Global Warming - How Valid and Serious?

[2020hindsight]

I guess the good news is that when you hug a tree you hug a piece of carbon - so all causes benefit

btw wayne - it would appear that you and David Suzuki dont have much in common on the carbon question

 

[2020hindsight]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/01/17/2140238.htm?section=justin

2007 second-warmest year in 100 years: NASA
Posted 1 hour 14 minutes ago

Scientists at the US space agency NASA say 2007 was the second-warmest year in a century.

The scientists from the Goddard Institute for Space Studies in New York have released a computer animation to accompany their findings.

It shows sea ice cover in the Arctic at a record low.

They also predict that a record global temperature can be expected within the next three years.

 

[wayneL]

http://cbs4.com/local/cold.temperatures.record.2.622317.html

Brrrr - Man It's Cold
Click Here For Latest On Our Chilly Temperatures
MIAMI (CBS4) ― South Florida had to bundle up Thursday as temperatures dropped into the low 30s in the early morning hours.

CBS4 Weather Center said temperatures across the region tied or broke some of the coldest temperatures on record. At Tamiami Airport, the thermometer dipped to 35-degrees, the coldest temperature ever recorded at the airport.

Ft. Lauderdale, at 39-degrees, tied the record cold temperature set back in 1979. Miami, which also recorded a temperature of 39-degrees, missed its record cold mark of 35-degrees set back in 1898. Miami Beach, however, broke the record at 41-degrees; its previous record cold temperature was 42-dregrees set back in 1979.

Key West also tied their record low temperature of 45-degrees set in three previous years. The previous record low for the Southernmost City was 46-degrees set back in 1898.

The lowest temperature recorded across the was 20 degrees in Cross City, about 90 miles southeast of Tallahassee, according to the National Weather Service.

To our north, Citrus growers across the middle part of the state spent Wednesday night into Thursday morning trying to save their crops from the cold snap that brought temperatures into the 20s and teens overnight.

 

[wayneL]

"On Dec. 4, in Seoul, South Korea, the temperature was a record minus 5 degrees Celsius.

On Nov. 24, in Meacham, Ore., the low temperature was 12 degrees Fahrenheit – colder than the previous record low set in 1952.

South America this year experienced one of its coldest winters in decades. In Buenos Aires, snow fell for the first time since the year 1918. In Peru, 200 people died from the cold and thousands more became infected with respiratory diseases. Crops failed, livestock perished, and the Peruvian government declared a state of emergency.

This week, it snowed in Iraq and Saudi Arabia. "

 

[nioka]

Has anyone really tried to shop at a supermarket without using plastic bags. How do you handle a variety of fruit and veg without the readily available plastic bags. OK you say we did without them before they were invented. Fair enough but then the green grocer came to the door, (the housewife would have been at home) Then there is the meat section, even with the plastic wrap the meat will weep into the nice green enviro bags and turn them into bacteria ridden health hazzards.
Try getting a heap or loose toilet rolls next just for fun or unwraped chocolate, that would be funnier.
Of course don't forget to buy up on bin liners because you won't have those free handy "singlet" plastic bags any more.
If anyone thinks plastic carry bags are waste then just refuse or recycle them, don't deprive others of them.
I can tell you of a market stall holder who had a 50% drop in sales when his market managers banned plastic bags from the market.
I would sooner see petrol rationing introduced befor the banning of plastic bags. Think about that.

 

[wayneL]

Has anyone really tried to shop at a supermarket without using plastic bags. How do you handle a variety of fruit and veg without the readily available plastic bags. OK you say we did without them before they were invented. Fair enough but then the green grocer came to the door, (the housewife would have been at home) Then there is the meat section, even with the plastic wrap the meat will weep into the nice green enviro bags and turn them into bacteria ridden health hazzards.
Try getting a heap or loose toilet rolls next just for fun or unwraped chocolate, that would be funnier.
Of course don't forget to buy up on bin liners because you won't have those free handy "singlet" plastic bags any more.
If anyone thinks plastic carry bags are waste then just refuse or recycle them, don't deprive others of them.
I can tell you of a market stall holder who had a 50% drop in sales when his market managers banned plastic bags from the market.
I would sooner see petrol rationing introduced befor the banning of plastic bags. Think about that.

As I mentioned above, a whole district council in Devon has banned them (but obviously not individual packaging on food), and it has been an uqualified success. HM government has picked up the ball and will be implementing it UK wide in 2009.

Mrs and I have been doing the same for years. Singlet bags suck... badly. You don't need them.

 

[2020hindsight]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/01/17/2140238.htm?section=justin

NASA predicting getting hotter etc

wayne
I can tell you, if I ever do one of the tourist space trips, I'd probably go with NASA Airlines
.... rather than with SPRINGER-BALL Airlines.

PS I think the original caption was something about "ok folk, it seems we're not rocket scientists after all"

I wonder if they've ever apologised to the people who died of smoking under their encouragement. ?

 

[wayneL]

I guess the good news is that when you hug a tree you hug a piece of carbon - so all causes benefit

btw wayne - it would appear that you and David Suzuki dont have much in common on the carbon question

Suzuki is a biologist, not a climate scientist.

 

[wayneL]

wayne
I can tell you, if I ever do one of the tourist space trips, I'd probably go with NASA Airlines
.... rather than with SPRINGER-BALL Airlines.

PS I think the original caption was something about "ok folk, it seems we're not rocket scientists after all"

I wonder if they've ever apologised to the people who died of smoking under their encouragement. ?

You choose two names out of a list of hundreds to create a straw man argument. I'd say you are clasping at straws.

The AGW religion is in deep trouble m8, no way around that.

 

[2020hindsight]

wayne
where there's smoke there's fire
or should that be

where there's smoke, there's a smoker?

 

[noirua]

Yes indeed, but where there are lots and lots of worms, eating all the waste, the greener and greener becomes Hong Kong.

This may well be a bigger and valid answer to many problems. Bring on them there worms.

 

[2020hindsight]

speaking of worms
and green alternatives
(warning this may turn you green)
http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/stories/s2140383.htm

 

[roland]

There was another report this morning on Channel Nine's morning show. From memory - a new warning about Greenland melting and the oceans to rise 7 metres in 50 years. I'm more into the frsh mountain air anyway.

Here is the link: http://video.msn.com/?mkt=en-au&bra...y:ns:MSNVideo_Top_Cat:ps:10:sd:-1:ind:1:ff:8A

 

[2020hindsight]

Top post roland.
I think it's fair to say that 7m is not only "worst case scenario" but (about) 8? - 10 times what the IPCC would say ...

In the link below, they predict 600mm for A1F1 scenario (worst prediction) - (and only a fraction of that IF we get our act together bigtime!!) - eg 180 or 200mm.

BUT having said that, since that 4th IPCC report, I believe they have updated their estimates, and higher ocean level increases are likely across all scenarios

https://www.aussiestockforums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=243897&highlight=upgraded#post243897

 

[roland]

Top post roland.
I think it's fair to say that 7m is not only "worst case scenario" but (about) 5 - 10 times what the IPCC would say ...

In the link below, they predict 600mm for A1F1 scenario - (and only a fractino of that IF we get our act together bigtime!!) - eg 180 or 200mm.

BUT having said that, since that 4th IPCC report, I believe they have updated their estimates, and higher ocean level increases are likely across all scenarios

https://www.aussiestockforums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=243897&highlight=upgraded#post243897

I see the biggest problem with the ocean rise is with some of the Pacific nations that are already under threat. I can't remember the Islands, but do rememeber seeing the documentaries of their islands disappearing and the fresh water ground water being contaminated with sea water. They have nowhere to go within their own environment. The rest of us can move inland ...

 

[Wysiwyg]

BUT having said that, since that 4th IPCC report, I believe they have updated their estimates, and higher ocean level increases are likely across all scenarios

Hi 20/20, these palm fronds will get a bit wet when it happens.(below)

I saw these guys drilling ice cores in Antarctica on t.v. and they reckon there is a flowing river about two miles under the polar ice cap.Hows that.Ice cores to prove up a bit of how the planet constantly changes.

 

[roland]

Hi 20/20, these palm fronds will get a bit wet when it happens.(below)

I saw these guys drilling ice cores in Antarctica on t.v. and they reckon there is a flowing river about two miles under the polar ice cap.Hows that.Ice cores to prove up a bit of how the planet constantly changes.

well that looks a bit scary, I am just imaging all of those canal suburbs on the Gold Coast as well ...

 

[Wysiwyg]

Lol the houses ... One black one, one white one, And one with a little sh1te on

or for the younger folk ... there are pink ones, there are green ones, there are blue ones and they`res yellow ones and they`re all made out of ticky tacky and they all look just the same.

 

[2020hindsight]

wys - they'd better get all the evidence they can from those ice cores yes?
I mean - about the atmosphere, temp etc over hundreds of millenia..
before they melt and /or before coring becomes too difficult / unreliable / washed out by underground thawing

changing subject
:topic
I spent some time on Samoa in the 70's when the French were doing atomic test in Tahiti (Muraroa Atoll). They had an air-testing station on the eastern tip of the island - could detect the smallest fraction of impurities in the air.. - and btw, the air ( frequently prevailing wind) had blown across thousands of km of uninterrupted ocean -

they used to say ( probably myth) - that if a ship sailed past on the horizon, then they could detect the exhaust fumes

So ... as if they haven't been aware of the buld up of co2 ??
and as if they'd tell us if they knew.

 

[2020hindsight]

Given that the northern hemisphere is doing so lousy with this global warming responsibility ( Europe excepted)

as evidenced by the prediction that the arctic is melting much faster than the antarctic...

I suggest we build a dam/dyke right round the equator - to stop the warm currents from the north messing up the southern hemisphere.