Australian (ASX) Stock Market Forum

House prices to keep falling for years

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There isnt much if any informed comments on this thread.
Mostly "Blind Freddy" can see this or that.

So lets bring some perspective into the thread,its currently boring as hell with the un informed forming un informed opinions which they up hold with vengence.
those who have any counter opinion are labelled permabulls.

Labels are good I have one for my own property investments--Business--its what I do.

So looking at the Department of Treasury and Economics 3rd November release on House pricing throughout Australia and in particular SA (which is where Business for me is!).
Statistics from 30/09/07 to 30/09/08

House prices across Australia rose 2.8%
Leaders were Adelaide 9.7% Melbourne 8.1%
Losers were Perth - 4.1%
Sydeny - .4%
These were the only states with a negative price growth.

The Share Market had fallen 40% in the same period.

The Report from the Reserve Bank Ric Battellino on the 30Th of October raises the following.

(1) Household Income.
Over the past 5 yrs household disposable income has increased 30%.
Factors contributing to the surge.
Salary grew at around 7.5% P/A
Investments grew an average of 17% P/A.
Tax payable grew less than income because of tax cuts resulting in an increase in disposable income of around 8.3%.
Inflation grew at 2.2% P/A leaving 6.1% P/A growth in disposable income.

(2) Household Balance Sheets.
As At 30/09 The average household assets were $245,000 and Average Liabilities $150,000.

(3) The Housing Market.
The Australian housing market is leading most world markets by upto 3 yrs.(According to the Reserve Bank) as an example we peaked in 2003 and the US in 2006. The boom in Housing started in Australia well before other western countries.
Most Western countries have over supply.
Australia now has a shortage of supply.
Australian housing's boom ended due to affordability NOT over supply as in most western countries and in particular the US.
As a result buyers are now waiting for lower interest rates and or increased wages to satisfy the underying demand.

I only have this in hard copy so if anyone can take a copy and up load it to here or a link I am happy to fax it. Just private mail me.

People dont get it that its about SUPPLY.

Massive supply = falling prices.
There ARE areas like this but only pockets. The problem is that these pockets are focused on as the NORM for Australia as a whole.
Fact is its NOT the NORM.

We have a supply problem there is very little.
As prices drop marginally.
Incomes rise marginally.
Incentives are given (Grants)
Interest Rates drop (Now heavily). The buyers will be looking at Property once again.

So before making Knee Jerk comments without informed information, do a little research and stop treating people like they know bugger all---you might just learn something!!!
 
Ch 9 news tonight people a turning up at Auctions and going home again ..nothing is selling all are waiting for the prices to go down...down
 
Ch 9 news tonight people a turning up at Auctions and going home again ..nothing is selling all are waiting for the prices to go down...down


Yes seems the supply side has been a myth/fabrication/lie, absolutely no shortage anymore (except a few suburbs) ... some suburbs here on the GC have 2 years inventory I read ....

;)
 
Yes seems the supply side has been a myth/fabrication/lie, absolutely no shortage anymore (except a few suburbs) ... some suburbs here on the GC have 2 years inventory I read ....

;)

Which suburbs I have the stats for every suburb in Australia.
So fire away and we will see whats fabrication and whats fact.
 
Which suburbs I have the stats for every suburb in Australia.
So fire away and we will see whats fabrication and whats fact.
Could you have a quick look at the southern suburbs of Perth tech?

Just want to see if my observation lines up with the figures.
 
Which suburbs I have the stats for every suburb in Australia.
So fire away and we will see whats fabrication and whats fact.

can you punch up huonville tasmania please , very intrested as houses getting snapped up in this region from what i can see visually ( sold signs)

thankyou in advance
 
Which suburbs I have the stats for every suburb in Australia.
So fire away and we will see whats fabrication and whats fact.


Surfers Paradise, Southport, Upper Coomera and Labrador have the largest poperty glut in the state , over 1500 forsale signs and growing by a staggering amount every day .....

Just use re.com.au or domain and see inventory going mental nation wide ...... massive projects being cancelled everywhere .... should see the highrise developments just being scraped up here ..... carnage baby ....

I hear your going awesome though Tech and goodonya buddy !

:)
 
Could you have a quick look at the southern suburbs of Perth tech?

Just want to see if my observation lines up with the figures.

Name them I'm a South Aussi dont know your area.
Know Brentwood.---34.3% growth last year!----16.4% growth each year for last 10 yrs.

Surfers Paradise, Southport, Upper Coomera and Labrador

Surfers Growth 12 mths---2.1% Annual over 10 yrs/yr ---15.6
Southport 10.1----13.4
Upper Coomera 13.5----10.1
labrador -5.6---10.8

Labrador looks the worst Surfers could be next.Plenty of supply so you wouldnt be buying there.

Huonville.---2.2% and Annual over 10 yrs 10.1%
Id say there was plenty of supply here.

Fitzroy north 20.5% and 11.9%

And Real Estate prices have been falling for YEARS evidently!
Only see one out of this lot! Labrador.
 
Name them I'm a South Aussi dont know your area.
Know Brentwood.---34.3% growth last year!----16.4% growth each year for last 10 yrs.
The dad lives in Mt. Pleasant which is right next door.

So Mt. Pleasant would be interesting to know.

I live in Kardinya, so that, plus the neighbouring suburbs in:
Murdoch
Winthrop
North Lake
Samson
O'Connor
Willagee
Coolbellup

Would be interesting to know. Quite a big rental and specuvestor area. The house I'm in in Kardinya has doubled in 4 years.
 
So lets bring some perspective into the thread.......

........ stop treating people like they know bugger all

Hi tech, I don't mean to get off on the wrong foot here but to be honest I'd rather read the tripe posted by robots than suffer vain comments like these on a regular basis.

thankyou

Now, onto the main essence of the post ~ Fair enough, I understand how supply can affect house prices during stable economic conditions, I don't think that is a point even worth debating...

but...

if we are to enter a period of much slower economic growth with increasing unemployment (look out for Feb '09 figures) which could drag on for many quaters influencing many sectors, what will there be to underpin house prices in the short term - 6 months to a year from now?

You cannot argue supply is everything and remain blind to what the economy is doing based on the information extract provided. There was nothing in there telling us how the RBA see how a possible recession/slowdown/unemployment will effect the situation as a whole.

The RBA data is stating fact I believe, but that fact is now history ~ and past performance is no indication of future performance, as I'm sure we all agree. What's going to happen to wages / househoild disposable income when businesses really start tightening their belts?

I believe that all the fundamentals are there (tight supply, the great Aussie Dream, etc, etc...) to push prices up over the long term with a fairly quick initial rise to get the ball rolling probably. Before the ball starts rolling though and people return to the market in droves, the slowdown is inevitable and the Anglo countries that have caused all the problems in the first instance need to get through their recessions and start showing sustained signs of recovery before things start turning positive for ourselves here.

Sentiment and uncertainty in the future are what's holding property investors back in the current financial climate I believe

As stated by the RBA, the past year has only seen 2.8% increase across Australia. Why is this the case when supply is still as tight as it ever was and unemployment was for the majority still sitting at historic lows? Possibly the smart money shied away from investing altogether (both shares and property) and is sitting in lengthy term deposits with rates returning >8%? Or is it that wage growth and disposable income have been unable to keep up the same rate as property price growth so property prices are having to wait for everything else to catch up? I don't know.....

What I also don't know is what's going to continue to drive prices up in the short/medium term when all the national economic indicators are pointing in the wrong direction...

Cheers.

NB - for the record ~ I AM bullish on property in the long term, but bearish on property in the short term ~ need to give it another 2 quaters before I will reassess the situation :eek:
 
hello,

another 2mths singlefished? mr burns says 6mths, glen48 says 12mths,

we will just add that to the 3yrs and 2mths from the previous number 1 thread "house prices to stagnate for years", the king of all Property threads here at ASF

which was actually closed because it's just so embarrassing for the poverty pack,

investors will not return to the property market en masse like previous, construction is down and the ride is going to be fantastic

thankyou
robots
 
hello,

another 2mths singlefished? mr burns says 6mths, glen48 says 12mths,

we will just add that to the 3yrs and 2mths from the previous number 1 thread "house prices to stagnate for years", the king of all Property threads here at ASF

which was actually closed because it's just so embarrassing for the poverty pack,

investors will not return to the property market en masse like previous, construction is down and the ride is going to be fantastic

thankyou
robots

2months??? I'm missing something here....

I will be waiting 2 "quaters" or 6 months before reassessing my outlook on property if that's what you're interpreting????
 
hello,

no worries, thanks very much for the correction

before you know it 5yrs, 10yrs 15yrs

utopia

thankyou
robots
 
There isnt much if any informed comments on this thread.
Mostly "Blind Freddy" can see this or that.

..................................
...............................

Could I please point you to this latest paper just released by someone?

http://www.geocities.com/homes4aussies/h4a081104.pdf

It's an excellent read and have a look at the appendices too.

On the issue of being "informed", this is largely based on HOW you were informed and by whom. Do I prefer to get informed by vested interest parties or do I prefer to be informed by independent analysts using official ABS data?

Again, I already mentioned property discussion can be extremely sensitive because a lot of us have "EMOTIONALLY" invested in our own "beliefs" and that it is extremely difficult to believe anything else. Surely you can see it in your own trading style and others too?
 
Opps i must have put in a typo about 12 Mths, The fall is only just starting and has years to go maybe 5 + and then a gradual increase.
It will be exciting times for the next few years. I can see the G20 coming up with something drastic in no time because they have no time, this is growing on its self by the hour.
 
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