big problem, which will quite likely lead to woefully inadequate measures being implemented to prevent a recurrence, is the tendency for purely political purposes to focus on one cause and ignore the rest.

The whole thing needs to be looked at. It needs to be done independently of politics using a strictly scientific approach to determine what’s required.

Then hand the politicians a single package proposal to vote yes / no on with no ability to amend the details given they’re not even close to being experts on even one relevant factor.
Click to expand...

Sadly , the current government has not shown a propensity to listen to experts.
 
Apart from the usual gratuitous admonishments, couresy of Saint Great de Tongue Bark, a picture of what, looks suspiciously (to me), like, the image of a kangaroo, conveniently superimposed (presumably via image editing software) over that of a burning home, has my curiosity thoroughly piqued.

https://en.mogaznews.com/World-News...-a-swipe-at-Australias-leaders-over-the-.html

Is that photo, genuinely, that which it purports to be, or has it been, as I currently suspect, subjected to "adjustment"?
 
Some facts and figures on the effects of bushfires to date. Completely overwhelms historical fires.

QUEENSLAND
  • 30 bushfires burning in the far north, central, southeast and Central Highlands.
  • 2.5m hectares burned.
  • 48 homes confirmed destroyed.
WESTERN AUSTRALIA

  • 32 bushfires burning, in the Goldfield-Esperance region, Wheatbelt, Pilbara, Perth region and southeast.
  • 1.7 m hectares burned.
  • Three home confirmed destroyed.
TASMANIA

  • 14 bushfires burning across the state’s north, east and south.
  • More than 32,000 hectares burned.
  • Two homes confirmed destroyed.
Updated at 4.48pm AEDT


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6h ago 16:28

State by state update:

(Via AAP)

NSW

  • 20 people dead, two missing.
  • 130 bushfires burning on the South Coast, Snowy Mountains, Blue Mountains, Central Coast and Mid North Coast.
  • Almost five million hectares burned - equal to the metro areas of the five mainland state capitals.
  • 1,588 homes confirmed destroyed but number expected to rise.
VICTORIA

  • Two people dead.
  • 14 bushfires burning in Gippsland, northeast and alpine regions.
  • More than 1.2 million hectares burned.
  • More than 200 homes confirmed destroyed but number expected to rise.
SOUTH AUSTRALIA

  • Three people dead.
  • Five bushfires burning (four on the mainland, one on Kangaroo Island).
  • About 270,000 hectares burnt.
 
I thought I read the Victorian fires from several years ago caused many more deaths?
I could be wrong.

I personally don't see a problem with areas burning it will happen no matter what, the problem is when it affects residential areas or is lit by arsonists, the rest is nature.
 
I am sure you may have seen my response to the Climate denial site about 1974/75 fires.

Whilst massive, it was after a flood and over vast regions of inland Australia which went berserk post the wettest years rains early 1974. That summer late 74 into early 75 most of the NT and part of Qld and WA were burnt on a massive scale it was ... well as a direct result of rain !! And it was a grass-fire in the hottest and most remote deserts in Australia with not many residents, even less water and no serious effort was taken to put it out.

It by size was the largest ... but not at all relevant given widespread desert flooding and cities and towns that flooded in 1974.
 
Smurf1976 said:
The whole thing needs to be looked at. It needs to be done independently of politics using a strictly scientific approach to determine what’s required.
Click to expand...
You suggested response is not working in regards to climate change mitigation. All the experts are being ridiculed.
 
kahuna1 said:
I am sure you may have seen my response to the Climate denial site about 1974/75 fires.

Whilst massive, it was after a flood and over vast regions of inland Australia which went berserk post the wettest years rains early 1974. That summer late 74 into early 75 most of the NT and part of Qld and WA were burnt on a massive scale it was ... well as a direct result of rain !! And it was a grass-fire in the hottest and most remote deserts in Australia with not many residents, even less water and no serious effort was taken to put it out.

It by size was the largest ... but not at all relevant given widespread desert flooding and cities and towns that flooded in 1974.
Click to expand...
Well by your prognosis, the next one will be bigger, so get over it.
What the hell do you want?
 
sptrawler said:
I thought I read the Victorian fires from several years ago caused many more deaths?
Click to expand...
Thankfully the number of deaths is still relatively small compared to past major fires. Ideally it would be zero of course but 25 deaths thus far is considerably lower than Black Saturday (Victoria, 2009, 173 deaths), Ash Wednesday (Victoria and SA, 1983, 75 deaths) or Black Tuesday (Tasmania, 1967, 62 deaths).

Something which is also worth highlighting is that the above all have names which include the day on which they occurred. That's because they were substantially single day events in terms of the destruction which took place. All calm in the morning and no reason to think it was going to be anything other than a "normal" hot day - a fire risk but that was it, a risk. Smoke by lunchtime and all over by sunset on the same day. That was the basic pattern of all of those.

In that sense the current situation is extremely different due to the duration of it. It is not a one day event or even a one month event. It is dramatically different in duration.:2twocents
 
Out of the ashes come some outstanding acts of generosity.

Elton John has donated $1 million to the bushfire relief. Pink has donated $500,000 as has Kylie Minogue.

A Facebook fundraiser established by Australian comedian Celeste Barber has also raised more than $43 million for the New South Wales Rural Fire Service and the Brigades Donations Fund.

When the chips are down, the stars come out, if you'll pardon the mixed metaphors.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01...million-to-bushfire-relief-australia/11850248
 

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