Federal Labor Party discussion

[Bushman]

One for the KRudd apologists. From today's MMS announcement .... not that the 'Laborites' care, but the MMS share price has opened @ $7.00.

'As the industry stakeholders were not consulted on the proposed FBT changes, they have taken MMS by surprise. MMS, its employees, shareholders, customer base of not for profit charities and the public/private sector find themselves in an uncertain business, investment and service announcement.'

Typically uncle psycho style; no consultation with anyone, no common sense, no thought at all. Policy on the run with the thinking being that if you run fast enough, no-one will have time to smell the manure.

The best part of this is that with one 'fowl' swish of his presidential hands, KRudd has destroyed an industry and had a knock on effect on countless shareholders, suppliers, customers etc.

If we have three more years of these cretins, then business will stop investing. This will destroy even more jobs in the teeth of the waning mining boom.

The best thing is that this will be used to fund Krudd's 'gulag archipelago' (yes, I have deliberately quoted Solzhenitsyn) as he uses foreign aid in the region to dump refugees on our neighbours. It will cost tens of billions and, even more importantly for me, countless more human lives. He can add that to the 'pink batt' death toll of which he was the hasty architect and then let Peter Garrett take the blame.

It is Malcolm Turnbull or the donkey vote for me. I will not be a part of the destruction of the Australian economy any further. How the rusted on ALP voters can claim that this reckless yahoo even represents ALP values is beyond me. Desperate times. We need an election now ...

 

[Calliope]

+I Bushman. Manus = Gulag Archipelago. PNG is now Rudd's Siberia. How long before he will be extending the policy to political enemies?

 

[sails]

Bushman- don't forget that Turnbull is likely keep carbon pricing (whether under the banner of carbon tax or the EU controlled ETS).

If carbon tax had never been introduced, then this latest stuff-up would not have been necessary. The problem is that government have had to spend so much in compensating people for higher cost of living.

Carbon pricing under any label is clearly better avoided, IMO. For that reason I would not like to see Turnbull as leader again. His approval rating was around 14% before he was replaced with Abbott and that was largely due to carbon pricing.

And what's the point of voting because of a leader when their own party can dump them?

 

[Calliope]

You never know what stunt Rudd will pull next.

 

[sptrawler]

Funny you mention CSL and Cochlear, then in the same breath suggest Australian Governments don't foster it.
Both those companies, were spun out of CSIRO from memory.
The other problem with a small country trying to make money out of this sort of industry, is it gets bought up by overseas and moves offshore.
Which has happened with both those companies, their manufacturing and major markets are overseas. Also if they are successful their major shareholders are overseas.

Just to highlight what I was saying Sydboy, here is another high tech IT company, being bought up and heading overseas.

http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/business/a/-/wa/18140696/iss-founder-rues-foreign-sale/

If we don't start and fill the hole in the economy, that the demise of minerals will cause in 50- 100 years.
We will end up a third world nation. IMO

I haven't heard or seen any vission from Labor, at least the coalitions foodbowl plan is something.

All I've seen from Labor is waste and a pseudo mass immigration policy of low skill workers.

Meanwhile thinking we are going to compete on cutting edge technology on a regular basis, is pipedream.
Have a read on what Europe is spending its R&D money.

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/science...or_concludes_three-year_run.html?cid=34990734

http://www.adnkronos.com/AKI/English/Business/?id=1.0.2471028188

All Labor are doing is blowing money to feather their own nest.
Sorry I forgot, they are also spending mega bucks upgrading the phone system.
So people can get even better quality T.V pictures. yeh

 

[db94]

One for the KRudd apologists. From today's MMS announcement .... not that the 'Laborites' care, but the MMS share price has opened @ $7.00.

'As the industry stakeholders were not consulted on the proposed FBT changes, they have taken MMS by surprise. MMS, its employees, shareholders, customer base of not for profit charities and the public/private sector find themselves in an uncertain business, investment and service announcement.'

Typically uncle psycho style; no consultation with anyone, no common sense, no thought at all. Policy on the run with the thinking being that if you run fast enough, no-one will have time to smell the manure.

The best part of this is that with one 'fowl' swish of his presidential hands, KRudd has destroyed an industry and had a knock on effect on countless shareholders, suppliers, customers etc.

If we have three more years of these cretins, then business will stop investing. This will destroy even more jobs in the teeth of the waning mining boom.

The best thing is that this will be used to fund Krudd's 'gulag archipelago' (yes, I have deliberately quoted Solzhenitsyn) as he uses foreign aid in the region to dump refugees on our neighbours. It will cost tens of billions and, even more importantly for me, countless more human lives. He can add that to the 'pink batt' death toll of which he was the hasty architect and then let Peter Garrett take the blame.

It is Malcolm Turnbull or the donkey vote for me. I will not be a part of the destruction of the Australian economy any further. How the rusted on ALP voters can claim that this reckless yahoo even represents ALP values is beyond me. Desperate times. We need an election now ...

ths was the scariest for me! Rudd is a tornado going around destroying everything. Every shareholder will now not vote for Rudd as their stocks are now worth half of what they were, with no warning! . Cant wait to see the end of Rudd

 

[sptrawler]

Sounds like we are going to see a back flip, with two full twists, degree of difficulty 9 out of 10. Captain Chaos back at the helm, Uncle Psycho in charge.

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...for-his-promises/story-fni0cx12-1226685067511

 

[noco]

Sounds like we are going to see a back flip, with two full twists, degree of difficulty 9 out of 10. Captain Chaos back at the helm, Uncle Psycho in charge.

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...for-his-promises/story-fni0cx12-1226685067511

I would say Rudd has $h>t in his own nest and it is starting to smell to high heaven. It sure did not take long for the voters wake up to him.

What ever he touches turns to chaos.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...oneymoon-is-over/story-fnh4jt61-1226685006671

 

[Macquack]

So you are a keen "Twitter" follower, Noco?

Can you please explain what "Topsy Sentiment Score" is?

 

[Julia]

I would say Rudd has $h>t in his own nest and it is starting to smell to high heaven. It sure did not take long for the voters wake up to him.

What ever he touches turns to chaos.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...oneymoon-is-over/story-fnh4jt61-1226685006671

I'd like to see the methodology employed to produce those results.
In many of these online polls anyone can vote a thousand times if they wish.
Not saying that is what happened here, but I wouldn't put much credence on it without knowing more about the design and implementation.

 

[sptrawler]

I'd like to see the methodology employed to produce those results.
In many of these online polls anyone can vote a thousand times if they wish.
Not saying that is what happened here, but I wouldn't put much credence on it without knowing more about the design and implementation.

+1
I think it will be interesting to see what happens with the car leasing suggestion. If there's a flip, internal polling still shows problems.IMO

 

[noco]

So you are a keen "Twitter" follower, Noco?

Can you please explain what "Topsy Sentiment Score" is?

A keen "TWITTER" follower? No Macquack. I have never ever gone into Twitter.

Here is the link you can folow on "Topsy Sentiment Score".

I guess we can all be a little naive at times.

Hope it helps to educate you.

http://topsylabs.com/election/

http://about.topsy.com/company/pres...s-worlds-most-powerful-social-analytics-tool/

 

[noco]

According to Andrew Bolt, Rudds PNG solution is already in tatters with the armada of boats still continues to come unabatted.

The peolpe smugglers will flood PNG to overflowing and place the whole solution in crisis within weeks.


http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/...heraldsun/comments/rudds_pbg_deal_collapsing/

 

[bunyip]

I think Rudd has bitten off more than he can chew with his PNG asylum seeker solution.

I also really don't think Peter O'Neill knows what he has let himself in for either.

Only time will tell.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...solution-sinking/story-fn9hm1gu-1226684649444

That's for sure. O'Neil will end up as hated in PNG as Gillard and Rudd have become in Australia. The poor bastard clearly has little understanding of just what a mess he's creating for his country by agreeing to Rudd's deal.
Already his countrymen are saying they don't want the asylum seekers with their different mentality, culture and religion.
I wonder if O'Neil is aware that most of them who are granted asylum in PNG are likely to spend their lives on social welfare, as they do in Australia. I wonder is he's factored this into the future cost of running his country.
In fact an even higher percentage of them are likely to become welfare-dependent in PNG, due to that country lacking the same level of language teaching facilities, skills training programs and job opportunities that Australia has.

O'Neil has clearly been seduced by Rudd's promise to foot the bill for the asylum seekers, and no doubt give PNG a power of additional aid money as well. But he'll soon find that the cost to his own country is far in excess of what he's estimated.
Once it becomes obvious to O'Neil that the advantages to PNG will be far outweighed by the disadvantages, I expect to see him or the next PNG government running for the hills on this deal, pulling out of it or at least insisting on drastic changes.

As for Rudd, his u bute solution to the asylum seeker problem is typical of the hastily contrived, ill-considered and inaccurately costed policies that have been the hallmark of this pathetic Labor government.
Another multi-billion dollar stuff up by the most inept government in Australian history.

 

[sptrawler]

I wonder how long it would take for the demographics of PNG to change, with the influx of asylum seekers?
Port Moresby has a population of around 300,000, so if the immigrants don't intergrate and gravitate toward the capitol, which would be expected.
It wouldn't take very long before they became made an impact, be that good or bad.
Maybe PNG could do with the injection of population to promote growth, I have not read much on PNG Industrial, manufacturing or social frameworks.
They do have minerals, so it actually may be beneficial to have a supply of immigrants.

 

[sydboy007]

Bushman- don't forget that Turnbull is likely keep carbon pricing (whether under the banner of carbon tax or the EU controlled ETS).

If carbon tax had never been introduced, then this latest stuff-up would not have been necessary. The problem is that government have had to spend so much in compensating people for higher cost of living.

Carbon pricing under any label is clearly better avoided, IMO. For that reason I would not like to see Turnbull as leader again. His approval rating was around 14% before he was replaced with Abbott and that was largely due to carbon pricing.

And what's the point of voting because of a leader when their own party can dump them?

The latest CPI figures show differently. CPI is currently right in the middle of the RBA comfort zone. The 1 off increase in prices from the carbon levy (lets call it a levy since Abbotts paid parental leave scheme is a levy and not a tax) will exit the next CPI figures.

Depending on the way the AUD and oil prices go, we have a good chance to see CPI on the way down again, both of which are pretty much outside the control of the Australian Govt - unless you'd like to go back to a fixed exchange rate (Howard wasn't supportive of the move to a floating exchange rate so wouldn't surprise me if some ASF members would like to go back to the good old days)

I know most people don't place much on polls, but seems the majority in Australia don't see the carbon pricing as too big a deal these days, so I do wonder if Turnbull is on the right side of the attitudinal tide now?

 

[Julia]

That's for sure. O'Neil will end up as hated in PNG as Gillard and Rudd have become in Australia. The poor bastard clearly has little understanding of just what a mess he's creating for his country by agreeing to Rudd's deal.
Already his countrymen are saying they don't want the asylum seekers with their different mentality, culture and religion.

The gloss of the 'arrangement' seems to be wearing off already with Mr O'Neill allegedly now accusing Australia of using PNG as a dumping ground.

The other holder of hurt feelings seems to be the President of Indonesia who is upset that Mr Rudd didn't conult with him before announcing the deal with PNG.

I wonder if O'Neil is aware that most of them who are granted asylum in PNG are likely to spend their lives on social welfare, as they do in Australia. I wonder is he's factored this into the future cost of running his country.

Not his concern, Bunyip. Australia picks up all the bills - into infinity it seems.

What Mr O'Neil might like to give some serious consideration to, however, is the social unrest which would seem inevitable with thousands of Muslims all on what to native PNG people is generous welfare, when they themselves are struggling at a subsistence level. Also how a strongly Christian population is going to take to demands for halal food, tolerance of their religious demands etc.

O'Neil has clearly been seduced by Rudd's promise to foot the bill for the asylum seekers, and no doubt give PNG a power of additional aid money as well. But he'll soon find that the cost to his own country is far in excess of what he's estimated.
Once it becomes obvious to O'Neil that the advantages to PNG will be far outweighed by the disadvantages, I expect to see him or the next PNG government running for the hills on this deal, pulling out of it or at least insisting on drastic changes.

This appears to already be happening. Mr O'Neil seems to be running into some resistance amongst his fellow members of parliament.

 

[bunyip]

Not his concern, Bunyip. Australia picks up all the bills - into infinity it seems.

Yes Julia, it’s a joke isn’t it– and not a very funny one at that. If they’re not granted asylum in PNG, and they’re unwanted by another country, then they’ll be kept indefinitely in detention in PNG at Australia’s expense– Tony Bourke confirmed this himself in a TV interview just a few days ago. Just imagine the cost blowout potential of this aspect alone of Rudd’s ‘solution’.
But I wonder what the arrangement is between Australia and PNG if they’re granted asylum but are welfare dependent because they can’t or are not interested in finding work in PNG. Surely not even someone as incompetent as Rudd could be fool enough to agree to foot the bill in that situation!!

What Mr O'Neil might like to give some serious consideration to, however, is the social unrest which would seem inevitable with thousands of Muslims all on what to native PNG people is generous welfare, when they themselves are struggling at a subsistence level. Also how a strongly Christian population is going to take to demands for halal food, tolerance of their religious demands etc.

This is one of the things I was referring to in saying that the cost to PNG will end up being far in excess of what O’Neil has allowed for. Not only will there be social unrest when thousands of Muslims are dumped into a small Christian population, but the social unrest will have a considerable price tag attached to it, as countries like Spain and France and England and The Netherlands are finding out.
There are just so many aspects of this deal that will negatively impact PNG, and Julian O’Neil appears to have been blissfully ignorant of them when he signed up. He’s in for a very rude awakening.

 

[qldfrog]

not to defend Kevin but if we really send "refugees to PNG" it will not take long to see that the flow will stop really fast; and the ads the government is now funding should not be on national tv but broadcastred by BBC internationals

 

[sptrawler]

not to defend Kevin but if we really send "refugees to PNG" it will not take long to see that the flow will stop really fast; and the ads the government is now funding should not be on national tv but broadcastred by BBC internationals

Why are you so sure of that, PNG on Australian welfare, may be a reasonable outcome for many.