GTP - Great Southern Plantations

[wooduk]

I do not understand the apathy of investors,and I feel that most of the advisors have good intentions even though the scheme gives the advisors a $ incentive,but as an investor in these mis schemes this was on a long term basis and to see an investment that I have put into another gtp tree plantation growing at afantastic rate it really piss's me off. Therefore as another vote does come on then I suggest that advisors should all get together and take these clowns on . Think of it this way--- would you let these jokers walk into your home while you are eating your tea and let them take the money out of your wallet and walk out the door.
The anology may not be correct and it is emotional,but I sure you get my drift,

 

[slim pickins]

wooduk,

if they did come into my house while i am eating my tea and go for my wallet i certainly would not call 911 or 000 or whatever. i would dispense some old west justice.

gtp will get theirs for this. and the directors. the case that i am organising against them is subject to confidentiality so i cant reallly talk about it to anyone not on board yet but as i contact more investors it will generate more publicity.

I'll be in australia in first half of january, to deal with this. at the moment my hands are a little tied. but I assure everyone that this will not end in them taking our forests. I will proabably be running this case myself since i am a solicitor. unless of course our good friends at Dennis and Co. manage to grab the bull by the horns in the menatime and turn this good.

by the way if there is a law firm that would like to employ me as a solicitor to run this thing or help run this thing, or even organise and expand the class action please PM me. I'll do it for minimum wage and for the duration of the case only. i have a very good strategy for dealing with this thing. a strategy many (including GTP) may not have considered.

 

[fair go]

Vote "NO" for shares in Great Southern Plantations

When I invested in Great Southern Tress plantations schemes 2001,2002, 2003,2004 I was told the following

That the investors owned the timber

The investors received 95% of the sale price of the timber

The timber was not harvested until a tree was reached a minimum size (estimated to occur between 10 and 11 years)

We will not need to pay tax on the invested monies until the timber is sold

The forecast although not guaranteed, was published between 6.2% and 10.2% pa return

This forecasts values each $3,000 woodlot between $5,814 and $8,732

Halfway though my investment I am now told

The value is timber is now actually valued by this proposal @ 3597 shares @ 50 cents each being $1,798 (I have investments over the years of 2001, 2002 &2003)

As today’s share price is 32 cents it is now revalued my average woodlot down to $1,150.

This represents a huge penalty of somewhere between 80% and 87% of the original published returns.

If we accept this deal or worst still, if the majority accept this deal, then we all lock in a new value of around 1/6 of the original forecasts

I note KPMG agreed at a fair valuation being the share price of 50 cents compared to the valuation of the timber. Who has valued the timber at this very low dollar level and why should we accept this timber valuation?

Assuming that the timber is truly valued at this new low level then KPMG indicated the deal was ok @ 50 cents, then why would we accept a new valuation, of only 64 % of this dollar amount? (ie today share price, at approx 12 noon on 17/11/2008)

On top of all this, we will be now required, to pay tax, on average, 6 years earlier that our original investment, and for those that invested in more than one financial year then all tax years will be now be rolled into this tax year being 2008-09. Some, if not many of us, may not be retired yet, as per the original timings, so we will pay the tax at a significantly higher tax rate. We also will pay tax, without any related income in the same year.

If you though that this was not bad enough, then many of us will need sell shares to help offset the tax payable and assuming that buyers will be short supply then the share price could fall significantly from the current level. If this event occurs then it will further devalue this mess.

This take over is proposed not by a 3rd party, but by the same organisation that set up this scheme, the same people that indicated tax offsets, positive returns, a fool proof scheme since we the investors owned the timber.

I believe the original scheme was a huge rip off, based on making a select few very wealthy, at the expense of the investors. We are being asked to trust the same people again along with most, if not all, the benefits removed, from the original investors.

Of course management recommend this transition, is in their interest, but not ours.

We all need to vote NO and reject this proposal outright.

Things have got worse during December 2008

Now since I first wrote this the share price has dropped to 12 cents this make a mockery of the indicative returns suggested by the independant experts ranging from 6.2% to 10.2%. The share offer is now worth less than 10% of these indicative figures. Someone please tell me when an indicative return becomes grossly misleading. It is my belief we have well passed this point.

I clearly remember that at the road show (I went to three of them) That we were promised that the trees will not be harvested until they reach a predetermined size. This was estimated to be between 10-11 years. On the Great Southern road show, when asked this question I was informed by Cameron Rhodes That it is in the constitution that they will be harvested between 10-11 years regardless of tree size.

I would like to know why if the trees are only 2/3 of their size why were we told one thing and the constitution another?

I would like a copy of the PowerPoint slide show on the 2001-2004 tree plantation schemes, if any one has one. They were presented to thousands of potential investors and investors in all states of Australia. Their may still be some finnancial planners who have a copy?

I was never told that the accountancy firm and the financial planners received a whopping 10% of all monies invested. I was certainly never told of this by my accountancy firm

Now I am a significant investor and I have lost a lot of money and whilst that is extremely disappointing It is now my belief that The financial numbers never stacked up and rip off schemes such as this need far better scrutiny by ASIC.

If ASIC don't have the powers at present to prevent schemes such as these then, we as a community, need to make sure they have through our polititians

 

[slim pickins]

Now I am a significant investor and I have lost a lot of money and whilst that is extremely disappointing[/SIZE]

well you havent lost anything unless you have accepted the offer.

excellent post by the way.... well summed up. this whole thing is such a big deal... it appears that people simply havent grasped its significance. if this thing passes unchecked.. it will certainly create an unparalleled precident.

its the collapse of the economic system. personal property, real estate, and other ownership interests will not be worth the paper they are written on.

investment will dry up. people will invest only in gold and guns (not a bad investment in my opinion), as it will be the only personal property that will be able to be protected against corporate expropriation. australia will resemble zimbabwe. people wil be begging in the streets.

if this thing passes, i will be the first to open a company that will by popular vote create a class of owners subject to other peoples votes, and sieze those assets of people.

i'll move to the gold coast, buy the management rights of a small building then slowly enter into a pact with 75% of the owners to convert their appartments into shares of the management company. the remaining 25% will lose their apartment white the others will be directors of my company. when we have taken the remaining 25% of apartments, i will just return the original apartments to my new directors and the apartments we have stolen we can just divide amongst ourselves. easy money.

when they take me to court i will cite the case of GTP v investors and the court will just say.... you are free to go have a nice day.

GTP will be stopped!

ASIC's lack of action is distubing. i cant explain that. the governemt is labor so i dont think we can expect much from them except a budget defecit and more unemployment.

 

[wooduk]

SLIM READ THETASMANIAN TIMES AND THE MACQUARIE PRIVATE WEALTH STATEMENT VERY INTERSTING ON POLITICAL INACTION AND THA TAX ISSUES

 

[novice-5]

hi,
unsure if anyonecan help, but i have woodlots with GTP and only just recieved (29-12-08) paperwork including voting form, supp-explanatory memo, and pink form we had loan to get trees back in 2001, with small amount still owed to GTP,
when i called 1300 number on memo was told that if i voted YES i would get 3520 (noticed someone had quoted around the 4900 earlier in thread) shares per woodlot price of shares 28.45c after checking up found that they are trading at 17.5c today, i am not too happy getting pushed into this corner by GTP, i tried calling David but could not get through on the mobile number given, if anyone can offer any advise i would much appreciate it,

cheers Peter.

 

[wooduk]

just got another proxyform ,this time a yellow one and a pink one for an acceptance, plus a folded A3 gsmal supplemetary memorandum for 2003 tree lots with stevey cole on the inside.

The date of memo is the 16th. December with important dates ofadjournment for shareholders and investors.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

My brief scan indicates that you have to vote again,and that the latest document overrides any conflict from the previous explanatory notes put out in late october.

refer to 4th paragraph headed letter from gsmal independent chairman,then read the last sentence on the page tittled ,effect of this document.

 

[boeingdriver]

"My brief scan indicates that you have to vote again,and that the latest document overrides any conflict from the previous explanatory notes put out in late october."

Not so. If you read 2.6 of the Supplementary Explanatory Memorandum paragraph two.
Notwithstanding that paragraph I am going to send back the yellow proxy form voting yet again against both resolutions.

The grab for cash by Great Southern is breathtaking and audacious and is against the interests of the growers

 

[wooduk]

I read the same on hotcopper,but I am not backing down that you do not have to vote again, play it safe and vote,,,,still decoding this new doco=

 

[ptony1948]

I'm glad this thread is here. Makes interesting reading. Would have been in the dark as probably a lot of tree owners are. Initially before coming across this forum would probably have voted for abstained. Am sending my form back tomorrow voting against it. Keep up the good work.

 

[slim pickins]

ptony,

dont forget to tell eveyone you know to vote NO as well! i'm sure that this delay was designed to sow confusion into an already confusing situation. seems to have worked well for them so far.

 

[wooduk]

]



I AM VOTING NO_NO_NO AND STILL NO

THEM'S TREES IN THE AUSSIE OZARK'S AZZ MINZE:flush:

 

[Forenth]

Well isn't the Supplementary Explanatory Memorandum a load of the proverbial. 50 odd pages of more of the same rubbish.

Yes, old proxy votes stand as are, but I'm still voting no again!

Notice at the top of page 38 there are success fees mentioned of up to $3 250 000. So who are these fees paid to, I can't see who. It better not be anyone recommending this scam or that would be a conflict of interest. I wouldn't mind getting over $3 million to talk people into giving away their investments.

By the way, when did our individual contracts for investments ever come under corporations law? After all, that's what GSL say allows them to change our investment contracts to permit a majority vote. I reckon that's more of the proverbial. ASIC aren't worth their multi million $ budget.

 

[Grumpy Old Man]

Reading page 27 of Great Southern Financial Statements 30 September 2008 - appears that they are getting (even more) nervous...

 

[Paraty]

My first post on this forum - thanks for all your informed comments people.
To play it safe I also am going to send off the yellow form again voting an emphatic "NO - NO"

 

[wooduk]

Have a lookat this website
www.wotsnews.com.au/news/ Great Southern plantations

 

[remoteone]

I have also lodged a complaint with ASIC.
This is a con-job of the highest order. GS should put more resources into managing the projects rather than coming up with scams to try to save their arses.

Mines a NO vote. not because I dont want to convert to shares, but because of the grossly understated Project Value AND being forced to pay $0.50 for shares valued at around $0.17 !!!

What is ASIC doing ?
PLEASE lodge your complaint with ASIC ASAP !!!https://www.aussiestockforums.com/forums/images/smilies/banghead.gif

 

[slim pickins]

just reading their annual report. page 61 as they have numbered it.( not what the PDF document says.)

last paragraph....i quote

" he directors believe that there is a reasonable prospect of one or more of the scheme proposals, in particular the
proposals relating to 2006 and 2007 cattle projects, will be accepted and also that a number of individual offers will be
accepted. Should the scheme proposals for the cattle projects be accepted, it will provide the Group with increased
operating cash flows, it will enhance the balance sheet through the acquisition of cattle assets at fair value and it will
provide increased flexibility and capital management opportunities from the removal of the MIS project structures. If
successful the directors currently expect that one or more of the Group’s cattle properties will be sold in 2009."


hmmmmmm

so they intend to take the cattle projects and once they have them they intend to SELL the property. at a profit i presume.

wow, thats is! there they are tellign you that they are getting your cattle for peanuts. instant profit from onsellign it.

 

[Forenth]

Hey Slim,

Don't forget that they make a profit on everything from this scam. To pay for any of this they only have to add to their share registry, which must cost close to nothing in comparison to the asset. They're not actually outlaying any cash at all. When you do that then anything you acquire is profitable.

Also, why would any buyer of a cattle project pay fair value when GSL have been saying so clearly that they NEED the cash and are desperate? GSL will dump the cattle project at a bargain price and the cattle industry will know that by now.

So cattle project investors, not only do they want to give you stuff all for your recent investments but then they'll dump it when they get it.

 

[Forenth]

Here's another thought:

Since they need all the projects to vote yes just so they can survive a bit longer, and since they won't get all the projects, then...

This could well become an annual event, The Great Southern Survival (rather than revival). At the end of 2009 all remaining investors in projects from 2004 and earlier will be asked to swap for shares at a price triple the market value. Majority votes and individual offers. In 2010 it will be remaining investors in projects from 2005 and earlier, ad nauseum.

Sooner or later (more likely sooner) they'll run out of investors to fleece.